Political relations between UK-EU

[Octavian]

Wait, what?? How can you possibly disagree with what was posted? What's your justification in saying people directly affected by the British government, even if not living there, don't have a right to comment?

You’ve completely misunderstood. He was talking about criticism of the population not the specific agreement or those making it.

 

[west didsblue]

There’s loons everywhere pal. I don’t think it’s my business what they vote for and I wouldn’t call them loons for voting a certain way.

Anyone who voted for Donald Trump and still supported him after 4 years is a fucking loon. Anyone who thinks the same about supporters of Johnson has some justification.

 

[BobKowalski]

I did, closely - right up until the Brexit vote and then largely stopped caring. Are you trying to rewrite history here?

TTIPs was alive and kicking when the Brexit referendum was given to us and there was no Trump being mr protectionist. EU leaders were still very much backing TTIPs before Brexit. It was only a couple of months later the wheels started to really fall off with senior ministers publicly talking about failure, but still their leaders backed it, eventually falling to Trump to sign its death certificate. It wasn’t the EU who said, fuck this it’s nonsense.

TTIPs had been mired in secrecy and demands for more transparency, court cases and so on. The EU tried their level best to push TTIPs upon us and went as far as saying we couldn’t stop laws being made in response to such criticism - they over reached and didn’t give a fuck, and the fact they even thought some parts of TTIPs were a good enough idea in the first place to write them down should put the fear of god into anyone. There was a strong desire to try and get TTIPs over the line by the end of Obama’s term in 2016 - however Brexit took the wind out of those particular sails given the UK accounted for 25% of US exports to the bloc. That’s not to say TTIPs wouldn’t have been “worth” doing or even possible with a remain vote, but it did hit the impetus and what happened next? Oh ministers coming out and saying it looks like it might fail.

The failure of TTIPs and Brexit severely damaged the EUs reputation globally. They won’t be caught like that again and have already this year made moves to remove member states ability to reject certain parts of trade agreements, and they are revisiting TIPPs although it’s called something else now… first port of call? Regulatory alignment… wasn’t that the whole furore around hormone in beef and chlorinated chicken? The EU need trade agreements for growth, and none come bigger than an EU-US agreement.

The German Govt signalled in 2016 that negotiations with the US had failed and that everyone was in denial mode and this was prior to Trump. Hilary Clinton also stated she would halt negotiations in the run up to the 2016 election.

Trying to eliminate non-tariff barriers between the two blocs that set their own standards was always an ambitious task and was always going to flounder on the vested interests of the two blocs. This trampling on vested interests was partly why everything was kept so secret, but in a bloc of nearly 30 countries, each with their own agenda, good luck with that.

The UK will have a ‘trade deal’ with the US long before the EU, and by long before I mean there never will be a formal overall deal between the EU and US. The UK‘s vested interests, food standards etc, will be the first thing in the crapper in the event of a deal.

Your vote just from a tactical viewpoint makes zero sense which is why I don’t buy it.

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

I’ll answer this once to no one poster in particular, to all of you and be gone.
Quite frankly I’m sick of being told what I was ‘insinuating’ and who I was talking about. What I have the right to comment on and what I don’t.

The word loon’ seems to be contentious and I regret not having articulated myself better. If that is offensive I apologise but I really take no responsibility for someone else not understanding what really was a simple enough initial post and I have since tried to clarify but yet words are being metaphorically put in my mouth that are so far from the truth that, if I was thin skinned, I may just find myself equally or more offended.
I have never been abusive to anyone on this forum and I’m not about to start now.

I have written in the various threads in the political forum down through the years, although not so much lately and I’m being reminded why.
I have contributed in the Irish politics, Brexit and the UK-EU, which I assumed included a view from the EU. If that’s not welcome. Fine. I’ve no problem abstaining again.

