PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

The one alleged breach I have always wondered about is the Etisalat payments. It was dismissed from the CAS findings by time barred but the evidence saying we did something wrongs seems pretty solid. Anyone know something about this that I may have missed?
 
Dribble said:
I've learned so much the last 24 hours, that I've had to shift my views accordingly.

I've been stating that the PL have charged us without viewing our "irrefutable evidence", but I now believe I was mistaken.

My evolved view is that since all this started in 2018, the PL have leveled their accusations at City, & City have provided our defence evidence.

It also seems both parties differed on two substantive points.

1. The PL wanted full unrestricted access to our accounts & internal records, but City said no.

2. City wanted the process to be private & confidential, but the Law Courts disagreed & said the process was of public interest.

In respect to point one, City told the PL to be specific about their allegations & we'd provide the relevant defence evidence, as opposed to the PL going on a fishing trip & poring through all our confidential internal business records to see what they could find.

In respect to point two, fearing reputational damage, City wanted to keep the investigation process private & confidential & without leaks, as we experienced with UEFA. The courts disagreed.

I now believe the PL have gone through our evidence, but were caught flat footed by the Government's Independent Regulator for English Football (IREF) announcement in February 2023.

Panicked, the PL rushed out their judgement filled with administrative errors by citing the wrong PL rule book indeces, which they embarrassingly had to correct.

City denied any wrong doing & appealed the PL's ruling, so another three members from the PL's internal 6-person independent adjudication panel were selected to review the charges, evidence & defence again.

This is where I believe myself, & most of us have been mistaken. It took the PL FIVE YEARS to come to their rushed decision in February, so I feel expert onlookers have estimated the appeals process will take at least two years to complete, but could easily stretch to four years!

The reason no information about the appeal is being circulated by the PL or City is because the whole process is private & confidential, & when it's complete, the PL appeals panel will publish its verdict on the PL's website.

The time being taken now isn't because the PL have only just asked City for our evidence, which would take years to go through. I now firmly believe they've had our evidence all along, but because of the volume of PL charge evidence & City's defence evidence that the PL's appeal panel will have to wade through, it could take nearly as long again to review the tribunal bundles.

As always, if I'm wrong I'm more than happy to hold my hands up, & in this latest FFP case against City, I believe I've been calling this wrong.

This post now hopefully adjusts my considered view accordingly.

In Conclusion:

I doubt there's any fresh charges coming, or any new defence evidence being offered. Everything surrounding this hearing has already been submitted & adjudicated on.

The PL found us guilty on 115 charges & City have appealed their verdict. Another three members from the PL's 6-person appeals panel have been selected to review the case again, & this is estimated to take between two - four years.

The PL's appeal panel decision will be final & City can't appeal their verdict to the Law Courts, UNLESS it's to do with issues relating to the actual appeals process.

We know who the PL clubs are who're desperate to get City, which honestly doesn't bode well.

HOWEVER, before anyone starts stringing up a noose, don't forget IREF! This is the spanner in the works none of the old Sky 4, the Hateful Eight, or the PL were expecting.

I'm not holding out much hope the appeals panel will find any different to the PL's original 115 charges, BUT I believe IREF & ultimately the UK Law Courts will, just as CAS did.

It's game on folks & we're in a proper scrap with an organisation run by a cartel of legacy clubs who want us gone.

They tried to strangle us at birth, so their dominance could never be challenged by new money, so just like any progressive business would, City found LEGAL ways around UEFA & the PL's self serving FFP rules.

I believe this fight will come down to UK Sovereign Law vs the PL's Rules. This is why I believe IREF is our only & best way forward. )(
Click to expand...
Explain this IREF ?

"HOWEVER, before anyone starts stringing up a noose, don't forget IREF! This is the spanner in the works none of the old Sky 4, the Hateful Eight, or the PL were expecting."
 
Cobwebcat said:
Yes I should have said the Independent panel the PL has referred the case to.
Click to expand...
But i
Dribble said:
I've learned so much the last 24 hours, that I've had to shift my views accordingly.

I've been stating that the PL have charged us without viewing our "irrefutable evidence", but I now believe I was mistaken.

My evolved view is that since all this started in 2018, the PL have leveled their accusations at City, & City have provided our defence evidence.

It also seems both parties differed on two substantive points.

1. The PL wanted full unrestricted access to our accounts & internal records, but City said no.

2. City wanted the process to be private & confidential, but the Law Courts disagreed & said the process was of public interest.

