Javi Garcia (continued)

[NQCitizen]

He never was a 'scapegoat' - that implies he was being blamed when it wasn't his fault......

The scapegoat tag is more relevant where Demichelis is concerned.

He genuinely all along has done nothing wrong all along imo.

The only real difference to his play now is he sacrificing positioning more often to look for the tackle - just a bit more proactive.

So you admit that he was a defensive midfielder who wasn't closing people down or trying to tackle but he wasn't doing anything wrong?

"Admit" is very loaded ;) but yeah they weren't prominent parts of his game. He was definitely more about shielding and marking space. However his passing, aerial ability and tactical awareness were all there back then.

Now we've abandoned incorrect cliches about getting waltzed past or passing badly I think people appreciate his actual qualities.

 

[BigOscar]

He was undeniably a scapegoat for many, as even those who hated him struggled to actually show anything he'd done wrong that directly hurt us, yet he constantly got the blame for things that he didn't even have anything to do with, or simply weren't true. People would come into this thread and spout abuse about him, when he hadn't played for weeks, claiming that we'd be better off with random shite championship level players who don't even play the same position. I've seen people blaming him for Yaya playing poorly last season (even though Yaya was no better when Garcia wasn't playing), giving the ball away too much (despite giving the ball away less than pretty much any other player) or for various other things that have fuck all to do with him. (apparently it was his fault that Nastsic and Hart conspired to let the goal in against Chelsea, true story). Presumably they blame him for things that aren't to do with him as they can't think of anything to directly blame him for. Pretty much the definition of a scapegoat.

By no means am I saying he was blameless, but he undeniably recieved far more criticism and blame than he merited. He was given no leeway to adapt to the league, or for playing out of position, but instead was made to carry the can for a lot of our players hugely underperforming last year. Obviously it's only natural to blame the new people if your old peoples level drops, but I think most now realise that last year things just went wrong. It's been much the same this year, whenever anything goes wrong there are those who claim it never would of happened if Barry/Tevez/De Jong/Mancini was still here, or if Lescott was playing etc etc, and I imagine it will be exactly the same next year with whoever we sell this summer, but I guess that's how things go.

 

[Lancet Fluke]

He genuinely all along has done nothing wrong all along imo.

The only real difference to his play now is he sacrificing positioning more often to look for the tackle - just a bit more proactive.

So you admit that he was a defensive midfielder who wasn't closing people down or trying to tackle but he wasn't doing anything wrong?

"Admit" is very loaded ;) but yeah they weren't prominent parts of his game. He was definitely more about shielding and marking space. However his passing, aerial ability and tactical awareness were all there back then.

Now we've abandoned incorrect cliches about getting waltzed past or passing badly I think people appreciate his actual qualities.

Well personally I think closing down and tackling are huge basics of a defensive midfielder's role. Before he was barely doing either, now he is, that really is the very simple fact of the whole Garcia debate. That's why people are now appreciating him and it is why they weren't before. I admit I'm no football genius but merely "shielding and marking space" sounds like it isn't enough on its own without the closing down and tackling and that essentially seemed to be the issue most people had with him, that he didn't do enough, not that he made horrendous errors but that he didn't impact the game enough in terms of protecting the back four. Now he is making the effort to close people down with urgency and tackle people a bit harder it is obvious how much more effective he is at protecting the defence and whilst I'm delighted he is now doing it, I don't see why he didn't before when most people realised he needed to do it to justify his place.

 

[taconinja]

So you admit that he was a defensive midfielder who wasn't closing people down or trying to tackle but he wasn't doing anything wrong?

"Admit" is very loaded ;) but yeah they weren't prominent parts of his game. He was definitely more about shielding and marking space. However his passing, aerial ability and tactical awareness were all there back then.

Now we've abandoned incorrect cliches about getting waltzed past or passing badly I think people appreciate his actual qualities.

