Keir Starmer

What if they do recognise the picture being painted but don't care because they live quite well?

Thats for them to answer and for Labour to convince.

There will be a lot of people who suddenly realise anyone is only a redundancy or illness from living on the street.

Has it ever been any different, regardless of who is in power?

Watch Sitting in Limbo tomorrow evening (8.30 BBC1) and get an inkling of why it's easy to hate a Tory government.

I will but i suspect that it wont really change my opinion of a Tory government in general and that i will still dislike and hopefully never have to vote for them again but hate?

Its that hate word again? Momentum and the left always feel the need to hate anyone and everything that doesn't agree with them and its why you wont win power.
 
I see Mr Forensic Woodenhead took money from some very questionable sources to help pay for his Labour Leadership bid.

Mr F Woodenhead previously gave the excuse that any large donations to his leadership campaign were already public record, in compliance with parliamentary rules.

But a handy loophole allows MPs with deep personal pockets to delay accepting donations, self-finance their own campaigns, then reimburse themselves later on. This means Starmer could wait up to 58 days before officially registering any large donations: well after the election was over.

Under Labour’s internal rules, meanwhile, Starmer faced no obligation to publish this information until early June, with a donations cap of around half a million pounds, excluding costs on staff and premises.

And who footed the bill? One of the most generous backers was media mogul and ASOS chair Waheed Alli, who threw in £100,000.

Alli is a close friend of Tony Blair (who gave him a peerage in 1998), Alli had formerly donated to Liz Kendall in 2015, and to Angela Eagle when she challenged Corbyn’s leadership in 2016. He was also among the 64 Labour peers who signed a venomous advert in the Guardian accusing Corbyn of “allowing antisemitism to grow in our party”.

The hedge fund manager Martin Taylor chipped in £95,000. Taylor suspended his regular six-figure donations to the party during the Corbyn years. And he made headlines for funding Blairite groupings Labour Together, Saving Labour and Labour Tomorrow in an attempt to bring the leader down.

Clive Hollick - best known for co-founding the Institute for Public Policy Research, a Blairite think tank - gave £50,000. This comes on top of previous funding for both Kendall and then Owen Smith, during the 2016 post-chicken-coup leadership race.

Another £50,000 came from Trevor Chinn, a pro-Israel lobbyist and executive committee member of the Britain Israel Communications and Research Centre. The campaign wing of this organisation is directed by the virulently anti-Corbyn Luke Akehurst – infamous for his social media tirades against left wingers.

Chinn also gave £60,000 to Tom Watson when he was the leader of the Blairite fifth column within Labour. And he put £25,000 down on Smith’s disastrous leadership challenge.

Betting shop magnate and long time Blairite financier Peter Coates also staked £25,000 on Starmer. Coates announced in 2016 that he would no longer finance a Corbyn-led Labour Party. Instead, he stated that he would focus on “direct personal donations to fund the work of [MPs] whose centrist views are more aligned to his own”.

AA Finance Director and Progress member Martin Clarke donated £25,000 to Starmer’s campaign. Clarke was previously one of the main architects of the ‘centre-ground’ party, Change UK. The Starmer-supporting unions UNISON, Community and USDAW contributed about £80,000 collectively. All three have right-wing leaderships. The only other big donation that Starmer disclosed in a timely manner was £100,000 from fellow lawyer and Holborn & St. Pancras CLP member Bob Latham.
The remaining list of substantial donors - ranging from a few grand to tens of thousands of pounds - include the Managing Director of the Canary Wharf Group; the boss of a major pensions and investment firm; and a private energy company.

In sum, eight wealthy people contributed a total of £455,000 to Starmer’s war chest, out of a total declared of £536,000

Its no wonder that there is a purge of Labour party left wingers on the go as the party has wealthy backers now and no longer needs the mass membership subs that accrued under Corbyn. Labour members are leaving in droves but the party will be friendly to the corporate establishment no doubt. Its no wonder the RW media have been fawning over Starmer, if he wins he is no threat to the capitalist hegemony, the purge of any left wingers that are left in the party will gather pace with the choice of the Blairite David Evans as Gen Sec of the party and i have absolutely no doubt that any inquiry into the dreadful behaviour of the staff at party HQ will be swept under the carpet.

