Ferran Soriano & Txiki Begiristain

[I'm no cynic but...]

Style brings results fine, style fails to bring results, change. Oh, and please don't protest that this is what Mansour and Khaldoon want. No, it isn't. They want the results. Otherwise they wouldn't have employed Mancini and been so troubled in sacking him. They've bought into a vision, that's fine, as I've said a lot of times I am also a fan of the Barcelona model, but if it doesn't work, eventually, we cannot persist for style's sake alone.

I'm intrigued as to how you think you know what Khaldoon and Mansour want. What we can judge them on is what's happened this summer. The club's at a very important juncture in it's evolution, both on the field and off. They've chosen to go in a direction.

Also for the record, when Hughes was sacked the club had few options because it was mid season and because good managers are normally in other jobs. This summer was the first chance they had to bring someone in from a wider pool and they've chosen to go in a certain direction. That's a good indicator as to what's important to them. Especially when having won nothing last season, they could easily have a) given Mancini carte blanche in the transfer market or b) brought in another trophy heavy manager like Benitez, Mourinho, or Capello.

We've strayed wildly from the point I was trying to make earlier - which was simply that Pep was a much bigger gamble when Txiki gave him the Barca job than Pellegrini was this summer.

I have neither the time nor the patience to trawl through your 14,000+ postings, so you'll have to remind me why you think Pellegrini wasn't as much of a gamble as Pep would have been. I ask this because Pep won everything at Barca, proved he could manage star players, was chosen for that job by our Spanish duo, and has since moved on to Bayern where he is still leading the way with that club as we have seen for ourselves at very close quarters. Unlike the manager that we finally chose, one who's record shows nothing of note on this continent.
I know that we wouldn't have been able to land Pep once Bayern approached him, but that is not why I ask the question. I want to know why you think Pep would have been a gamble, that's all.

 

[blueparrot]

Style brings results fine, style fails to bring results, change. Oh, and please don't protest that this is what Mansour and Khaldoon want. No, it isn't. They want the results. Otherwise they wouldn't have employed Mancini and been so troubled in sacking him. They've bought into a vision, that's fine, as I've said a lot of times I am also a fan of the Barcelona model, but if it doesn't work, eventually, we cannot persist for style's sake alone.

I'm intrigued as to how you think you know what Khaldoon and Mansour want. What we can judge them on is what's happened this summer. The club's at a very important juncture in it's evolution, both on the field and off. They've chosen to go in a direction.

Also for the record, when Hughes was sacked the club had few options because it was mid season and because good managers are normally in other jobs. This summer was the first chance they had to bring someone in from a wider pool and they've chosen to go in a certain direction. That's a good indicator as to what's important to them. Especially when having won nothing last season, they could easily have a) given Mancini carte blanche in the transfer market or b) brought in another trophy heavy manager like Benitez, Mourinho, or Capello.

We've strayed wildly from the point I was trying to make earlier - which was simply that Pep was a much bigger gamble when Txiki gave him the Barca job than Pellegrini was this summer.

I have neither the time nor the patience to trawl through your 14,000+ postings, so you'll have to remind me why you think Pellegrini wasn't as much of a gamble as Pep would have been. I ask this because Pep won everything at Barca, proved he could manage star players, was chosen for that job by our Spanish duo, and has since moved on to Bayern where he is still leading the way with that club as we have seen for ourselves at very close quarters. Unlike the manager that we finally chose, one who's record shows nothing of note on this continent.
I know that we wouldn't have been able to land Pep once Bayern approached him, but that is not why I ask the question. I want to know why you think Pep would have been a gamble, that's all.

He said Pelli was less of a gamble than when they appointed Pep at Barcelona. Not less of a gamble than to appoint Pep now.I think.

 

[I'm no cynic but...]

I'm intrigued as to how you think you know what Khaldoon and Mansour want. What we can judge them on is what's happened this summer. The club's at a very important juncture in it's evolution, both on the field and off. They've chosen to go in a direction.

Also for the record, when Hughes was sacked the club had few options because it was mid season and because good managers are normally in other jobs. This summer was the first chance they had to bring someone in from a wider pool and they've chosen to go in a certain direction. That's a good indicator as to what's important to them. Especially when having won nothing last season, they could easily have a) given Mancini carte blanche in the transfer market or b) brought in another trophy heavy manager like Benitez, Mourinho, or Capello.

We've strayed wildly from the point I was trying to make earlier - which was simply that Pep was a much bigger gamble when Txiki gave him the Barca job than Pellegrini was this summer.

I have neither the time nor the patience to trawl through your 14,000+ postings, so you'll have to remind me why you think Pellegrini wasn't as much of a gamble as Pep would have been. I ask this because Pep won everything at Barca, proved he could manage star players, was chosen for that job by our Spanish duo, and has since moved on to Bayern where he is still leading the way with that club as we have seen for ourselves at very close quarters. Unlike the manager that we finally chose, one who's record shows nothing of note on this continent.
I know that we wouldn't have been able to land Pep once Bayern approached him, but that is not why I ask the question. I want to know why you think Pep would have been a gamble, that's all.

He said Pelli was less of a gamble than when they appointed Pep at Barcelona. Not less of a gamble than to appoint Pep now.I think.

Oh I see now. He was referring to Pep's Barca appointment when our Spanish duo gave him the job after judging him at first hand based on his running of the B squad, unlike now where the same duo have appointed a manager from outside with no experience of the English game and with a whole lot to prove. Not that I'm suggesting it won't work out, you understand, but it's still an almighty gamble of an appointment for City.

 

[TGR]

I'm intrigued as to how you think you know what Khaldoon and Mansour want. What we can judge them on is what's happened this summer. The club's at a very important juncture in it's evolution, both on the field and off. They've chosen to go in a direction.

