Joe Hart or Willy Caballero

[blue b4 the moon]

From how Joe's career started I'd have hoped he'd be world class by now but that isn't going to happen.

Is our keeper spot at the same ability level as the rest of the team? Probably not.

I'd stick Willy in for a couple of months at least then, if Joe gets another chance as I'm not convinced Willy is an better apart from distribution and he doesn't then hit the mark I'm afraid it'll be time to move him on.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Dropping Joe now isn't the solution because we would faced with swapping keepers every time one of them makes a mistake. We have three tough games after the international break where hopefully Joe will bounce back with good performances.

Longer term we do need a World Class keeper. Unfortunately, Joe is unlikely to become World Class because there is a
Common denominator in most of Hart's weaknesses. Joe hasn't got a good footballing brain.

Joe struggles to play sweeper, see the easy pass or use his feet to make saves - case in point yesterday. He can still be a good / competent keeper if he cuts out the silly mistakes.

 

[Juan King]

Dropping Joe now isn't the solution because we would faced with swapping keepers every time one of them makes a mistake. We have three tough games after the international break where hopefully Joe will bounce back with good performances.

Longer term we do need a World Class keeper. Unfortunately, Joe is unlikely to become World Class because there is a
Common denominator in most of Hart's weaknesses. Joe hasn't got a good footballing brain.

Joe struggles to play sweeper, see the easy pass or use his feet to make saves - case in point yesterday. He can still be a good / competent keeper if he cuts out the silly mistakes.

Trouble is this is like deja vu from last season. We were saying the same thing then & we are still saying it now. He doesn't seem able to cut out the mistakes.

I agree that I don't think he has a football brain. I remember watching the game against Real Madrid away a few seasons ago & were were struggling to get the ball off them. The team were having to work really hard closing them down & chasing all over the pitch to try & win the ball. It would eventually end up with Hart & he would just boot it long, straight up the pitch back to a Madrid player & the rest of the team would then have to work hard again to try & win it back. This isn't an isolated game but just summed up to me a lack of football intelligence.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Dropping Joe now isn't the solution because we would faced with swapping keepers every time one of them makes a mistake. We have three tough games after the international break where hopefully Joe will bounce back with good performances.

Longer term we do need a World Class keeper. Unfortunately, Joe is unlikely to become World Class because there is a
Common denominator in most of Hart's weaknesses. Joe hasn't got a good footballing brain.

Joe struggles to play sweeper, see the easy pass or use his feet to make saves - case in point yesterday. He can still be a good / competent keeper if he cuts out the silly mistakes.

Trouble is this is like deja vu from last season. We were saying the same thing then & we are still saying it now. He doesn't seem able to cut out the mistakes.

I agree that I don't think he has a football brain. I remember watching the game against Real Madrid away a few seasons ago & were were struggling to get the ball off them. The team were having to work really hard closing them down & chasing all over the pitch to try & win the ball. It would eventually end up with Hart & he would just boot it long, straight up the pitch back to a Madrid player & the rest of the team would then have to work hard again to try & win it back. This isn't an isolated game but just summed up to me a lack of football intelligence.

I agree, his distribution is a real issue as it 1) either slows down our play and allows opposition to get back into their structure or 2) hands possession back to the opposition. He obviously knows that he should be releasing the ball quickly - the urgency with which he runs around the penalty box with the ball demonstrates that. He is either not seeing the pass quickly or is petrified of getting it wrong and making a mistake. I would have thought that both of these could be worked on by coaching. In comparison with other premier league goalkeepers, I think he is now behind most with distribution and based on the way we play I think that's a real issue. Our coaching team must know best what to do about it, hopefully we will see it improve as the season progresses.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

Dropping Joe now isn't the solution because we would faced with swapping keepers every time one of them makes a mistake. We have three tough games after the international break where hopefully Joe will bounce back with good performances.

Longer term we do need a World Class keeper. Unfortunately, Joe is unlikely to become World Class because there is a
Common denominator in most of Hart's weaknesses. Joe hasn't got a good footballing brain.

Joe struggles to play sweeper, see the easy pass or use his feet to make saves - case in point yesterday. He can still be a good / competent keeper if he cuts out the silly mistakes.

Trouble is this is like deja vu from last season. We were saying the same thing then & we are still saying it now. He doesn't seem able to cut out the mistakes.

I agree that I don't think he has a football brain. I remember watching the game against Real Madrid away a few seasons ago & were were struggling to get the ball off them. The team were having to work really hard closing them down & chasing all over the pitch to try & win the ball. It would eventually end up with Hart & he would just boot it long, straight up the pitch back to a Madrid player & the rest of the team would then have to work hard again to try & win it back. This isn't an isolated game but just summed up to me a lack of football intelligence.

Fair points Juan King, especially in relation to Joe's decision making in Madrid.

I haven't seen enough of Willy C but the goals he conceded in the Community Shield were like ones Joe would concede e.g. Rooney scoring at the Etihad in 2012. Unless Pellers is confident that Willy is a marked improvement on Joe then I would give Hart another chance.

 

[nobody can eat fifty eggs]

In my opinion we have two number 1's at City and we shouldn't be afraid to use them both at different stages of the season. The media will put a spin on the situation saying "Hart dropped" etc but in reality we are using both goalies and then we can judge who is the better keeper as well as keeping Joe on his toes to which he's guilty of not doing, as shown in the past. All in all we shouldn't be having this debate, we should already have a top reliable keeper at City.

 

[paphos-mcfc]

After yesterday's performance I think we should be sticking our willy in.............net.

Awful keeping ftom Joe to give them the goal.

 

[manchester blue]

The stats were in the last Hart thread and I'm not going to look again but the facts are that his shots on target to saves ratio is dire. basically a shot on target has a good chance of going in. He's is protected a lot by our, usually excellent defence, in so much as he is rarely kept busy.

Quite simply he is not the standard of other positions on the pitch.

 

[citytill1die84]

After yesterday's performance I think we should be sticking our willy in.............net.

Awful keeping ftom Joe to give them the goal.

After Willy's performance in the Charity Shield I wouldn't put him anywhere near our net.

 

[Len Rum]

Dropping Joe now isn't the solution because we would faced with swapping keepers every time one of them makes a mistake. We have three tough games after the international break where hopefully Joe will bounce back with good performances.

Longer term we do need a World Class keeper. Unfortunately, Joe is unlikely to become World Class because there is a
Common denominator in most of Hart's weaknesses. Joe hasn't got a good footballing brain.

Joe struggles to play sweeper, see the easy pass or use his feet to make saves - case in point yesterday. He can still be a good / competent keeper if he cuts out the silly mistakes.

Trouble is this is like deja vu from last season. We were saying the same thing then & we are still saying it now. He doesn't seem able to cut out the mistakes.

I agree that I don't think he has a football brain. I remember watching the game against Real Madrid away a few seasons ago & were were struggling to get the ball off them. The team were having to work really hard closing them down & chasing all over the pitch to try & win the ball. It would eventually end up with Hart & he would just boot it long, straight up the pitch back to a Madrid player & the rest of the team would then have to work hard again to try & win it back. This isn't an isolated game but just summed up to me a lack of football intelligence.

It is deja vu and timewise we're at the equivalent of the post Cardiff game of last season
However Pellers has now had a year in the job and has deliberately brought in his own man to provide Joe with competition.
If he doesn't select Caballero now, then when is he ever going to pick him?