Good luck to her. It must have been an utterly terrifying experience and I can't imagine what she or her parents felt.
Girl cryogenically frozen
- Thread starter Ric
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Good luck to her. It must have been an utterly terrifying experience and I can't imagine what she or her parents felt.
Not want to start a religious/spiritual debate, but if, as a lot of people believe, religious and non-religious, if she died what happened to her soul/ spirit? If, in the future, they could revive her would her soul/spirit come back? Just a thought x
SWP's back
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Yeah I don't think that will be an issue personally.
andyhinch
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I'd turn it into a religious debate if I were you, they always end well on here ;-)
Gelsons Dad
Well-Known Member
hahaha and we will all have flying cars !
I think the "current" commercial freezing methods offered are a sham. With companies basically only offering hope to those in a desperate and dire situation.
The brain is such a delicate thing, that even minor changes physically as well as chemically can have massive effects on someone's personality. And that is to somebody who is technically fit and well. It is my belief that most people "currently" frozen have zero chance of being revived, especially in respect of being the person they were at death.
I think the only good thing happening, is that at least some data will come out of it for superior methods of doing it properly in the future.
I think the main problem in any future revival will entirely depend on the method and timings that the body is frozen at the moment.
As most medical people will know, anybody suffering from Cardiac arrest will only have a certain time before oxygen starvation starts to damage the brain.
As already understood, once brain damage has occurred, certain memories and that persons personality will be gone. To what degree depends on the length of starvation.
So while the person may recover bodily, the brain may not. Even with massively advance technologies in the future that can revive people and fix the brain to a functioning state, the hard bit will be restoring the person or personality (ie their data). If that "data" has gone through oxygen starvation before freezing, people in the future will have nothing to go on how to fix or restore it.
Waiting for somebody to clinically die, ie heartbeat to stop, may have already caused massive damage to the brain. I believe brain activity carries on for some time after cardiac arrest, so actual brain death will occur some time after. Time is the factor and what can be done to stop oxygen starvation and damaging ice forming during freezing.
So the best method would be to induce a coma before death, introduce chemicals to the bloodstream to prevent ice forming and oxygen starvation. Then lower the body temperature as best as possible to help with both.
I believe current laws do not allow this, as it would be considered either assisted suicide or even murder. If we are to carry on with this, then the law needs to change to allow it to be done properly to give these people a chance in the future.
I would love to see the future, who wouldn't? But i believe people should except that death is a part of life and make the most of any time offered. We could end up with entire families deciding to freeze themselves if one falls ill (to await a future cure). This is complete madness, and we are indulging the weak/rich who cannot face death. We could end up with future generations all opting to freeze themselves awaiting advances in technologies that will cure or extend their lives.
Maybe one "out of the box" idea would be to use "speed" to allow people to await the future. It has been proven that the faster you travel relative to another location, time slows for you. So if we could shoot somebody into space, and get them to travel fast enough. Then time here would pass faster in relation to them. If we somehow did it in a giant orbit that would bring them back in two hundred years for example, then it is possible they could have only experienced hours/days. I'm sure a resident "expert" on here could work out the maths to estimate the speed/distance needed etc!
The brain is such a delicate thing, that even minor changes physically as well as chemically can have massive effects on someone's personality. And that is to somebody who is technically fit and well. It is my belief that most people "currently" frozen have zero chance of being revived, especially in respect of being the person they were at death.
I think the only good thing happening, is that at least some data will come out of it for superior methods of doing it properly in the future.
I think the main problem in any future revival will entirely depend on the method and timings that the body is frozen at the moment.
As most medical people will know, anybody suffering from Cardiac arrest will only have a certain time before oxygen starvation starts to damage the brain.
As already understood, once brain damage has occurred, certain memories and that persons personality will be gone. To what degree depends on the length of starvation.
