PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

dadnlad said:
isnt he claiming another stolen email miraculouly turned up after CAS saying something other than witness statment
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As far as I know the detail from the uefa charge that went to cas has never been fully released.

So how can someone know there is discrepancies with some other information.

The club are excellent at keeping things on the quiet. No-one has a clue about what evidence is being considered, we can guess its similar to the stuff in the German press but that was effectively stolen so not sure it's admissible.

Bottom line the PL have to prove that the sponsorship income was effectively not 3rd party and was from the owners.

If they can't do that then it all falls down.
 
M18CTID said:
Jordan back to being a **** again and peddling conspiracy theories about the panel. I’d also like him to explain what the inconsistencies were in the witness statements given to CAS.
How Stefan manages to keep so calm in the face of such confrontational bullshit is beyond me!
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He doesn't know what he's talking about and Stefan knows it's a waste of time even trying to argue with him. He suggests City are being obstructive, that there are examples of large scale fraud or conspiracies/scandals (Enron and the Post Office) and his obsession with our owners being dodgy means he concludes we must be guilty. I would have liked Stefan to ask him how many other scandals of such nature he can name...there's a reason these things stick in the mind, and that's because they don't happen very fucking often!

As Stefan says, if we were trying to get away with something it would be incredibly odd to have been willing to take it this far. There weren't inconsistencies at CAS, I don't believe Jordan has ever read that decision - not in any depth. He still thinks we were guilty but for loopholes and that the fine amounts to guilt in any case.
 
halfcenturyup said:
Agreed about the proof. Seems to me the PL won't have had access during the investigation to the external information they need and won't have access to it in front of the panel, at least not in the form they would need it, to prove the serious allegations even if the club did do what is alleged.
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Absolutely. As I read them (and I am most definitely a novice in these matters), the rules on financial disclosure only apply to the Club or the group that it is a member of (which in our case is CFG). The alleged disguised funding would have taken place between ADUG and the sponsoring companies. In the event the Premier league had access to their information, you would expect that if everything is clean then there will be nothing to see and, if there is some practice going on which infringes the rules, then there will also be nothing to see. Either way there will be nothing to see.
 
M18CTID said:
Jordan back to being a **** again and peddling conspiracy theories about the panel. I’d also like him to explain what the inconsistencies were in the witness statements given to CAS.
How Stefan manages to keep so calm in the face of such confrontational bullshit is beyond me!
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Right at the end he says i might be 60 by the time they get sanctioned. i do think Jordan is funny, it is no wonder he lost so much money in football, he even blames City going to CAS for dragging it out, funny funny man
 
salfordbluetrue said:
Right at the end he says i might be 60 by the time they get sanctioned. i do think Jordan is funny, it is no wonder he lost so much money in football, he even blames City going to CAS for dragging it out, funny funny man
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You can see why he wasn't cut out to be a football chairman - brash, abrasive, impulsive. To be fair, those qualities probably brought about his wealth initially, but he simply doesn't have the temperament to run a large business successfully over a sustained period of time. Contrast Jordan with Khaldoon and you'll learn something about business.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
My understanding is that UEFA set the rules but the PL have to 'sign off' our submission and are effectively the delegated authority for issuing the FFP licence.

It's a bit like getting insurance through a broker like Swinton. The insurer will supply the underwriting guidelines and rates but unless there's a problem, Swinton will issue the policy on their delegated authority.
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Yes, that's about it. I was hoping I wouldn't have to get stuck into another set of bloody rules, but here we are :)

Seems to me it's a bit of both.

The club's have to send the information UEFA want to the PL each year, the PL reviews it and decides whether it complies with the requirements (including the directors representing the information is complete and accurate, although I can't find anything about good faith. I suppose that is a requirement if the Swiss code in any case?).

If it complies, they issue the annual UEFA licence and send everything to UEFA.

The actual FFP monitoring, though, is done by the CFCB (on a three year basis as we know) on the basis of the information provided by the PL.

Just from a quick reading. Happy to accept there may be more to it.
 
John Wayne said:
Not really much point in Stefan turning up a) because Jordan has a closed mind, and b) nothing has actually changed since he was last in the studio.
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he's earning a living more power to his elbow
i didnt hear it today just clip on here but wasnt he in to talk about more yanks buying a football club closed shop incoming
 
dadnlad said:
isnt he claiming another stolen email miraculouly turned up after CAS saying something other than witness statment
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There was one e-mail that Der Spiegel pulled out of their arse a couple of weeks after the CAS verdict didn’t go their way. They claim it proved that Simon Pearce lied on oath but from memory it was just in a similar vein to the e-mails that City successfully defended against at CAS. As such, @petrusha - who is a lot more qualified than me at assessing these things - dismissed it at the time as more re-hashed bollocks. And looking at it logically, if it truly was a smoking gun then why the fuck didn’t UEFA open a new investigation off the back of it? If Jordan is pinning his hopes on that then he’s a desperate fucker IMO.
 
Gordyola said:
Read somewhere that it was possible for him to contract the work out as it was a contract with his company
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I think I’d word it slightly differently, but yes, if it’s a UK Ltd company, he can employ someone else to fulfil the contractual obligations

Although the person he appoints to do the work has to be capable of delivering it to the required standard

I think that’s the only caveat if memory serves
 
HorlockofFiretopMountain said:
I'd be seriously surprised and disappointed if our transactional history (and that of our sponsors) showed anything other than we are squeaky clean, which I guess leads back to witness statements and whether or not you believe there is something meaningful which can be derived from the emails. Putting the CAS judgement to one side, I am not sure how emails could stand up against records of signed off, approved, authorised transactions. This is bread and butter stuff for any auditable industry.

I know there are other charges, but to me, the ones aimed at disguised shareholder funding feels like the most serious set.
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I had a discussion a while ago (yes, pretty much everything has been discussed in this thread) about how money in the UAE moves around the various government agencies and their investments and even the suppliers of their investments.

It seems it isn't unusual for monies for payee companies to be transferred in one amount to a particular supplier directly from the government agencies. And then the accounting sorts itself out. Maybe someone who knows the region better than I do can confirm that?

I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the confusion over funding and apparent explanations in emails relate to such payments from government agencies which seem very obscure and convoluted to a western mindset, but are perfectly normal and more convenient in a middle eastern mindset. It could even be possible that Mansour's personal wealth is handled by a government agency. I suppose it's possible that it took a few years for all that to be clarified and sorted into a more "western" procedure for the people at the club to get a better handle on

Just a thought.

May, of course, be complete bollocks.
 
GortonBlue62 said:
He was so 'calm' he failed to counter any of Jordan's anti City bullshit.
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We've been over it before. The best way to deal with the idea it is all a stitch is to show how ludicrous that suggestion looks in the face of a 12 week hearing, a 200 page + decision, a 5 year process, EIGHT PL barristers etc. But again, a) I don't have infinite time b) it is not my show c) I am not paid by City to defend them.
 
dadnlad said:
reading between lines they hope to discredit witnesses or one or more senior figures not showing up as all aged a few year since CAS
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Is this not a key reason many industries document and sign transactions or operations, to shift the reliance away from the memory or word of individuals, and provide a clear trail of certified information when historical proof or evidence is needed. I guess the Premier league will do it's best to drag the discourse away from that level of certainty and focus on portraying a scene of murky dealings in the background for which witnesses and what they share will become all important.
 
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