Keir Starmer

Name the general election based on a coin toss or anywhere near ever. This is quite simple if someone would prefer a better political system and more honest politicians why would they vote Tory or Labour. As an individual knowing your vote will not matter and having a choice why?

The fact you insist on sticking with the my vote may alter the result only shows you have no other valid reasons.
There are a few council elections that have been based on a coin toss, but that's hardly a big issue. I only said "rarely" because it's literally not "never". I have never made the point that your one vote is "the one".

You appear to be taking a general point about all our single votes adding up to make a difference, and suggesting it's all about you. It's not. Plenty of people have made the same point to you - it's the individuals that collectively make a difference. I don't care how *you* vote, but I do care if your attitude that it makes no difference is one that more and more people hold.

The "no other valid reasons" makes no sense.

I was only making one argument - I disagreed with your point that a single vote makes no difference. If you want to pedantically claim that one specific person doesn't change elections, then you're right, but it's not about one specific person, it's about everyone who believes that, in your words "the outcome will be the same as if they had never left the house."

Clearly that's not true, as we know that people voting does make a difference to the outcome.
 
There are a few council elections that have been based on a coin toss, but that's hardly a big issue. I only said "rarely" because it's literally not "never". I have never made the point that your one vote is "the one".

You appear to be taking a general point about all our single votes adding up to make a difference, and suggesting it's all about you. It's not. Plenty of people have made the same point to you - it's the individuals that collectively make a difference. I don't care how *you* vote, but I do care if your attitude that it makes no difference is one that more and more people hold.

The "no other valid reasons" makes no sense.

I was only making one argument - I disagreed with your point that a single vote makes no difference. If you want to pedantically claim that one specific person doesn't change elections, then you're right, but it's not about one specific person, it's about everyone who believes that, in your words "the outcome will be the same as if they had never left the house."

Clearly that's not true, as we know that people voting does make a difference to the outcome.

I'm glad we got there and you agree one vote doesn't make a difference in the outcome to a general election.

BTW I covered the people voting makes a difference several times you must have missed it. To clarify again because you know other people will vote and in sufficient numbers to make your vote not affect anything you can vote with total freedom.

It's not anti democratic or negative. I'm really not sure how telling an individual they can vote however they want without having to worry about putting the fucking awful tories in is a bad thing?

The point is so simple I do wonder why people are making such a big thing about it.
 
To clarify again because you know other people will vote and in sufficient numbers to make your vote not affect anything you can vote with total freedom.
How do you know they’re not thinking exactly the same as you?

A general complacency about the value of an individual vote allows the candidate with the most dedicated support, even if it’s nowhere near a majority, to win an election when he doesn’t actually represent the values of most people who live there. That’s why there’s a concerted right wing campaign to paint all politicians as the same so that people won’t be arsed about voting for the alternative that we desperately need in this country.

Having said that, the corruption, incompetence and disdain that the government has for huge sections of the population should be enough this time for it to be a landslide victory for Labour even if quite a few follow your example. However it won’t be the wipeout they deserve.
 
I'm glad we got there and you agree one vote doesn't make a difference in the outcome to a general election.
That's about the cheapest internet argument around.

Pretending the other person has agreed with you, and being smug about it is really poor.

I'm glad we got there and you agree one vote doesn't make a difference in the outcome to a general election.

BTW I covered the people voting makes a difference several times you must have missed it. To clarify again because you know other people will vote and in sufficient numbers to make your vote not affect anything you can vote with total freedom.

It's not anti democratic or negative. I'm really not sure how telling an individual they can vote however they want without having to worry about putting the fucking awful tories in is a bad thing?

The point is so simple I do wonder why people are making such a big thing about it.

The Tories have just changed the Mayoral elections to First Past the Post, because they know that "sufficient numbers" will vote for parties that have no chance of winning. The previous voting systems showed that in many cases, those voters would happily have voted to keep the Tory out.
 
I'm glad we got there and you agree one vote doesn't make a difference in the outcome to a general election.

BTW I covered the people voting makes a difference several times you must have missed it. To clarify again because you know other people will vote and in sufficient numbers to make your vote not affect anything you can vote with total freedom.

It's not anti democratic or negative. I'm really not sure how telling an individual they can vote however they want without having to worry about putting the fucking awful tories in is a bad thing?

The point is so simple I do wonder why people are making such a big thing about it.

If you promise to vote I'll buy you a happy meal and an extra toy.
 
Can't we all just agree Starmer is a **** and the sooner he is gone the better.

Damn those centrist politicians and their sensible reasoning and realistic prospects of winning.

What we really need is a load of far left anti semitic protesters in opposition to another Conservative government next year.
 

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