It sickens me that a handful of centrist cunts can have so much power in the party i have grown up with and loved all my life , i am appalled that these centrists helped enable the worst government in living memory through their actions and they will never be even be disciplined never mind sacked from the party.

Its no wonder Starmer has been missing in action the last few weeks as he cant afford to upset his wealthy backers and all this at a time when we need a real Labour party fighting for the working class, instead he cosys up to Johnson and will I am certain be seeking the support of the FBFE fruitcakes in order to stop Brexit and we have the unedifying sight of Reynolds the shadow DWP sec, already questioning the validity of the welfare state in Politics home, which is basically an online platform for the Tory party.

The left has been neutered and the establishment will breathe a huge sigh of relief and champagne corks will pop safe in the knowledge that they have succeeded in getting rid of their bogeyman and putting their own man in charge of the labour party.

The party is fucked and the person who is laughing the most is the most inept PM in our countries history, he knows he is untouchable and can do whatever the fuck he likes because the lickspittles will let him.
Another knowlegable post from you Rascal. However where i differ is the fact that you think Starmer being elected reduces the chance of this current Tory Government being held to account where as i clearly see it as increasing the chances of them being held to account. I just dont see how Corbyn was ever going to get elected. The electorate never warmed to his policies or persona as shown in two election defeats to pretty incompetant governments. You cant really dispute that fact.
 
What if they do recognise the picture being painted but don't care because they live quite well?

There will be a lot of people who suddenly realise anyone is only a redundancy or illness from living on the street.

Watch Sitting in Limbo tomorrow evening (8.30 BBC1) and get an inkling of why it's easy to hate a Tory government.

Get over the hatred and paint a picture of hope
If you appeal to the same people with same message you get the same result
 
Rascal nails Starmer by saying he will become a pro EU/rejoin man and take the party down that route and at that point its a no from me im afraid.
Surely that depends on whether leaving the EU has been an absolute shitstorm or not? If it’s the success we’ve been promised why would he (and anyone else, for that matter) want to rejoin? By the next election we will have been out for nearly five years, the ‘project fear’ stuff will be known, and the only way a rejoin platform could win an election is if most of it had come true. Despite what leavers might think I and most other people who voted to stay in the EU, fervently hope that there is no mileage in a party standing on a rejoin ticket, as that means Brexit will have been successful enough. If I may say so, your view that, no matter the consequences of Brexit, you’d never vote for a party that would want to rejoin the EU, seems a bit closed minded and suggests single issue, divisive politics are here to stay, which is what we need to get away from, I’d have thought.
 
Thats for them to answer and for Labour to convince.



Has it ever been any different, regardless of who is in power?



I will but i suspect that it wont really change my opinion of a Tory government in general and that i will still dislike and hopefully never have to vote for them again but hate?

Its that hate word again? Momentum and the left always feel the need to hate anyone and everything that doesn't agree with them and its why you wont win power.

The irony is most people here seem to want to vote labour
 
Get over the hatred and paint a picture of hope
If you appeal to the same people with same message you get the same result
Hate, hate, hate. It was screamed before the referendum, and all the elections.
There was never anything positive, so consequently, they got nothing positive in return.
 
Momentum is a busted flush and has never had the influence or the clout it has been portrayed as having, that is a myth painted by the RW media who love a bogeyman, especially a bogeyman they can portray as far left, which momentum aren't anyway in the grand scheme of things.

The country is in the shit, there has been 50,000 people die because of Tory ineptitude, how else can I portray that otherwise than blame the government for their sheer incompetence and the leader of that a government as a lying clown. It is what he is and the tories are what they are. If you think everything is rosy and 50,000 people have died needlessly then this country is more fucked than I ever imagined. The Govt are carrying on with their plans to send kids back to school whilst the R is rising again, they have lied and fiddled whilst the country goes to hell in a handcart and Johnson has the fucking temerity to say he is proud of what he has achieved.

