Forget Recriminations, how do we sort this mess out?

[Damocles]

Now, let's say the prettiest girl in the world came along, who happened to also be the awesome in bed. She doesn't love you though and wants a quick one night stand before she goes off to work on her next bloke.

Would you sacrifice your pretty awesome girl who wants to be with you forever, for a bombshell that only wants a quickie?

Does she do anal? I need to know before I can answer the question properly.

Arf. Knew I shouldn't have gone with the girl analogy.

Point remains though, that I can't take the same short term view of things that others have. I want sustained success over 10 years, 20 years or even 30 years, not just a quick CL win then back to square one.

I don't see Mourinho coming here for more than a couple of season or so. Mancini's CV and age speaks for itself, and he wants to manage us long term.

 

[blueinsa]

Mancini's biggest issue and Tomie's alluded to it in an earlier post is the spectre of Mourinho hangs heavy over him and it has done since day 1 of his tenure because Mourinho was always the 1st choice for the job.

I can only speak for myself and my problem is i don't think Bobby is shit, he is an excellent manager and a guy that would eventually win us trophies and the league in this country, note i have said eventually. I don't however think he would take us to the ultimate prize of the CL, just my opinion.

I have no issue with our league position and our progress in cup competitions, i do have a problem with our style of play and if we are all honest, you can count on one hand the times we have played really well this season so far which for me is not good enough looking at the quality we have.

Bobby also hasn't done himself any favours with his insistence on not having the options of pace and width within the squad. We have become all about power and strength and whilst it blew a few sides away early doors, recently we have been found out and we have become incredibly easy to play against. Bobby knows this, we as fans see this yet because of his dealings with the squad, we now are sat with little or no options to change it and that is a major problem. We rely on moments of magic instead of great team play and it just wont win you anything playing like that over a season, now and then fine, but not over a season.

Another Jan window has passed were Bobby has either failed or he just hasn't been backed correctly and the squad deficiencies have not been addressed and with the exits, we are facing an incredibly important end to the season with an undoubted weaker squad than what we had 1st Jan when we were sat 2nd in the league and looking like real contenders, especially if we added the 2-3 names needed but it didn't happen and im puzzled and angry it didn't. This was the season to really challenge, we did the hard work, got in the top 2 and with our spending power, had the chance to push on but for me, we have missed a trick yet again and i just hope it doesn't come back to haunt us like it did last season.

Many of those criticising have no real problem with Bobby, he is a very good manager but a Mourinho he is not and if and i say if he is available and wants the job its a no brainer for me. He would push us on and deliver without a shadow of a doubt.

I don't really see the exits as having made us a weaker squad.

We lost Bridge, Santa Cruz and Adebayor in January, and brought in Dzeko.

I really don't think any fans would have wanted to see either Bridge or Santa Cruz contributing to our season any more. They are almost always injured, which means they are useless to the squad anyway - and when they did play, their contributions were pretty pitiful.

They are both on huge wages, whilst contributing nothing, therefore the opportunity to get them off our books til the summer was abolutely right to be pursued. I genuinely feel that having senior players who never get picked is not good for the atmosphere or for fostering a close-knit group, so they are better off out.

Ade is a different story. There were clearly issues there between him and Mancini which meant he wasn't going to play, therefore it was best to replace him and find him a new club which would play him. This was done in January, with Dzeko coming in, and Ade going to Madrid. Again - this hasn't made us any weaker.

I concede that our injuries to Mario and AJ have made us weaker, and they could have been addressed in January, but I just don't buy this argument that the exits in January made our squad weaker.

I would argue they've left the squad more or less the same, which may be seen as a problem when others around us have strengthened, but that's a different argument all together.

Injuries to Balo and now AJ have been a nightmare without a doubt and hasnt helped.

Ade, Bellamy and SWP, all 3 players effectively frozen out and without a doubt, all better than Jo out on the left is a fuck up of major proportions and it is that that has left us much weaker than we were.

 

[Nicholas van Whatsisface]

I don't really see the exits as having made us a weaker squad.

