Is now the time to consider Mancini's tenure at the club

[@BluePhil8]

It's absolutely insulting to our owner and Khaldoon to suggest Mancini takes the credit for the progress which this club had made in four seasons.

I wonder what his Highness thinks when he now sees people jumping to Mancini's defence, how he has earned the right to remain in the job.

Sheikh Mansour and Khaldoon have earned the right to call the shots as they see fit.

The correlation between our trophies in down to one man. They backed Mancini to the hilt in the market, and appointed him, knowing he could take us to the nest level.

There is a lack of conviction and motivation in our team, and that only comes from a manager who can man-manage all players.

It's Mancini's biggest fault and it will cost him his job one day.

All this talk about a closeness of a relationship between Khaldoon and Mancini will count for zero.

Khaldoon used to have dinner with Hughes and his wife at his home all the time, didn't stop him recognising the time to move on.

Like it or not he takes Mancini will take his fair share of the credit

Of course he does, but the wider argument was that it should not make him bullet proof for another season at least.

Only our owner deserves to make that call after everything he has done.

I sincerely doubt he is now thinking about last season.

You can't be sentimental in football.

No one should care about what he has won, it should be about what we want to win next.

As fans we need to show more hunger rather than this "well i'm just happy to be here because 10 years ago blah blah blah" nonsense.

 

[bluesimon]

Mancini tactics are to keep spending money and not to come up with a plan B or alternative system.

The team hasn't been found out, Mancini has.

ENTIRELY TRUE. Mancini is a quality manager, but with the starting point and money he was given, 20/30 other managers would have achieved what he did. But his proven track record is that he cannot take it further than that and there is also clear evidence that others can (look what Maurinio did with the same squad at Inter that he inherited from Mancini)

 

[BoyBlue_1985]

Spot on phil the 10 years argument is like a cancer that needs to be removed from some fans mentality

 

[Damanino]

CL fiasco will cost his job just like at Inter.

He had an absolute fantastic chance to correct his mistakes he did at Inter he got another team bankrolled by very rich owners and he is coming short in CL again.

Hard CL groups simply not excuses anymore. They will be very hard next 2-3 years too because of our failings in EL/CL in last seasons.

With a good CL run this season even second place in the league would be OK maybe.

With this horrible CL fiasco (3 points in 6 matches) and we didnt even qualify for EL because that would be a disadvantage for us.
Ohh yeah luckily we have that advantage now we are not in Europe. It makes rotation harder of course this is here Mancini man-management comes in, how can he keep his players hungry and motivated even the bench players.
With treatments like Lescott and Sinclair, Balo is getting?


What kind of embarassing thing would be finish behing United and Chelsea they are still both in Europe and Chelsea probably will beat Sparta Prague so another two matches are waiting for them in EL.

He has to compensate in the league once again for his failures in CL, he doesnt learn from this.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

If you want to start a thread about the relative merits of England managers then by all means do so but it's distracting from the topic of this particular thread.

PB, you know how things can work at football clubs.

I don't even think it's down to Khaldoon, sure, he has a big say, but I believe Abu Dhabi were getting extremely tired of playing piggy in the middle between Mancini and Marwood.

Marwood gets a bad rap, but he carried out the owners' wishes to the letter.

I'm sure the appointments of Soriano and Cheeky ticked a number of boxes, including acting as a buffer between manager and Abu Dhabi.

Trusting to football men to reach their own conclusions. I don't subscribe to the theory it was just with a view to being an ace for Pep.

I agree. For me, the interesting thing is that TB is "Director of Football" or "Sporting Director" whereas Marwood was "Football Administrator". I suspect it's been made clear to Mancini that he works through Soriano and Begiristain and doesn't bother Abu Dhabi quite so much. Both are perfectly qualified to do their jobs and it's part of the owner's philosophy of building a culture that will last, rather than being dependent on indviduals.

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

I've always felt conviction comes from trust and respect, that someone has complete faith in what path they are on.

I suppose that's what separates the truly great manager and players, the ability to make them greater than the sum of their parts.

 

[Deleted member 52846]

Like it or not he takes Mancini will take his fair share of the credit

Of course he does, but the wider argument was that it should not make him bullet proof for another season at least.

Only our owner deserves to make that call after everything he has done.

I sincerely doubt he is now thinking about last season.

You can't be sentimental in football.

No one should care about what he has won, it should be about what we want to win next.

As fans we need to show more hunger rather than this "well i'm just happy to be here because 10 years ago blah blah blah" nonsense.

(I do agree with that last line. I don't like the "but thirteen years ago we were in the third division" stuff).

He has faults and we will have seasons where we win nothing, but I think we will continue to win trophies with Mancini.

If that's not this season, it doesn't particularly matter, it won't be the last season where we win nowt no matter who is our manager. We can just dust ourselves down and go again the next season.

If he doesn't bounce back from a trophyless season with a trophy then I'd bring this topic up, but not after only looking like we might not win anything this season (even though we still very may will).

 

[chesterbells]

It's absolutely insulting to our owner and Khaldoon to suggest Mancini takes the credit for the progress which this club had made in four seasons.

Of course he should take some credit for the progress which the club has made. As should the people in charge, as should the players.

I wonder what his Highness thinks when he now sees people jumping to Mancini's defence, how he has earned the right to remain in the job.