But my view has been consistent through all of those threads regarding the British public. I pretty much agree with my main critique in here lately, that the British public had the right to choose democratically for Brexit and to endorse the government that supported it. That’s what democracy is.
My only input throughout the ensuing years has been where it concerns Irish/UK relations and in particular NI/Irish relationships and a keen interest in understanding NI/UK relationships.

So my position is very clear.
I consider your government totally untrustworthy. How that is portrayed to the British public is your concern and it’s your problem to deal with if indeed you see it as a problem. From our position trying to deal with them in what are very sensitive issues from our perspective, that transcend mere Brexit, they are transparent.
Nobody over here doesn’t see through them. That is the point.Whatever your internal perceptions of them, we have our own and we see it as very important as they seem destined through design or lack of it, to set UK/IRL relations back thirty years or so. Never mind UK/EU.

I have a great interest in whether a certain part of the UK namely NI sees through them or not. I know the DUP will support them for their own aims but they would be dropped in an instant when it suits by Boris & Co.
Neither give a damn about the GFA, but as I have stated before it is the only protection they have and if I was a unionist I would not be so quick to let it be thorn up.

So my main point was a simple one.
The view from the outside is transparent.
That’s hard to negotiate with in good faith.
It’s considered a bad look.

I’ll leave you all to it.

 

[Shadz69]

I just don’t particularly like people who don’t live here telling us what’s what. You’re completely entitled to complain about the Irish border issues as it’s an issue you that affects you. About what else goes on in the UK politically is none of your business. I wouldn’t dream of criticising Irish people who voted for their own leaders even if the leaders were poor as it’s none of my business. By him mentioning loons he’s essentially saying that’s why the current government are in. Issues with the Uk gov are issues for Uk citizens and the Irish need to stay out of that as agreed in 1922.

This is my last on this, a lot of your politics affects Irish politics. Over the last few years a number of British politicians made various statements about Ireland from blockades to being EU puppets. The UK doesn't exist in isolation and most definitely doesn't have the influence it once enjoyed but actions by the UK affect others and vice versa. It must be a terribly small world you live in only listening to your own kind.
A lot of posters understand that whats being said isn't nasty or spiteful but a reflection of your government.

 

[i kne albert davy]

I’ll answer this once to no one poster in particular, to all of you and be gone.
Quite frankly I’m sick of being told what I was ‘insinuating’ and who I was talking about. What I have the right to comment on and what I don’t.

The word loon’ seems to be contentious and I regret not having articulated myself better. If that is offensive I apologise but I really take no responsibility for someone else not understanding what really was a simple enough initial post and I have since tried to clarify but yet words are being metaphorically put in my mouth that are so far from the truth that, if I was thin skinned, I may just find myself equally or more offended.
I have never been abusive to anyone on this forum and I’m not about to start now.

I have written in the various threads in the political forum down through the years, although not so much lately and I’m being reminded why.
I have contributed in the Irish politics, Brexit and the UK-EU, which I assumed included a view from the EU. If that’s not welcome. Fine. I’ve no problem abstaining again.

But my view has been consistent through all of those threads regarding the British public. I pretty much agree with my main critique in here lately, that the British public had the right to choose democratically for Brexit and to endorse the government that supported it. That’s what democracy is.
My only input throughout the ensuing years has been where it concerns Irish/UK relations and in particular NI/Irish relationships and a keen interest in understanding NI/UK relationships.

So my position is very clear.
I consider your government totally untrustworthy. How that is portrayed to the British public is your concern and it’s your problem to deal with if indeed you see it as a problem. From our position trying to deal with them in what are very sensitive issues from our perspective, that transcend mere Brexit, they are transparent.
Nobody over here doesn’t see through them. That is the point.Whatever your internal perceptions of them, we have our own and we see it as very important as they seem destined through design or lack of it, to set UK/IRL relations back thirty years or so. Never mind UK/EU.

I have a great interest in whether a certain part of the UK namely NI sees through them or not. I know the DUP will support them for their own aims but they would be dropped in an instant when it suits by Boris & Co.
Neither give a damn about the GFA, but as I have stated before it is the only protection they have and if I was a unionist I would not be so quick to let it be thorn up.