In respect to point one, City told the PL to be specific about their allegations & we'd provide the relevant defence evidence, as opposed to the PL going on a fishing trip & poring through all our confidential internal business records to see what they could find.

In respect to point two, fearing reputational damage, City wanted to keep the investigation process private & confidential & without leaks, as we experienced with UEFA. The courts disagreed.

I now believe the PL have gone through our evidence, but were caught flat footed by the Government's Independent Regulator for English Football (IREF) announcement in February 2023.

Panicked, the PL rushed out their judgement filled with administrative errors by citing the wrong PL rule book indeces, which they embarrassingly had to correct.

City denied any wrong doing & appealed the PL's ruling, so another three members from the PL's internal 6-person independent adjudication panel were selected to review the charges, evidence & defence again.

This is where I believe myself, & most of us have been mistaken. It took the PL FIVE YEARS to come to their rushed decision in February, so I feel expert onlookers have estimated the appeals process will take at least two years to complete, but could easily stretch to four years!

The reason no information about the appeal is being circulated by the PL or City is because the whole process is private & confidential, & when it's complete, the PL appeals panel will publish its verdict on the PL's website.

The time being taken now isn't because the PL have only just asked City for our evidence, which would take years to go through. I now firmly believe they've had our evidence all along, but because of the volume of PL charge evidence & City's defence evidence that the PL's appeal panel will have to wade through, it could take nearly as long again to review the tribunal bundles.

As always, if I'm wrong I'm more than happy to hold my hands up, & in this latest FFP case against City, I believe I've been calling this wrong.

This post now hopefully adjusts my considered view accordingly.

In Conclusion:

I doubt there's any fresh charges coming, or any new defence evidence being offered. Everything surrounding this hearing has already been submitted & adjudicated on.

The PL found us guilty on 115 charges & City have appealed their verdict. Another three members from the PL's 6-person appeals panel have been selected to review the case again, & this is estimated to take between two - four years.

The PL's appeal panel decision will be final & City can't appeal their verdict to the Law Courts, UNLESS it's to do with issues relating to the actual appeals process.

We know who the PL clubs are who're desperate to get City, which honestly doesn't bode well.

HOWEVER, before anyone starts stringing up a noose, don't forget IREF! This is the spanner in the works none of the old Sky 4, the Hateful Eight, or the PL were expecting.

I'm not holding out much hope the appeals panel will find any different to the PL's original 115 charges, BUT I believe IREF & ultimately the UK Law Courts will, just as CAS did.

It's game on folks & we're in a proper scrap with an organisation run by a cartel of legacy clubs who want us gone.

They tried to strangle us at birth, so their dominance could never be challenged by new money, so just like any progressive business would, City found LEGAL ways around UEFA & the PL's self serving FFP rules.

I believe this fight will come down to UK Sovereign Law vs the PL's Rules. This is why I believe IREF is our only & best way forward. )(
Click to expand...
City have been charged but this has not been heard yet so any talk of appeals panel is a bit premature. The way I see it is city went to court to get a ruling on what/if they had to disclose and then did so. The PL one would assume looked at this and felt there is a case to answer
halfcenturyup said:
You are right. Everton were charged, the "independent" panel found for the PL and a sanction was levied. Everton have appealed, so there will be a new "independent" appeals panel. City can follow the same appeals procedure if the panel finds for the PL in our case.

After the appeals panel, there is a final right of appeal, on certain limited matters, to an actual tribunal, more like CAS.
Click to expand...
Everton have appealed the sanction and not the actual decision that they are guilty (as they claimed guilty from the start)
 
Oldham Exile said:
Thanks - perhaps that should have been obvious - but I am still a little confused

I thought that they had been charged - they admitted guilt - the case was then referred to the panel (as ours is currently being) and that the PL wanted a 12 point penalty and the panel have given a 10 point penalty

So I thought that they were at 'the next stage' and therefore there should be no further appeal

In my defence - I have been away golfing so only been reading snippets
Click to expand...
I can’t even be sure I’m right. It’s my best guess.

The whole thing is madness for no reason other than to help United.
 
halfcenturyup said:
And United breaching UEFA FFP? The PL seem to think any breach in the PL should be a 6 point deduction. Not so fussed about UEFA breaches then?
Click to expand...
Regarding the rags breaching UEFA FFP but not the PL FFP, I believe that all hinges around UEFA FFP not allowing as large a write-off for Covid lockdown losses as the PL's version. So it was quite possible for a club to fail UEFA FFP for that period but pass the PL FFP.
 
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