Also for the record, when Hughes was sacked the club had few options because it was mid season and because good managers are normally in other jobs. This summer was the first chance they had to bring someone in from a wider pool and they've chosen to go in a certain direction. That's a good indicator as to what's important to them. Especially when having won nothing last season, they could easily have a) given Mancini carte blanche in the transfer market or b) brought in another trophy heavy manager like Benitez, Mourinho, or Capello.

We've strayed wildly from the point I was trying to make earlier - which was simply that Pep was a much bigger gamble when Txiki gave him the Barca job than Pellegrini was this summer.

No, what we can judge them on is everything they've done and said to date during their lives and at five years in this football club. Everything I've seen suggests these guys want success. The route via which it is gotten is incidental. It's merely a path. If the more idealistic attacking football fails to achieve the success they think they ought to have achieved, change won't be too far away.

Ultimately its down to the trophy count. Not over one single season I agree but at the very most 2 seasons.
I don't believe we will win the title this year due to the mental fragility of the squad we have currently, the lack of real depth / quality of our current squad and the lack of basic defensive nous of MP. Therefore that leaves us only a top 4 finish and a domestic trophy (I am discounting any notion whatsover that we will win the CL). Anything less than a top 4 position would be catastrophic and changes at a number of levels would have to be seriously considered. We do have an excellent chance of a domestic trophy if we get drawn at home in the majority of big games - again if we draw a top club away from home at anytime in any competition then it could easily be curtains based on our current away form.

Our 'much sought after manager' was a gamble and a big one - lets not be mistaken on this point. No history of consistently delivering trophies at any level during his long career and no experience of the Premier League. Failure to deliver success will not be just down to him but also the DoF who chose him and very clearly has the final say in the vast majority of footballing matters at the club.

I am concerned about this season - and we will know where our season is going after the next 4 - 5 games. I fear for the worst but genuinely hope for the best.

 

[Anonymous]

No, what we can judge them on is everything they've done and said to date during their lives and at five years in this football club. Everything I've seen suggests these guys want success. The route via which it is gotten is incidental. It's merely a path. If the more idealistic attacking football fails to achieve the success they think they ought to have achieved, change won't be too far away.

If the route via which we got success was incidental then they'd have left Mancini in charge or appointed Mourinho. Spin it whichever way you want, but the manner counts. It might not count in the future if this route fails, but I would suspect the number of trophies we win this way will satiate the owners appetite for success.

 

[Skashion]

If the route via which we got success was incidental then they'd have left Mancini in charge or appointed Mourinho. Spin it whichever way you want, but the manner counts. It might not count in the future if this route fails, but I would suspect the number of trophies we win this way will satiate the owners appetite for success.

Don't think I'm the one doing the spinning here.

 

[Anonymous]

If the route via which we got success was incidental then they'd have left Mancini in charge or appointed Mourinho. Spin it whichever way you want, but the manner counts. It might not count in the future if this route fails, but I would suspect the number of trophies we win this way will satiate the owners appetite for success.

Don't think I'm the one doing the spinning here.

Of course you're not mate. It's me. You're above such things. Too clever.

 

[Skashion]

Of course you're not mate. It's me. You're above such things. Too clever.

Indeed, it is you, because your supposition is demonstrably incorrect. They've brought in the Barcelona model because it has a history of success at Barcelona and because it can handle changeovers of manager with minimal negative effect. That's why I like it. They've not brought it in in spite of recognising that it cannot be as good as Mancini or Mourinho are. Your implied claim that Mancini or Mourinho must necessarily outperform this model is factually incorrect. The Barcelona model has a better record than both of them. Indeed, it goes against everything you've been saying for the past two years about Mancini not being the right man to take us forward. You've gotten yourself in a muddle. Not for the first time this week.

Nevermind though, just attack me though, because I am a logical thinker and construct self-consistent arguments.

 

[Anonymous]

Of course you're not mate. It's me. You're above such things. Too clever.

Indeed, it is you, because your supposition is demonstrably incorrect. They've brought in the Barcelona model because it has a history of success at Barcelona and because it can handle changeovers of manager with minimal negative effect. That's why I like it. They've not brought it in in spite of recognising that it cannot be as good as Mancini or Mourinho are. Your implied claim that Mancini or Mourinho must necessarily outperform this model is factually incorrect. The Barcelona model has a better record than both of them. Indeed, it goes against everything you've been saying for the past two years about Mancini not being the right man to take us forward. You've gotten yourself in a muddle. Not for the first time this week.

Nevermind though, just attack me though, because I am a logical thinker and construct self-consistent arguments.

Like I said, too clever. I'm clearly all in a muddle whereas your logical thinking and self consistent arguments show your superior analysis and intellect. What can I say ... I'll survive. I've survived worse. From you.

 

[Skashion]

Like I said, too clever. I'm clearly all in a muddle whereas your logical thinking and self consistent arguments show your superior analysis and intellect. What can I say ... I'll survive. I've survived worse. From you.

You've already made a twat of yourself today with your window lickers comment so you're sticking with it I'm guessing. I don't know why you're attacking/mocking my intelligence. I am intelligent. I don't need you or anyone else to tell me that. I know I am. It's also not that important to me. There are a lot more important things in life than being intelligent. Give me a kind-hearted dummy over an intelligent twat any day of the week. Give me the kind-hearted dummy over the intelligent self-interested as well, Time to end this conversation though. I don't come here to get into personal arguments. By and large I look at my fellow blues with great affection and if that's not possible I'd rather leave it be. My offer never to respond to your posts is always open, just say the word.