Mancini's biggest fault. (IMO)

[Didsbury Dave]

You've actually hit the nail on the head there. Playing him in his role is fundamentally a defensive decision. And that's we don't create enough chances, don't play with enough tempo, can't break down defensive teams and can't get back in games in the last period. It's not the only reason for these flaws but it's a big one.

Yes but remember he has been more or less forced to this by an underperforming SWP and an injured Johnson. PlusSilva likes to run between left and right so you need guys who can defend backing him up. Yaya is not a bad passer too as proved by the sweet cross to Balotelli and the many times he has found the always selfish Tevez. I think he is good in his position just knacked I dont think any player has played more minutes.

Of course he hasn't been forced into this. He's done it since the first game on the season.

 

[DenisLawBackHeel74]

I'm not here to slag off the current manager, or any of the players. I'd just like to air something that's bugging me.

In my opinion Mancini's biggest fault is that he believes Yaya Toure is a premiership quality attacking midfielder. I don't doubt Yaya's qualities and one game out of maybe 6 or 7 he has an excellent game there (usually against poor opposition). But for me he's just not good enough in this roll.

Look at premiership teams who play with either an AM or a number 10 dropping off into midfield to link up play. Tottenham (Modric, Van Der Vaart) Chelsea (Lampard), Arsenal (Fabregas), Liverpool (Gerrard), Ushited (Rooney). I just don't think Yaya is as good as any of these players in this roll. For me our two more defense-minded Mids should be two from Barry, De Jong, Yaya, Vieira, Milner, Zab. Then the AM position should be given to either Silva or Tevez (The Rooney roll if playing alongside Balo or Dzeko) or at a pinch Milner.

Against Chelsea we had a big man up front so Silva would have been ideal as the AM (Or number 10) with Milner and AJ on the wings to play balls into the box. This just never happened. I can barely remember Dzeko having a chance (except the one he stuffed up when Yaya dummied a touch). It seemed that 50% of the breaks we got (and there weren't many) broke down due to a poor ball by Yaya or a lack of vision by him.

Like I said I don't want to slag the player off, I think he has many fine qualities, just not as the lynchpin of our midfield. For me the AM is the most important roll in a 4-3-3 or a 4-5-1.

Thoughts?

I think you have the crux of it.

Mancini plays him in both a holding midfield capacity or in an attacking midfield position just behind the forwards. In my opinion Yaya is a bit betwixt and between...he never 'consistently' impresses in a holding or defensive role, depending on the opposition the game sometimes alludes him..although Barca used him successfully in this role prior to Busquets....I feel a bit imprecise calling his other role 'AM' because in my opinion he is'nt sharp enough or consistent enough or mobile enough to perform the job...but sometimes he does play well in the advanced midfield position.

don't get me wrong, i like the lad, but just as Kolorav doesn't quite seem to be the LB we were led to believe...Yaya does not seem to be the new Viera or an attacking midfielder.

we need a couple of quick players in the middle, i'm sure we all agree on that, at least one of these players should be able to tackle, have a range of distribution/vision, and lots of pace. The other should be skillful and creative, a good link up for Silva, who can either play alongside or in a more advanced position.

add to that a coupe of fast wing backs (maybe with improvement kolarov can be one?)...Danny Alves the other...and we have it imo.

 

[HellasLEAF]

I would have to agree with the OP that for some reason Yaya went from DM at every previous club to a player who pushes our attack. And he's not bad at it. He can push the ball well and can dribble out of problems but ultimately it's his lack of creativity and vision that fail him.

 

[cockneycarparkm32]

I think he is just too stubborn

 

[didactic]

Let me make the point in another way. When I watch Tottenham without Modric they look like us. A team of good quality players without a clear plan. They have the players to get a goal out of nothing and often do. However, when they're up against it they look lost. When Modric plays, his vision, passing, and ball control skill allow him to dictate the flow of the game, pick the right passes and sometimes the killer ball.

Xavi does the same at Barca, Fabregas at Arsenal, etc etc. Mancini plays Yaya in this roll and it doesn't suit him. You can claim he's playing 3 DMs all you like. If that were true it's even more ridiculous, bordering on lunacy.

This system only works when one of our star players (Tevez, Balo, Silva, etc) pulls something out of their (considerable) bag of tricks and create a goal out of nothing. The rest of the time the system fails, and it fails miserably. Forget league position, wins, draws, losses and look at the team on the pitch and how they play. Are you truly happy with what you see? I'm not. I'm not saying we're terrible, just not good enough considering the players we've brought in.

Fuzz mate look at the teams Mancini has put out since Johnsons injury. He likes his midfield more defensive minded only once has he tried Tevez, Dzeko and Balo and allowed Silva to fall back into the role of AM. Its worked so far and has at forth that was always the target and we over achieved maybe that is why everyone is now unhappy. Yaya is quality and has assists and four good goals to prove it. He is simply tired.

Barca did not want him to go, but we all know Barca promotes players from the Basque region and they played Sergio Busquets more. As they did with Pedro over Ibra and Pique over Abidal. This does not mean he is a bad player. For 3 years he was their starting DM until Busquets came through.

 

[Gelsons Dad]

lol nurse!

Can you expand on this please mate...

How can anyone be shocked to the core by something of which they have no personal experience? How on earth can TH make an objective assessment of Mancini's "man-management skills" without sitting in every meeting and conversation with each player? Given that situational management will dictate that RM treats each player in the manner that best matches their personality type there is no way for TH to judge from outside. Therefore to be shocked to the core by something of which you have little knowledge shows the weakest of constitutions or perhaps a penchant for over dramatisation. In either case I would recommend constant care and hence the call for a nurse.

 

[Squatter]

Mancini doesn't seem a very good man manager to me. He seems to dislike the English players and was letting Balotelli get away with murder

 

[didactic]

Mancini doesn't seem a very good man manager to me. He seems to dislike the English players and was letting Balotelli get away with murder

I was waiting for this, so which fantastic English player has he over looked for Balotelli?

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Can you expand on this please mate...

How can anyone be shocked to the core by something of which they have no personal experience? How on earth can TH make an objective assessment of Mancini's "man-management skills" without sitting in every meeting and conversation with each player? Given that situational management will dictate that RM treats each player in the manner that best matches their personality type there is no way for TH to judge from outside. Therefore to be shocked to the core by something of which you have little knowledge shows the weakest of constitutions or perhaps a penchant for over dramatisation. In either case I would recommend constant care and hence the call for a nurse.

I'm afraid your bombast is from a postion of ignorance.

Tolm's comment is not.

 

[tolmie's hairdoo]

Can you expand on this please mate...

How can anyone be shocked to the core by something of which they have no personal experience? How on earth can TH make an objective assessment of Mancini's "man-management skills" without sitting in every meeting and conversation with each player? Given that situational management will dictate that RM treats each player in the manner that best matches their personality type there is know way for TH to judge from outside. Therefore to be shocked to the core by something which you little knowledge shows the weakest of constitutions or perhaps a penchant for over dramatisation. In either case I would recommend constant care and hence the call for a nurse.

Plenty of people can be shocked 'to the core' in respect of not having personal experience of something.

I was thankfully not involved in the recent events in Japan, but my weak constitution got the better of me, again!

I also have invested 35 years of love in this club, so when things take place which affects it, it affects me.

Granted, my objectivity of Mancini's man-management might be biased, but it's formed by people who have experience of it.

I'm off to Switzerland, I hear they can put people out of their misery for the right price ;)