Didsbury_Till_I_Die said:Champions League is of a higher quality than international football these days, so all this 'he needs to win a world cup' is nonsense IMO, has won CL finals against much tougher competition than any other national team.
Robbo. said:NipHolmes said:bluemoon32 said:No, no he's not.
Impossible to say as fact and purely down to opinion. However compare stats for same age. Messi buys and sells diego. Not even close, look at Balon D'ors, at a time when Ronaldo is here too. Look at goals to game record, also look at his record in European Cup/CL.
When all is said and done. Lionel will be the man.
wow!!
I did stop reading then
kiam06 said:Pele
Big gap
The rest.
That is what makes winning a world cup so special. You have so few chances, you are outside your comfort zone. That is truly where the cream rises to the top and Messi has failed.SuperYaya said:Messi is comfortably better in my opinion.
Not winning a world cup is a poor argument against him. First of all a player will only ever get 3 or so attempts at doing so. What if in every single attempt a horrible turn of luck knocks them out? Not that unlikely considering it only needs to happen in 3 games. Would Messi suddenly become a worse player if Argentina are given a very harsh red and a penalty goes against them that costs the game?
Secondly it's international so a player has no say in what team he plays for. Domestically cream will rise to the top. The best players will go to the best teams and win trophies. Internationally that can't happen. What if Messi was exactly the same player but had been born in some footballing armpit like Khazakstan? Again, if he's exactly the same just from a different country, would he be a worse player? No. Would it stop him winning a world cup? More than likely.
Robbo. said:bluemoon32 said:NipHolmes said:Impossible to say as fact and purely down to opinion. However compare stats for same age. Messi buys and sells diego. Not even close, look at Balon D'ors, at a time when Ronaldo is here too. Look at goals to game record, also look at his record in European Cup/CL.
When all is said and done. Lionel will be the man.
Messi is a fantastic player but he's been fortunate to also play in one of the worlds greatest sides ever, Maradona wasn't as fortunate.
Either way they are both legends of the game but it's still Maradona for me.
this all day long....Messi great player, but Maradona just played for a new team and that team was the best around
He's had 1 world cup (2006 doesn't count, he was 18 and coming off the bench for 10 minutes every game). Maradona didn't have a clue how to manage that team and they almost didn't even qualify he was that inept.supercrystal7 said:Allowances can be made for certain players, but Messi plays for Argentina one of the strongest team in the world. He has no excuse on that part. It is a glaring failing and I don't see how people can defend it. He has not even taken Argentina to a final.
Shadz69 said:I loved watching Maradona as I now do Messi but traditionally to be considered for title of world's best you need a world cup winners medal.I hope messi gets one or that will be the argument used against him.
Still just about Maradona for me.
Of course 2006 counts. Pele had won the world cup a year younger. Ronaldo made a much bigger impact in 98. However, it is not just world cups, what about Copa America's? It's not just that he has failed to win any of them, he has not set the tournaments alight.conormcfc said:He's had 1 world cup (2006 doesn't count, he was 18 and coming off the bench for 10 minutes every game). Maradona didn't have a clue how to manage that team and they almost didn't even qualify he was that inept.supercrystal7 said:Allowances can be made for certain players, but Messi plays for Argentina one of the strongest team in the world. He has no excuse on that part. It is a glaring failing and I don't see how people can defend it. He has not even taken Argentina to a final.
So because he was playing in a team managed by a buffoon and contained one of the worst defensive units I've ever seen (Jonas Gutierrez at full back anyone?), that means Messi should have an asterisk over his career? That's bollocks.
Fowlers Penalty Miss said:Every generation produces the 'best ever' player. Pele, Maradona, Cruyff, Zidane, Puscas, Messi.
I never saw Puscas play, but I've seen all the others, and for me, the one player I saw and was just incredible to watch was George Best.
He had everything all those players had and more.
He could tackle, he could head, he could pass the ball, but he could dance around players with such ease when the tackles were flying in, it had to be seen to be believed.
Messi is the first player I have seen that approaches Best's skill levels, but he isn't as good as Best. I've never seen Messi evade a challenge, turn round, and skip over the trailing foot again!
Best did it all the time, for fun, then go and stick the ball in the net. Ok, that maybe a bit romantic, but anyone who saw him play knows what I mean.
It's a shame he is never named in anyones best team of all time, maybe it's because he never played in a world cup, but he is, in my mind, the greatest, most complete footballer I have ever seen.
And I've seen a few goodun's in my time.