I think you are tying yourself up here. The panel need to find the case proven on a balance of probabilities and the burden is all the PLs to prove its case. There is no element of anyone proving innocence.
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PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules
- Thread starter ayrshire_blue
- Start date
dickie davies
Well-Known Member
If it's of any interest, City filed its appeal at the CAS in June 2019 and from what I can see, the hearing started in Feb 2020 and the decision was released in July 2020
Edit...
And IIRC, the CAS hearing took three days and the award was 93 pages
The PL hearing was four weeks, so God knows how many pages the award will be
Edit...
And IIRC, the CAS hearing took three days and the award was 93 pages
The PL hearing was four weeks, so God knows how many pages the award will be
Last edited:
give it to gordon
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Here's an example of how this shit impinges on normal life. I'm in a walking football club in the Midlands. Supporters of West Ham, villa, Southampton, wolves, Coventry and, of course, united, liverpool, spurs and arse.
A few weeks ago a liverpool supporter posted some shit about us cheating. I ignored it until the pile-on started when I just said "please fuck off with this shit". Well, of course, the scouser was all offended and I got a load of shit for being over sensitive. Anyway, it blows over.
Last night was the Christmas curry. I'm minding my own business talking football, price of replica shirts, admission, the future of football all perfectly amicable. Then an Arsenal fan chimes in, "I'm really enjoying watching City crash and burn". Now what do you say to that ?
As it's the season of goodwill, I was very polite and pointed out that I'd seen us win four in a row, win a treble, score a record number of goals and win a record number of points, seen Aguero, Silva, De Bruyne and Rodri at their peak, I can die happy. He then came out with a comment about cheating at which point I told him to fuck right off and it very nearly came to blows. It cast a cloud over the whole evening.
I should point out that not once did that bloke ever engage me in conversation to say something about the quality of football we were playing in our pomp, nor any word of praise. They are emboldened to think their opinion matters by the relentless negative press coverage.
I sometimes like to 'play' on YouTube comments when I'm bored.
I hate the way people are allowed to call us cheats without any come back. I ask them what the charges are etc and what his evidence you have.
I normally get abuse back, called names etc anything but answering any points you ask them !
My picture my name is my City tatt makes me laugh how many people say it's a shit tatt lol
That exactly what I am saying I just didn’t want to use the phrase balance of probabilities or any other probabilities as I wasn’t sure that was the right one my point was in response to someone who seem to think we had to prove our innocence or even go to court maybe thinking the panel would be our to get us tho they never said this bitI think you are tying yourself up here. The panel need to find the case proven on a balance of probabilities and the burden is all the PLs to prove its case. There is no element of anyone proving innocence.
I don't think it is directly relevant for a few reasons but worth noting that the CAS hearing was 3 days largely by remote regarding six emails and the decision still took 4 months!If it's of any interest, City filed its appeal at the CAS in June 2019 and from what I can see, the hearing started in Feb 2020 and the decision was released in July 2020
What sort of length are you expecting in terms of the judgment?I don't think it is directly relevant for a few reasons but worth noting that the CAS hearing was 3 days largely by remote regarding six emails and the decision still took 4 months!
CAS was 93 pages, feel like this one could be War and Peace.
Reason I ask is mainly to do with initial media response. As you know from APT and CAS, the media run with headlines without understanding or reading the document. So we actually have to wait a day or three for qualified people to read, digest, and contextualise it. CAS was closer to a couple of weeks. By that point, the media battle is lost and the myths have started.
Hundreds of pages 300-500?What sort of length are you expecting in terms of the judgment?
CAS was 93 pages, feel like this one could be War and Peace.
Reason I ask is mainly to do with initial media response. As you know from APT and CAS, the media run with headlines without understanding or reading the document. So we actually have to wait a day or three for qualified people to read, digest, and contextualise it. CAS was closer to a couple of weeks. By that point, the media battle is lost and the myths have started.
