Previous UK government ‘covered up’ financial turmoil ahead of election

Saddleworth2 said:
after the decades of gaslighting, incompetence, dishonesty, corruption and downright nastiness of the last Government I find it astonishing the numbers that still come on here attacking the new Government. Action is needed and not all of it will be palatable. The alternative is as a country we continue to spiral downwards into the pit the Tories have crafted.
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To be fair, it’s just the zealots at this point.

Plenty of reasonable Tory blues have and continue to acknowledge the incompetence and corruption of the previous government and have said they support Labour attempts to right the ship.
 
SebastianBlue said:
Who was defining being rich as “owning personal possessions above £6k”?

Did you mean to respond to some else?
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….I quoted your post where you mentioned the tories would be convincing constituents that it’s a ‘working people’s tax’ by convincing them they’ll pay it when they become rich…..I was pointing out that according to the Govt website you would pay CGT on personal possessions over £6k and hence don’t need to be rich to pay it…
 
Saddleworth2 said:
after the decades of gaslighting, incompetence, dishonesty, corruption and downright nastiness of the last Government I find it astonishing the numbers that still come on here attacking the new Government. Action is needed and not all of it will be palatable. The alternative is as a country we continue to spiral downwards into the pit the Tories have crafted.
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Their pain is deep
 
PPT said:
As I say, if the Tories had done it, there would be total uproar.
Labour do it and its all justifiable. Laughable.
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The Tories did much much worse in their tenure, now Labour are having to make these decisions to right the ship. Surely you are intelligent enough to know this, or are you?
 
SebastianBlue said:
But, as is so often the case, the Tories will convince their constituencies it is by saying “when you become rich, do you want to pay this”?
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Absolutely. It's a truly bizarre situation that so many people think IHT is unfair and would scrap it, when it affects so few people.

If you told the majority you were introducing a tax that would target just the richest few percent, they'd be all for it.
 
DenisLawBackHeel74 said:
….I quoted your post where you mentioned the tories would be convincing constituents that it’s a ‘working people’s tax’ by convincing them they’ll pay it when they become rich…..I was pointing out that according to the Govt website you would pay CGT on personal possessions over £6k and hence don’t need to be rich to pay it…
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I edited my post to clarify that I was referring to the ploy of making people that will never reach a level of wealth that CGT or any other tax policy targeted at the top wealth deciles would have any measurable impact believe that they will one day be wealthy and thus should oppose any rise in taxation on the wealthy. I see the confusion after the fact, so apologies.

But, related to that, how many outside of the top half of the wealth distribution do you believe would have to pay CGT in any given year, given it is paid on individual possessions over £6k?
 
Mazzarelli's Swiss Cheese said:
I think there is an element of economic sleight of hand going on with the tax bands remaining the same for so long. The triple lock looks like it will now put pensioners into the top band, and 30-60k is now where a lot fairly ordinary earners sit. My own job now puts me firmly in the 40p tax bracket whereas it was nowhere near that 10 years ago. Granted wages have gone up but nowhere near as much as prices and property so we are all getting poorer in real terms.
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There is definitely some of that going on, particularly in inflation-adjusting earnings creep. That is a flaw in the current system, though, and one that most policy analysts and economists have been pointing out from even before the pandemic. Much of those issues stem from having a truly historically long period of relative price stability that lulled policymakers in to ignoring the underlying dangers of inflation impacts on real wages and, subsequently, effective tax obligations (the old “it will always be sunny because the sun is out today” problem).

I think the Tories have absolutely jumped on that and have intentionally avoided correcting that flaw, though, as it benefits the narrative that overall wealth has increased amongst the lower ends of the wealth distribution.
 
DenisLawBackHeel74 said:

What you pay it on​

You pay Capital Gains Tax on the gain when you sell (or ‘dispose of’):

I wouldn’t say owning assets above £6k can be defined as being rich….nor having shares outside an isa or pep..
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And yet just 1% pay it every year.

Having over 6k of non housing/car assets isn't unusual, but how many have £6k+ of disposable assets that grow in value, that they need to sell in one tax year? Looking at the guidance, the suggestion is that it's paintings, antiques etc. Not your sofa and TV.

And how many have shares outside an ISA? Mostly people who are saving more than the £20k a year ISA limit?

And they would only be paying CGT on the gain, and then, even with the recent Tory cuts, it's only the gain above 3k in an individual year. That suggests having much more than £6k of shares, that you didn't put in an ISA. and also that you need to sell at once in order to have made a £3k profit.
 
Labour proving once again jobs for the boys.Unions already saying could be strike action over restorative pay rises.
Meanwhile pensioners will be dying off the cold.
This country needs a different way of electing cunts.The manifestos arwnot worth the paper they were printed on.
 
DenisLawBackHeel74 said:
It’s from the Govt website so no idea …
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They do give examples:

You may have to pay Capital Gains Tax if you make a profit (‘gain’) when you sell (or ‘dispose of’) a personal possession for £6,000 or more.

Possessions you may need to pay tax on include:

  • jewellery
  • paintings
  • antiques
  • coins and stamps
  • sets of things, eg matching vases or chessmen
You’ll need to work out your gain to find out whether you need to pay tax.
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I guess anyone can get lucky with an antique in the family, but let's be honest, these examples are mainly rich people stuff. I don't know many people who are selling second hand possessions for over 6 grand. The explanation there makes it clear that it's referring to a single possession being worth more than £6k, not a total value of multiple possessions (unless it's a set).

But personally, I don't really care whether it hits some people on a more modest income. Ultimately capital gains tax is aimed at unearned income, and I have very little sympathy for anyone arguing that they should be charged less tax on the profits from an antique they found, or a watch they bought, left in a drawer and sold for a profit, than they should on a year of working full time.
 
Not sure why they don’t put up the additional rate back up to 50% where it used to be. Anyone on £125k a year is not exactly poor.
 
MouldensChippy said:
Sounds like a preamble to some tax rises to me ?
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It certainly is. Those who think life is easier under labour may have a rude awakening. I am not taking political sides, I worked in central government for years under Tory/Labour and Coalition administrations and I know the previous Labour incumbents were pretty tough on tax and welfare claimants.Just saying. They are all as bad as each other imo.
 
bluenova said:
And yet just 1% pay it every year.

Having over 6k of non housing/car assets isn't unusual, but how many have £6k+ of disposable assets that grow in value, that they need to sell in one tax year? Looking at the guidance, the suggestion is that it's paintings, antiques etc. Not your sofa and TV.

And how many have shares outside an ISA? Mostly people who are saving more than the £20k a year ISA limit?

And they would only be paying CGT on the gain, and then, even with the recent Tory cuts, it's only the gain above 3k in an individual year. That suggests having much more than £6k of shares, that you didn't put in an ISA. and also that you need to sell at once in order to have made a £3k profit.
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In addition to this, my reading is that it is only paid on the gain realised on the sale of individual possessions worth £6,000 or more.

The frequency of those types of transactions for those in the bottom half of the wealth distribution is going to be very low (unfortunately, as it is an indication of the current rampant asset poverty).
 
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