Of course I hate the Tories they are anathema to everything I believe in, they have systematically destroyed the country and turned into a capitalist hell hole where only the pursuit of money is deemed worthy of appreciation. They have treated the poorest in society with utter contempt, they slashed my welfare by one third after blatently lying in an WCA assessment and ignoring my problems, they didn't have examine me, they assumed that because I opened a bottle of water I had fully functioning capability and was able to walk unaided. I despise them because I saw IDS laughing at the abject cruelty he has brought upon people. I then see a labour party front bench appointee of Starmers actually agree with the Tories welfare stance.

This systematic destruction of the social fabric of the nation is down to the Tories and their obsession with neo-liberalism, aided and abetted by Blair and his cronies acceptance of those destructive powers. We saw the destruction of the Unions, which led to lower wages and the devastation of manufacturing which led to whole swathes of the North suffering enormous poverty and high unemployment rates, people with no future but to go and work on a zero hours contract at sports direct or some other warehouse company. The skills the nation had are gone, we no longer build things, we are an island whose people rely on answering a phone or packing a parcel a living.

All of this just increases the amount of what Marx called a persons surplus value that goes to the owner of capital, which of course makes the owners of capital more wealthy which in turn increases inequality. So of course I am angry because I see the working classes devastated by cuts to essential services, I see record numbers of people without a roof over their head, there are more foodbanks than there are Mcdonalds, I see our young leaving uni in enormous debt and having to work in a shit job knowing their chances of owning a home are minimal. I see how bad out transportation system is, I see how our former nationalised power companies are now oligarchies and rip off customers for corporate profit, I see our roads full of pot holes, I see our libraries, our fucking libraries ffs being shut in huge numbers, so of course I am angry, without my library I could not have afforded to read and therefore been far more poorly educated than I currently am. I see the NHS reduced to a husk of a service and I see the staff their driven to despair by doing long shifts for low pay, I see our schools in disrepair and the future of our kids hangs by the balance, of course some people are doing well but in Manchester we have some of the most deprived estates in Europe, not just in the UK, I see the armed forces decimated whilst the nation prepares to spend billions on useless nuclear weapons, I see great institutions like the BBC attacked and traduced, their services cut and the soft power it exercised removed, I see the rise of the far right fuelled by despair and used by corporate interest to deflect from corporate misdeeds, so of course I am fucking angry and then I see the very party that should be fighting for the interests of the working class bought by corporate interest with a puppet installed as leader so they are safe in their further exploitation of the people of the UK

So yes I am fucking angry, I am angry at seeing my concerns belittled as virtue signalling, I am angry that people see my concerns as woke liberalism, I am angry because they are wrong, I am no liberal, I have virtue and no need to signal anything, I am not woke, I have always been awake and aware of the affects of what Naomi Klein described as disaster capitalism, we see disaster capitalism in action now with corporate interest making huge sums of money on the back of government contracts handed out to their donors whilst his crisis is ongoing.

And yes I am fucking angry that the Labour party has acceded to the capitalists and will only offer an alternative in a different rosette to all that is wrong with our great country.

I will stop now, because I am angry and I am annoyed that the people of this country so meekly accept their lot in life and I know my anger doesn't make one fucking bit of difference to what people think anymore, because if we as a nation are happy to put up with this shower of shit killing 50,000 people through sheer incompetence I cant think of anything else that would ever change their minds
 
Surely that depends on whether leaving the EU has been an absolute shitstorm or not? If it’s the success we’ve been promised why would he (and anyone else, for that matter) want to rejoin? By the next election we will have been out for nearly five years, the ‘project fear’ stuff will be known, and the only way a rejoin platform could win an election is if most of it had come true. Despite what leavers might think I and most other people who voted to stay in the EU, fervently hope that there is no mileage in a party standing on a rejoin ticket, as that means Brexit will have been successful enough. If I may say so, your view that, no matter the consequences of Brexit, you’d never vote for a party that would want to rejoin the EU, seems a bit closed minded and suggests single issue, divisive politics are here to stay, which is what we need to get away from, I’d have thought.