We lost Bridge, Santa Cruz and Adebayor in January, and brought in Dzeko.

I really don't think any fans would have wanted to see either Bridge or Santa Cruz contributing to our season any more. They are almost always injured, which means they are useless to the squad anyway - and when they did play, their contributions were pretty pitiful.

They are both on huge wages, whilst contributing nothing, therefore the opportunity to get them off our books til the summer was abolutely right to be pursued. I genuinely feel that having senior players who never get picked is not good for the atmosphere or for fostering a close-knit group, so they are better off out.

Ade is a different story. There were clearly issues there between him and Mancini which meant he wasn't going to play, therefore it was best to replace him and find him a new club which would play him. This was done in January, with Dzeko coming in, and Ade going to Madrid. Again - this hasn't made us any weaker.

I concede that our injuries to Mario and AJ have made us weaker, and they could have been addressed in January, but I just don't buy this argument that the exits in January made our squad weaker.

I would argue they've left the squad more or less the same, which may be seen as a problem when others around us have strengthened, but that's a different argument all together.

Injuries to Balo and now AJ have been a nightmare without a doubt and hasnt helped.

Ade, Bellamy and SWP, all 3 players effectively frozen out and without a doubt, all better than Jo out on the left is a fuck up of major proportions and it is that that has left us much weaker than we were.

I was going off what you were saying - that our squad had been weakened since the beginning of January by the exits. I don't think it has. Bellers left in the summer, so his situation isn't really relevant in relation to that particular point.

Ade I've addressed - he's been replaced, so I don't feel we're any worse off in that respect. SWP is still here, and I believe he will have a part to play as part of our squad. Having said that, he really hasn't been much cop since he came back to us, and is a hugely frustrting player to watch at the moment.

I think January was disappointing becuase we didn't particualrly stregthen our squad, not because we weakened it by letting players go. I was absolutely behind all three of those decisions, considering the situation the players concerned were in.

 

[jay_mcfc]

Damocles you've summed it up perfectly. What is important for City is to win titles and challenge consistently for the top honours both on the continent and at home. Mancini will do this even if it isn't this season. The money has brought about a complete lack of patience to the point where a draw away at a very tough place is looked up on as some kind of disaster.

Third and still very much part of two cups is a good position for us to be in at this stage.

 

[blueinsa]

Injuries to Balo and now AJ have been a nightmare without a doubt and hasnt helped.

Ade, Bellamy and SWP, all 3 players effectively frozen out and without a doubt, all better than Jo out on the left is a fuck up of major proportions and it is that that has left us much weaker than we were.

I was going off what you were saying - that our squad had been made weaker since the beginning of January by the exits. I don't think it has. Bellers left in the summer, so his situation isn't really relevant in relation to that particular point.

Ade I've addressed - he's been replaced, so I don't feel we're any worse off in that respect. SWP is still here, and I believe he will have a part to play as part of our squad. Having said that, he really hasn't been much cop since he came back to us, and is a hugely frustrting player to watch at the moment.

I think January was disappointing becuase we didn't particualrly stregthen our squad, not because we weakened it by letting players go.

More chance of seeing me in the blue shirt mate than seeing SWP again i think and i stand by my opinion that we are weaker, not just in terms of what certain players could offer but also in numbers.

We are still in 3 comps and with Bobby's willingness to utilise the rotation policy as much as possible, certain players will get a little less time off between now and the end of May than they otherwise might have done.

Shipping them out was not the problem, not replacing them was and the kids will not be the answer at the moment either, way too much pressure and way too much at stake.

 

[Marvin]

Without wanting to bring more abuse on Jo's shoulders, I don't think he is half as bad as people make out. I am sure he'd prefer to start up front, but I prefer him on the left than SWP. And Bellamy's is injured too often now to rely on. Pointless discussion comparing him to players who are not available, but I can't think of better alternatives to Jo as a left-sided forward. That's why he remains on the fringes of the team. And if City fans would get behind him instead of sneering at him then they'd see a much better player. Confidence is such a key part of football. He should be looking forward each week to pulling on that blue shirt at Eastlands and getting a touch on the ball, but like many City players before him I think he tries his best, but knows he's surrounded by doubters.