So while the person may recover bodily, the brain may not. Even with massively advance technologies in the future that can revive people and fix the brain to a functioning state, the hard bit will be restoring the person or personality (ie their data). If that "data" has gone through oxygen starvation before freezing, people in the future will have nothing to go on how to fix or restore it.
Waiting for somebody to clinically die, ie heartbeat to stop, may have already caused massive damage to the brain. I believe brain activity carries on for some time after cardiac arrest, so actual brain death will occur some time after. Time is the factor and what can be done to stop oxygen starvation and damaging ice forming during freezing.
So the best method would be to induce a coma before death, introduce chemicals to the bloodstream to prevent ice forming and oxygen starvation. Then lower the body temperature as best as possible to help with both.
I believe current laws do not allow this, as it would be considered either assisted suicide or even murder. If we are to carry on with this, then the law needs to change to allow it to be done properly to give these people a chance in the future.
I would love to see the future, who wouldn't? But i believe people should except that death is a part of life and make the most of any time offered. We could end up with entire families deciding to freeze themselves if one falls ill (to await a future cure). This is complete madness, and we are indulging the weak/rich who cannot face death. We could end up with future generations all opting to freeze themselves awaiting advances in technologies that will cure or extend their lives.
Maybe one "out of the box" idea would be to use "speed" to allow people to await the future. It has been proven that the faster you travel relative to another location, time slows for you. So if we could shoot somebody into space, and get them to travel fast enough. Then time here would pass faster in relation to them. If we somehow did it in a giant orbit that would bring them back in two hundred years for example, then it is possible they could have only experienced hours/days. I'm sure a resident "expert" on here could work out the maths to estimate the speed/distance needed etc!
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blueish swede
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I was quite angry when I read this in the Grauniad. This "voluntary group of cryonics enthusiasts" or "f@*king wierdos" as they are called in common parlance have preyed on a child and her family in a desperate situation to futher their own ridiculous agenda. They should whipped through the streets .
Why would people living in a utopia in 500 years time be interested in reviving dead sick people? Dead people who potentially carry diseases that have been eradicated for several generations and from which the living population has a reduced immunity? So they can be wiped out by measles like the South Americans when the Spanish came?
*The corollary of your own prediction is that these cryonic companies will have gone bankrupt by the time these cures are available. As more and more cures are found there will be fewer and fewer people choosing to be frozen. Which equates to less income for the cryonic companies, failure to pay the bills and the whole piramid scheme collapses.
**We have the tech to cure hunger today, but it still exists. It's political will that feeds hunger and, should everything else actiually be realised, it will be political will that prevents the resuscitation of this poor girl.
Why would people living in a utopia in 500 years time be interested in reviving dead sick people? Dead people who potentially carry diseases that have been eradicated for several generations and from which the living population has a reduced immunity? So they can be wiped out by measles like the South Americans when the Spanish came?
*The corollary of your own prediction is that these cryonic companies will have gone bankrupt by the time these cures are available. As more and more cures are found there will be fewer and fewer people choosing to be frozen. Which equates to less income for the cryonic companies, failure to pay the bills and the whole piramid scheme collapses.
**We have the tech to cure hunger today, but it still exists. It's political will that feeds hunger and, should everything else actiually be realised, it will be political will that prevents the resuscitation of this poor girl.
talkativesprout
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The Silver Surfer
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Good question for all the believers.
Dunno, what happened to Jesus when his dad woke him up? Was his brain turned to mush? Was he a zombie? Was he able to form coherent sentences? Did his dad look after his soul while he paraded his body about like a puppet to prove how awesome he is?
The only account of bringing someone back to life and billions believe it even though it was written hundreds of years ago in a book full of other fanciful tales no more extraordinary than a Marvel comic book.
Yet along comes science and, nooooo that can't be done.
They believed the earth was flat. They said we couldn't go to the moon. They said the planet would only need 3 computers.
Its only a matter of time before "death" has a line through it as well.
BlueHammer85
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It was her wish