Im saying 5 years is nothing politically and after 40 odd years of membership, people saying after just one or two or even less that it hasn't worked and we need back in is not acceptable imo.
 
Momentum is a busted flush and has never had the influence or the clout it has been portrayed as having, that is a myth painted by the RW media who love a bogeyman, especially a bogeyman they can portray as far left, which momentum aren't anyway in the grand scheme of things.

The country is in the shit, there has been 50,000 people die because of Tory ineptitude, how else can I portray that otherwise than blame the government for their sheer incompetence and the leader of that a government as a lying clown. It is what he is and the tories are what they are. If you think everything is rosy and 50,000 people have died needlessly then this country is more fucked than I ever imagined. The Govt are carrying on with their plans to send kids back to school whilst the R is rising again, they have lied and fiddled whilst the country goes to hell in a handcart and Johnson has the fucking temerity to say he is proud of what he has achieved.

Of course I hate the Tories they are anathema to everything I believe in, they have systematically destroyed the country and turned into a capitalist hell hole where only the pursuit of money is deemed worthy of appreciation. They have treated the poorest in society with utter contempt, they slashed my welfare by one third after blatently lying in an WCA assessment and ignoring my problems, they didn't have examine me, they assumed that because I opened a bottle of water I had fully functioning capability and was able to walk unaided. I despise them because I saw IDS laughing at the abject cruelty he has brought upon people. I then see a labour party front bench appointee of Starmers actually agree with the Tories welfare stance.

This systematic destruction of the social fabric of the nation is down to the Tories and their obsession with neo-liberalism, aided and abetted by Blair and his cronies acceptance of those destructive powers. We saw the destruction of the Unions, which led to lower wages and the devastation of manufacturing which led to whole swathes of the North suffering enormous poverty and high unemployment rates, people with no future but to go and work on a zero hours contract at sports direct or some other warehouse company. The skills the nation had are gone, we no longer build things, we are an island whose people rely on answering a phone or packing a parcel a living.

All of this just increases the amount of what Marx called a persons surplus value that goes to the owner of capital, which of course makes the owners of capital more wealthy which in turn increases inequality. So of course I am angry because I see the working classes devastated by cuts to essential services, I see record numbers of people without a roof over their head, there are more foodbanks than there are Mcdonalds, I see our young leaving uni in enormous debt and having to work in a shit job knowing their chances of owning a home are minimal. I see how bad out transportation system is, I see how our former nationalised power companies are now oligarchies and rip off customers for corporate profit, I see our roads full of pot holes, I see our libraries, our fucking libraries ffs being shut in huge numbers, so of course I am angry, without my library I could not have afforded to read and therefore been far more poorly educated than I currently am. I see the NHS reduced to a husk of a service and I see the staff their driven to despair by doing long shifts for low pay, I see our schools in disrepair and the future of our kids hangs by the balance, of course some people are doing well but in Manchester we have some of the most deprived estates in Europe, not just in the UK, I see the armed forces decimated whilst the nation prepares to spend billions on useless nuclear weapons, I see great institutions like the BBC attacked and traduced, their services cut and the soft power it exercised removed, I see the rise of the far right fuelled by despair and used by corporate interest to deflect from corporate misdeeds, so of course I am fucking angry and then I see the very party that should be fighting for the interests of the working class bought by corporate interest with a puppet installed as leader so they are safe in their further exploitation of the people of the UK

So yes I am fucking angry, I am angry at seeing my concerns belittled as virtue signalling, I am angry that people see my concerns as woke liberalism, I am angry because they are wrong, I am no liberal, I have virtue and no need to signal anything, I am not woke, I have always been awake and aware of the affects of what Naomi Klein described as disaster capitalism, we see disaster capitalism in action now with corporate interest making huge sums of money on the back of government contracts handed out to their donors whilst his crisis is ongoing.

And yes I am fucking angry that the Labour party has acceded to the capitalists and will only offer an alternative in a different rosette to all that is wrong with our great country.