 

[blueinsa]

Damocles you've summed it up perfectly. What is important for City is to win titles and challenge consistently for the top honours both on the continent and at home. Mancini will do this even if it isn't this season. The money has brought about a complete lack of patience to the point where a draw away at a very tough place is looked up on as some kind of disaster.

Third and still very much part of two cups is a good position for us to be in at this stage.

Thats a reasonable stance to take mate but let me ask you this, lets say it takes 3/4/5 years for Bobby to win the league? Great we all say, lets face it, we would have bitten somebodies hand off if offered that a few years ago but lets also look at our club as a business, one that just has to start making serious money almost immediately if we are to really start eating at the top table of football for years to come.

That sort of cash will only come from winning nearly everything out there and fast.

FFPR as ensured that a 10 year plan and the patience needed has gone out of the window and it has to be speeded up, hence the huge spend and incredible amount of players in in the last 2 seasons.

Time just will not wait no matter how much we want it to.

 

[Lancet Fluke]

Does she do anal? I need to know before I can answer the question properly.

Arf. Knew I shouldn't have gone with the girl analogy.

Point remains though, that I can't take the same short term view of things that others have. I want sustained success over 10 years, 20 years or even 30 years, not just a quick CL win then back to square one.

I don't see Mourinho coming here for more than a couple of season or so. Mancini's CV and age speaks for itself, and he wants to manage us long term.

Sorry, I have a mental age of 12. Mourinho would be a good appointment if Mancini fails, as we will then be in need of a quick fix and he may be able to provide that, albeit probably fleetingly. I am in no rush to get rid of Mancini though, I think he is doing a decent job overall and as long as he finishes in the top 4, then he's fine.

 

[persvenality cult]

how do we sort this mess out?

win home games v against wba, fulham, wigan, notts county, aris

get a result v utd & chelsea

 

[Nicholas van Whatsisface]

I was going off what you were saying - that our squad had been made weaker since the beginning of January by the exits. I don't think it has. Bellers left in the summer, so his situation isn't really relevant in relation to that particular point.

Ade I've addressed - he's been replaced, so I don't feel we're any worse off in that respect. SWP is still here, and I believe he will have a part to play as part of our squad. Having said that, he really hasn't been much cop since he came back to us, and is a hugely frustrting player to watch at the moment.

I think January was disappointing becuase we didn't particualrly stregthen our squad, not because we weakened it by letting players go.

More chance of seeing me in the blue shirt mate than seeing SWP again i think and i stand by my opinion that we are weaker, not just in terms of what certain players could offer but also in numbers.

We are still in 3 comps and with Bobby's willingness to utilise the rotation policy as much as possible, certain players will get a little less time off between now and the end of May than they otherwise might have done.

Shipping them out was not the problem, not replacing them was and the kids will not be the answer at the moment either, way too much pressure and way too much at stake.

I think we actually agree with eachother. Getting rid of the players was not a problem, nor was it a bad decision, and it has not made us weaker. It has left us almost exactly the same in terms of players who genuinely have a contribution to make on the pitch - rather than just occasionally sitting on the bench, and being paid £100k a week for the privilege.

The problem was in not strengthening the team to give us more options of a better quality than those we had in the first half of the season. Although there is only really Chelsea who have strengthened for the immendiate future out of the top 6 sides.

Arsenal and the Rags bought no-one in January.

Tottenham signed Pienaar, who is a decent player, but nowt special. Certainly not worth suddenly getting concerned about.

Liverpool replaced Torres with Suarez. It will be a couple of months before they can play Carroll due to him getting pissed up and falling off a barstool.

So Chelsea are the ones who really pushed on in January with Torres and Luiz, and this will probably see them overtake us.

This is the problem for me. We could have strengthened to push on as Chelsea did, but we've actually just stayed the same. This was a missed opportunity.