So realistically it's going to take a month for sensible people to be able to explain it all properly?Hundreds of pages 300-500?
You could have saved yourself a lot of grief by tossing them overboard as soon as you realised they were rags.Was minding my own business on a Musical Christmas Cruise on the Rhine in Cologne this afternoon when suddenly two rags appeared in front of me discussing last night's defeat at Tottenham
Centurions
Well-Known Member
Sensible people? Pfft, it'll take just 5 seconds for twatter to break it down.So realistically it's going to take a month for sensible people to be able to explain it all properly?
Centurions
Well-Known Member
Obviously I need to try harder ;)Not sure if you are trying to be insulting? but i will try again.
An independent UEFA panel found us guilty of everything, so we went to CAS, but before we went to CAS we informed them, we would not accept any charge without proof, even going to the point of going to the other arbitration panel, which would have ruined CAS, since their job is not to find guilt, but a path that both can accept, so they dismissed all the charges where there was no proof, and upheld non cooperation, even though it was not proven that UEFA had a right to access these papers.
Since then there have been other PL panels, most noticeably Leicester City, that have also found guilt without relying on the rules, indeed the independent regulator that illegally withheld City funding can be called a PL panel.
So we get to the 115,the first thing City did was object to the Arsenal fan judge, they did this to get the same assurances we got of CAS, since his name is going to be on any appeal
What is this "other arbitration panel, [who] would have ruined CAS" nonsense?
gordondaviesmoustache
Well-Known Member
Depends on the font size.What sort of length are you expecting in terms of the judgment?
I'll wait for the audio bookDepends on the font size.
For Fonts SakeDepends on the font size.
One page:What sort of length are you expecting in terms of the judgment?
CAS was 93 pages, feel like this one could be War and Peace.
Reason I ask is mainly to do with initial media response. As you know from APT and CAS, the media run with headlines without understanding or reading the document. So we actually have to wait a day or three for qualified people to read, digest, and contextualise it. CAS was closer to a couple of weeks. By that point, the media battle is lost and the myths have started.
“The premier league have proved none of the allegations against MCFC.
MCFC are awarded judgement 131 times.”
salfordbluetrue
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I have forgotten the name sorry, but it is a rarely used highly respected European arbitration service, and it is not them that would have ruined CAS`s name, it is the fact that an independent arbitration service, could not be trusted to find an impartial decision, when another could be proven to.Obviously I need to try harder ;)
What is this "other arbitration panel, [who] would have ruined CAS" nonsense?
Prestwich_Blue
Well-Known Member
I could be wrong but I'm not aware that UEFA's rules allow any other route to appeal a decision outside CAS.I have forgotten the name sorry, but it is a rarely used highly respected European arbitration service, and it is not them that would have ruined CAS`s name, it is the fact that an independent arbitration service, could not be trusted to find an impartial decision, when another could be proven to.
bobbyowenquiff
Well-Known Member
Self-interest always plays a part. It's just human nature. Like anyone else these Judges will consider their own reputations. They will err on the side of caution.My view is if, it is against City the panel will want to be 100% sure in their judgement, considering the implications for football and more so as to the status of whom they are accusing. Vice President of the UAE and also besmirching third party companies and casting doubt on the reputation of the auditors
oakiecokie
Well-Known Member
I`d be shocked if there were another body outside of CAS Colin.And why would we look elsewhere as I thought we had an option to chose one member as do UEFA and didn`t we also recommend AN Other which was agreed by UEFA to be the 3rd Member ?I could be wrong but I'm not aware that UEFA's rules allow any other route to appeal a decision outside CAS.
halfcenturyup
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I have forgotten the name sorry, but it is a rarely used highly respected European arbitration service, and it is not them that would have ruined CAS`s name, it is the fact that an independent arbitration service, could not be trusted to find an impartial decision, when another could be proven to.
Not sure where you got this from, but I think it's news to everyone else on here. Can you find any source for it?