I will stop now, because I am angry and I am annoyed that the people of this country so meekly accept their lot in life and I know my anger doesn't make one fucking bit of difference to what people think anymore, because if we as a nation are happy to put up with this shower of shit killing 50,000 people through sheer incompetence I cant think of anything else that would ever change their minds
Sometimes its best to try and not worry about things. Nowt we can do about much anyway. Whats the point in getting angry. I know its easier said than done.
 
The country is in the shit, there has been 50,000 people die because of Tory ineptitude, how else can I portray that otherwise than blame the government for their sheer incompetence and the leader of that a government as a lying clown.

I've no issue with this so long as you can prove a alternate government would have saved all 50,000 lives mate?

When science and medicine can't save people from a new virus I'm struggling to see how a political party could?
 
Get over the hatred and paint a picture of hope
If you appeal to the same people with same message you get the same result
The daft thing is that most of the Tories I know are likeable people who don't like the party's social policies either (and that's party members).
 
I've no issue with this so long as you can prove a alternate government would have saved all 50,000 lives mate?

When science and medicine can't save people from a new virus I'm struggling to see how a political party could?
Just thank fuck Nichola Sturgeon isn't in charge.
 
The daft thing is that most of the Tories I know are likeable people who don't like the party's social policies either (and that's party members).

Indeed and it's why putting people into convenient boxes is completely wrong.

Vast majority of us will hold political opinions that cross divides.
 
I've no issue with this so long as you can prove a alternate government would have saved all 50,000 lives mate?

When science and medicine can't save people from a new virus I'm struggling to see how a political party could?
How does one prove one isn't an idiot?

Just thank fuck Nichola Sturgeon isn't in charge.
That's how to prove one is.
 
Momentum is a busted flush and has never had the influence or the clout it has been portrayed as having, that is a myth painted by the RW media who love a bogeyman, especially a bogeyman they can portray as far left, which momentum aren't anyway in the grand scheme of things.

The country is in the shit, there has been 50,000 people die because of Tory ineptitude, how else can I portray that otherwise than blame the government for their sheer incompetence and the leader of that a government as a lying clown. It is what he is and the tories are what they are. If you think everything is rosy and 50,000 people have died needlessly then this country is more fucked than I ever imagined. The Govt are carrying on with their plans to send kids back to school whilst the R is rising again, they have lied and fiddled whilst the country goes to hell in a handcart and Johnson has the fucking temerity to say he is proud of what he has achieved.

Of course I hate the Tories they are anathema to everything I believe in, they have systematically destroyed the country and turned into a capitalist hell hole where only the pursuit of money is deemed worthy of appreciation. They have treated the poorest in society with utter contempt, they slashed my welfare by one third after blatently lying in an WCA assessment and ignoring my problems, they didn't have examine me, they assumed that because I opened a bottle of water I had fully functioning capability and was able to walk unaided. I despise them because I saw IDS laughing at the abject cruelty he has brought upon people. I then see a labour party front bench appointee of Starmers actually agree with the Tories welfare stance.

This systematic destruction of the social fabric of the nation is down to the Tories and their obsession with neo-liberalism, aided and abetted by Blair and his cronies acceptance of those destructive powers. We saw the destruction of the Unions, which led to lower wages and the devastation of manufacturing which led to whole swathes of the North suffering enormous poverty and high unemployment rates, people with no future but to go and work on a zero hours contract at sports direct or some other warehouse company. The skills the nation had are gone, we no longer build things, we are an island whose people rely on answering a phone or packing a parcel a living.

