George Floyd murder / Derek Chauvin guilty of murder

[DrBlueBob]

Again, I'll repeat It's not THE issue. And this is not to suggest her being killed wasn't horrific or tragic. It was. But the discussion wasn't about whether she was killed. Everyone is Crystal clear on that. The discussion was about what the legal and policy ramifications ought to be for her tragic death. That was THE issue.

By the way saying her death is not THE issue does not suggest I have any less sympathy for her, or her family. I have as much sympathy as anyone else and recognize the tragedy. But THE issue here was "what ought to be the legal consequence of the events of that night." Let me use an analogy to illuminate:

Suppose she was sleeping in bed and officers ran up in her house and started firing and kill her as she slept in her bed. They would likely be charged and convicted of 2nd degree murder or Manslaughter at a minimum. If on the other hand she was standing next to someone who had fired at cops first and she got killed in the return fire. That takes Murder off the table.

Again, as is obvious from the above hypothetical she was killed horrifically in both scenarios, yet the legal ramifications are different. Thus the issue isn't whether she was killed horrifically, but rather when, where, why, and how?

I mean, this whole discussion restarted NOT because someone thought of Breonna's death and said, 'Oh Gosh, that was really horrific. We should discuss it." No. The discussion restarted because no one was charged for her death and some wondered why. So THE issue here is why didn't the Prosecutors charge anyone for her death.

To answer the above question, one would have to be clear on what the facts are. And it serves us all better if no one obfuscates with shorthands like Bakari Sellers did on that video above.

Those who pretend zeroing in on the key issue is somehow a show of lack of empathy are misguided at best and at worst being disingenuous.

.

I have to say Dax, that is possibly one of your finest posts and your clarification or perhaps re-explanation of where you are coming from is appreciated.

I think that I took the post to which I responded out of context. There are a lot of busy threads and a lot of emotion invested in them. In your post, you used the term "an issue" in a way that I took to be dismissive of the fairly major fact of Breonna's demise or more of a sidebar to the fact that she wasn't actually asleep.

Thanks.

 

[Decc66]

And about your STUPID dumb fuck question about Taylor and Glover, are you now saying she deserved to die by association...??

The correct answer is yes she would be alive.

 

[BobKowalski]

I have to say Dax, that is possibly one of your finest posts and your clarification or perhaps re-explanation of where you are coming from is appreciated.

I think that I took the post to which I responded out of context. There are a lot of busy threads and a lot of emotion invested in them. In your post, you used the term "an issue" in a way that I took to be dismissive of the fairly major fact of Breonna's demise or more of a sidebar to the fact that she wasn't actually asleep.

Thanks.

Thats because it was.

Just as some posters are (rightly) exercised by the shooting of Breonna Taylor, others will spend an inordinate amount of time and effort removing the emotion from the slaying, endlessly focus on small details in their search for the ‘facts’, tell you at length (and I mean bang on forever) why your impression of what they say is far from the truth and of course they are ‘appalled’ by this shooting, but if we could just look at some tiny details here and there or talk about her character or who she knew or that she had coffee a week before and in the same vicinity some bad dude was getting his hair done or blah, blah, fucking blah and before you know you are chasing shadows down a fucking rabbit hole.

 

[DrBlueBob]

Thats because it was.

Just as some posters are (rightly) exercised by the shooting of Breonna Taylor, others will spend an inordinate amount of time and effort removing the emotion from the slaying, endlessly focus on small details in their search for the ‘facts’, tell you at length (and I mean bang on forever) why your impression of what they say is far from the truth and of course they are ‘appalled’ by this shooting, but if we could just look at some tiny details here and there or talk about her character or who she knew or that she had coffee a week before and in the same vicinity some bad dude was getting his hair done or blah, blah, fucking blah and before you know you are chasing shadows down a fucking rabbit hole.

You could be (are probably) right Bob but I after reading the response that @Dax777 gave to me I felt that my initial post had possibly jumped the gun (so to speak). There is enough vitriol flying around these threads without me adding to it. I also feel it only fair to take him at his word regarding his feelings towards her death.

 

[BobKowalski]

You could be (are probably) right Bob but I after reading the response that @Dax777 gave to me I felt that my initial post had possibly jumped the gun (so to speak). There is enough vitriol flying around these threads without me adding to it. I also feel it only fair to take him at his word regarding his feelings towards her death.

Fair enough.

 

[Bigga]

The correct answer is yes she would be alive.

I think I've found you and why you have issues...

 

[Decc66]

I think I've found you and why you have issues...

I win.

 

[SebastianBlue]

For those interested, a 2020 US Elections thread has been created.

2020 US Elections

This is a thread for general discussions related to the upcoming 2020 Elections in the United States.

This includes presidential, congressional, state, county, and municipal elections, along with the overlap between them and the general debate about social/political/technical/economic influences on them and possible outcomes.

It is a catch all for topics that span multiple factors so may not be appropriate for discussion in other more focused threads (i.e. a situation that involves Trump, Biden, *and* the Supreme Court, where meaningful discussion requires analysis of all three in the context of the elections, and so should happen here rather than their individual threads).

 

[Dax777]

[

I have to say Dax, that is possibly one of your finest posts and your clarification or perhaps re-explanation of where you are coming from is appreciated.

I think that I took the post to which I responded out of context. There are a lot of busy threads and a lot of emotion invested in them. In your post, you used the term "an issue" in a way that I took to be dismissive of the fairly major fact of Breonna's demise or more of a sidebar to the fact that she wasn't actually asleep.

Thanks.

I genuinely appreciate your honesty and demeanor in this discussion. This is 2ice now in 2 (or so days) that I've been surprised by a response.

I went back and read my original post and the way you interpreted it was actually fair. My writing there was poor and didn't clearly express the point I was attempting to make. And that is on me. I appreciate the charitable nature in which you've allowed clarification of what I was in fact attempting to express.

 

[DrBlueBob]

[

I genuinely appreciate your honesty and demeanor in this discussion. This is 2ice now in 2 (or so days) that I've been surprised by a response.

I went back and read my original post and the way you interpreted it was actually fair. My writing there was poor and didn't clearly express the point I was attempting to make. And that is on me. I appreciate the charitable nature in which you've allowed clarification of what I was in fact attempting to express.

Understood and cheers.