Well personally I think closing down and tackling are huge basics of a defensive midfielder's role. Before he was barely doing either, now he is, that really is the very simple fact of the whole Garcia debate. That's why people are now appreciating him and it is why they weren't before. I admit I'm no football genius but merely "shielding and marking space" sounds like it isn't enough on its own without the closing down and tackling and that essentially seemed to be the issue most people had with him, that he didn't do enough, not that he made horrendous errors but that he didn't impact the game enough in terms of protecting the back four. Now he is making the effort to close people down with urgency and tackle people a bit harder it is obvious how much more effective he is at protecting the defence and whilst I'm delighted he is now doing it, I don't see why he didn't before when most people realised he needed to do it to justify his place.

First as a general aside, I didn't intend to create controversy with that article. I don't think "scapegoat" was the correct word either although I do think at times he's been blamed incorrectly. Still I would rather the author had chosen a different word.

Apologies for the digression. I agree he's picked up his game and had many poor moments prior. Honestly, I can't say for certain why he was poor at first. I've never played at the level he plays at. I'm sure though there are many factors including confidence, adapting to how the Premier League is refereed (which is radically different from continental refereeing in my opinion), and other such things. My hope is that's in the past and he can now enjoy success. I hope every player that puts on a City shirt enjoys success and I'm certainly willing to forgive past performances if the player shows he cares. I think Garcia cares.

 

[domination]

To the person who said we need someone more versatile and dynamic:

erm no we don't ... our fullbacks push up all the time, so actually need a midfielder who does nothing but defend and provide cover for the fullbacks.

 

[supercity88]

To the person who said we need someone more versatile and dynamic:

erm no we don't ... our fullbacks push up all the time, so actually need a midfielder who does nothing but defend and provide cover for the fullbacks.

That is a pointless player in my eyes. We need another player of Fernandinho's ability - someone who is quick, can read the game, can tackle but can also pass well and if we are controlling the game can therefore open up the pitch with his ability. We had a player you describe in Nigel De Jong and so many times he would pass sideways or backwards and offer very little - yes he could defend and cover but to be one of the best teams in Europe we need the player in that role to provide more - Fernandinho, Busquets, Lahm are all able to do that and we need another player of that calibre.

 

[celf]

while javi garcia has improved of late he has set the standard now!! he in my opinion in these last 3 months is playing for his city career.

 

[jaiguruKun]

I took me a while to understand the way he defends. He does not dive in unless he absolutely has to but allows opposition players to have the ball. He often cuts off the angle to the next pass so the opposition has to play it backwards or sideways. It makes me quite nervous at times, but actually it is quite intelligent as it is not a problem to allow the other team to have the ball as long as they are not hurting us. His lack of pace is his one big weakness against teams that can hurt us on the counter but this is not such a big problem if Fernandinho is playing.

I'm ashamed to say that I was one of the people who made him a scapegoat earlier in the season but he has really won me round recently. I think the turning point for him was a crunching tackle he made at home (can't remember against who, one of the lesser teams, may have been Cardiff) and the whole crowd seemed to respond to it. Since then he has really grown in confidence and has even become more of an attacking threat.

I think there is even more room for improvement now he has adjusted to English football and understands what is required from him. He has good eye for a pass and a decent shot as well - hopefully he now has the confidence to show us what he is capable of.

 

[celf]

confidence….a big thing in football,he seemed to of gained much more recently and is a popular member of the squad.

 

[NQCitizen]

To the person who said we need someone more versatile and dynamic:

erm no we don't ... our fullbacks push up all the time, so actually need a midfielder who does nothing but defend and provide cover for the fullbacks.

That is a pointless player in my eyes. We need another player of Fernandinho's ability - someone who is quick, can read the game, can tackle but can also pass well and if we are controlling the game can therefore open up the pitch with his ability. We had a player you describe in Nigel De Jong and so many times he would pass sideways or backwards and offer very little - yes he could defend and cover but to be one of the best teams in Europe we need the player in that role to provide more - Fernandinho, Busquets, Lahm are all able to do that and we need another player of that calibre.

A 40 million pound midfielder essentially, who is absolutely nailed on to stay at their current club?