All of this just increases the amount of what Marx called a persons surplus value that goes to the owner of capital, which of course makes the owners of capital more wealthy which in turn increases inequality. So of course I am angry because I see the working classes devastated by cuts to essential services, I see record numbers of people without a roof over their head, there are more foodbanks than there are Mcdonalds, I see our young leaving uni in enormous debt and having to work in a shit job knowing their chances of owning a home are minimal. I see how bad out transportation system is, I see how our former nationalised power companies are now oligarchies and rip off customers for corporate profit, I see our roads full of pot holes, I see our libraries, our fucking libraries ffs being shut in huge numbers, so of course I am angry, without my library I could not have afforded to read and therefore been far more poorly educated than I currently am. I see the NHS reduced to a husk of a service and I see the staff their driven to despair by doing long shifts for low pay, I see our schools in disrepair and the future of our kids hangs by the balance, of course some people are doing well but in Manchester we have some of the most deprived estates in Europe, not just in the UK, I see the armed forces decimated whilst the nation prepares to spend billions on useless nuclear weapons, I see great institutions like the BBC attacked and traduced, their services cut and the soft power it exercised removed, I see the rise of the far right fuelled by despair and used by corporate interest to deflect from corporate misdeeds, so of course I am fucking angry and then I see the very party that should be fighting for the interests of the working class bought by corporate interest with a puppet installed as leader so they are safe in their further exploitation of the people of the UK

So yes I am fucking angry, I am angry at seeing my concerns belittled as virtue signalling, I am angry that people see my concerns as woke liberalism, I am angry because they are wrong, I am no liberal, I have virtue and no need to signal anything, I am not woke, I have always been awake and aware of the affects of what Naomi Klein described as disaster capitalism, we see disaster capitalism in action now with corporate interest making huge sums of money on the back of government contracts handed out to their donors whilst his crisis is ongoing.

And yes I am fucking angry that the Labour party has acceded to the capitalists and will only offer an alternative in a different rosette to all that is wrong with our great country.

I will stop now, because I am angry and I am annoyed that the people of this country so meekly accept their lot in life and I know my anger doesn't make one fucking bit of difference to what people think anymore, because if we as a nation are happy to put up with this shower of shit killing 50,000 people through sheer incompetence I cant think of anything else that would ever change their minds

Don't agree with some of this, other bits I do but as always it's heartfelt.
 
Sometimes its best to try and not worry about things. Nowt we can do about much anyway. Whats the point in getting angry. I know its easier said than done.

"nowt much we can do anyway"

That just about sums up the putrification of UK politics. We can have any government we want as long as that government does nothing different to the status quo and anything deemed unacceptable will be widely ridiculed by the combined forces of the RW media, traduced as reactionary or hard left or both and all means of propaganda fair or foul will be used to enforce that status quo.

Are we seeing the UK become akin to the decadence of Rome, with the decline of virtue, family, dignity and social responsibility

“The Rome he has been trained to serve, the Rome of Augustus and Germanicus, was gone. In its place stood Neronopolis, ruled by a megalomaniac brat.”

The above quote was from Senecus at the court of Nero

"The England he has been trained to serve, the England of Churchill and Atlee , was gone, In its place stood Johnsonopolis, ruled by a melgolmaniac

The above is my own modern interpretation of that quote
 
"nowt much we can do anyway"

That just about sums up the putrification of UK politics. We can have any government we want as long as that government does nothing different to the status quo and anything deemed unacceptable will be widely ridiculed by the combined forces of the RW media, traduced as reactionary or hard left or both and all means of propaganda fair or foul will be used to enforce that status quo.

Are we seeing the UK become akin to the decadence of Rome, with the decline of virtue, family, dignity and social responsibility

“The Rome he has been trained to serve, the Rome of Augustus and Germanicus, was gone. In its place stood Neronopolis, ruled by a megalomaniac brat.”

The above quote was from Senecus at the court of Nero

"The England he has been trained to serve, the England of Churchill and Atlee , was gone, In its place stood Johnsonopolis, ruled by a melgolmaniac

The above is my own modern interpretation of that quote
And, it turns out, we could have spent the money all along........
 
I think personally the demonstrations in America will lead to the end of trump
But I think over here it will actually help Boris Johnson if it continues
His approval rating is low but of the violence continues public opinion will change
Like brexit a lot of protesters looks great but the overall population will not necessarily have the same opinion (about the protest not the cause)
Labour unfortunately will associate themselves only with the protesters
They need to find a balance
 

Don't have an account? Register now and see fewer ads!

SIGN UP
Back
Top