So my main point was a simple one.
The view from the outside is transparent.
That’s hard to negotiate with in good faith.
It’s considered a bad look.

I’ll leave you all to it.

Good post mate I have a different view on the EU but I respect your right to post your feelings on the subject especially the situation between the North and South of Ireland which you are probably more knowledgeable than most on here. ,this is a City fan forum so doesn't limit it to people from the UK

 

[Saddleworth2]

Nice that you can speak for the rest of the world.

I think your main problem is being kept up to date on the UK’s politics by this website.

Nobody actually out there in the real world talks about Brexit anymore and life has gone on as before, other than the glaring obvious with the pandemic.

What Real World is this mate?
Brexit still features quite heavily when trade or immigration is discussed. The present view of the U.K. is largely down to the competence and integrity of the present government. Can you name one current foreign policy that reflects well on us?
We are nothing less than a shambles.

 

[Saddleworth2]

I’ll answer this once to no one poster in particular, to all of you and be gone.
Quite frankly I’m sick of being told what I was ‘insinuating’ and who I was talking about. What I have the right to comment on and what I don’t.

The word loon’ seems to be contentious and I regret not having articulated myself better. If that is offensive I apologise but I really take no responsibility for someone else not understanding what really was a simple enough initial post and I have since tried to clarify but yet words are being metaphorically put in my mouth that are so far from the truth that, if I was thin skinned, I may just find myself equally or more offended.
I have never been abusive to anyone on this forum and I’m not about to start now.

I have written in the various threads in the political forum down through the years, although not so much lately and I’m being reminded why.
I have contributed in the Irish politics, Brexit and the UK-EU, which I assumed included a view from the EU. If that’s not welcome. Fine. I’ve no problem abstaining again.

But my view has been consistent through all of those threads regarding the British public. I pretty much agree with my main critique in here lately, that the British public had the right to choose democratically for Brexit and to endorse the government that supported it. That’s what democracy is.
My only input throughout the ensuing years has been where it concerns Irish/UK relations and in particular NI/Irish relationships and a keen interest in understanding NI/UK relationships.

So my position is very clear.
I consider your government totally untrustworthy. How that is portrayed to the British public is your concern and it’s your problem to deal with if indeed you see it as a problem. From our position trying to deal with them in what are very sensitive issues from our perspective, that transcend mere Brexit, they are transparent.
Nobody over here doesn’t see through them. That is the point.Whatever your internal perceptions of them, we have our own and we see it as very important as they seem destined through design or lack of it, to set UK/IRL relations back thirty years or so. Never mind UK/EU.

I have a great interest in whether a certain part of the UK namely NI sees through them or not. I know the DUP will support them for their own aims but they would be dropped in an instant when it suits by Boris & Co.
Neither give a damn about the GFA, but as I have stated before it is the only protection they have and if I was a unionist I would not be so quick to let it be thorn up.

So my main point was a simple one.
The view from the outside is transparent.
That’s hard to negotiate with in good faith.
It’s considered a bad look.

I’ll leave you all to it.

Don’t abandon our politics threads mate. The Irish view is one we should always hear. Our history and our future will continue to be intertwined.

 

[Octavian]

What Real World is this mate?
Brexit still features quite heavily when trade or immigration is discussed. The present view of the U.K. is largely down to the competence and integrity of the present government. Can you name one current foreign policy that reflects well on us?
We are nothing less than a shambles.

I’m not bothered about discussing the ins and outs of the current government and policy, it was mostly the point on people that aren’t British and don’t live here chiming in with criticisms of the voting population.

He’s clarified his position and it’s gone on as a discussion far longer than it needed to.

 

[joe123]

He’s clarified his position and it’s gone on as a discussion far longer than it needed to.

Correct. It should've been nipped in the bud after the initial nonsense about people not being able to talk about British voters.

Loons, however might have been the wrong word. Cunts would've done.