Sheikh Mansour and Khaldoon have earned the right to call the shots as they see fit.

The correlation between our trophies in down to one man. They backed Mancini to the hilt in the market, and appointed him, knowing he could take us to the nest level.

They've absolutely earned the right to call the shots in regard to the manager. Currently their position is that Mancini is the right man for the club.

There is a lack of conviction and motivation in our team, and that only comes from a manager who can man-manage all players.

No it doesn't. The manager can play a role, but if players aren't performing with conviction I'd question them as well.

But what would that look like in reality, "questioning" the players? The motivation and management of the players is the most important part of the managers job; it is the managers responsibility - that's how the organisation works, that's what he gets paid for. It's far more important than anything else.
So are you saying the owners should be summoning players to the Middle East for questioning?
To repeat myself, it's what they pay Mancini for.<br /><br />-- Thu Dec 27, 2012 1:07 pm --<br /><br />

Spot on phil the 10 years argument is like a cancer that needs to be removed from some fans mentality

So so true.

"But were you at York ?....."

 

[moomba]

But what would that look like in reality, "questioning" the players? The motivation and management of the players is the most important part of the managers job; it is the managers responsibility - that's how the organisation works, that's what he gets paid for. It's far more important than anything else.
So are you saying the owners should be summoning players to the Middle East for questioning?
To repeat myself, it's what they pay Mancini for.

It seems that when things go well it's all down to the players, when they don't it's all down to the manager.

I look at Chelsea. Players that under-perform at various times of the year, get rid of a manager and the players remain unaccountable ready to under-perform next year. Sure they won a cup last year, but it's the wrong way to run a football club IMO.

Mancini will be held accountable by results, but players have to take responsibility for their performances as well. Otherwise they've got a ready made excuse next time their personal standards slip below what is expected of them.

-- Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:09 pm --

Spot on phil the 10 years argument is like a cancer that needs to be removed from some fans mentality

It's a mentality that has fuck all impact on the club.<br /><br />-- Thu Dec 27, 2012 2:11 pm --<br /><br />

I've always felt conviction comes from trust and respect, that someone has complete faith in what path they are on.

I suppose that's what separates the truly great manager and players, the ability to make them greater than the sum of their parts.

Being able to motivate yourself, and having pride and professionalism in your own performances is also what separates good from great players.

 

[bluesimon]

Those that want to kick Mancini out so soon for being currently second in the league, take a trip to old trafford and stare at the place the banner used to be. Thanks to Mancini we have two trophies, instead of the fuck all for the preceeding decades. No team can win everything all the time, it's how we react to defeat that will define us. We will come back stronger, prepared to rip the league a new one but it takes time and astute transfers for that too happen (and it will happen, we are too rich for it not too).

Mancini deserves this season even if we win nothing. You would think City fans would know about patience but apparently too many of us have been spoilt. Like children who want everything now, the second things look hard you want to throw the man who gave us so much out.

Start to ask questions if we look bad next year, not next game.

I can't believe as a fan of this club for only 5 years I have to tell those who watched the team in division two to have some faith. How did you have it then if you can't find it now?

Great post.
I've seen some right shite in charge of City and Mancini is not one of them. 2 in 3 times his subs actually have an impact - which is pretty good for a manager.
These days, far too many City fans think football management is just like FIFA 13. It isn't.
Compare and contrast with Sour Alex at Old Trafford. He spent more than the any of the other managers in the league in each year and yet won bugger all till the FA Cup in his 4th season, the Cup winners cup in his 5th season and the league in his SEVENTH season.

Mancini has won us two major honours. The last (the league) gives him 2 more seasons at least for me.

Sorry, but you guys do not see what is going on here. As has been stated numerous times in loads of posts, with the starting point and money that Mancini was given, there are many other managers, 20+ that would have achieved what he has done - and there are loads of examples of that in the past - throw enough money at the problem and you will get some tangeable results. The point is this - Mancini has reached his pinnicle - his mass - the top of his abilities. He has little man-to-man emotional strength and the clear evidence is that desipte constant reminders as to his areas of inability, he decided to keep on throwing the same attitude and beligerant options to his faults, rather than taking stock and seeing how he could improve.

One of the underlying facts is that he now appears to have more bogey teams than anyone else for a team so high in the premiership - especially away - Stoke, Sunderland, Everton, Liverpool, Chelsea, Arsenal (the league cup win should not count) etc. The opposing managers have worked him and his tactics out - as well as at many of our home games.

His contradictions are catastrophic. From all the reports I read on this forum from the training ground, he is obsessed with possession and trying to stich a way through the defense for tap ins and the perfect goals. All well and good and fine when it works. But since the middle of last season, opposition teams know this and they barracade their defences, leaving us no room to glide and move. BUT THEN, he comes out with a statement after the Sunderland game stating that "Sometimes we take too many touches and we think, 'never mind, we can score next time,' but we can’t be like that - in football, it doesn’t work like that. We have to be stronger in the penalty area". That is about a two faced statement as I have ever witnessed. He is the one spouting the possession mantra and then he critisises his players who are following his instructions.

Dont get me wrong. Mancini is a good manager and I am not suggesting we get rid of him now. He has to see the season out but face up to the fact that there is a very good chance that he will be replaced, however we end up. Unless there is a dramatic turn around in his tactical awareness and stubborness along with his man-to-man management style, he will be out.