Question Time

EU countries are exploring overseas processing of asylum claims within the framework of international law, EU law and ECHR obligations. The UK Rwanda scheme is not about overseas processing, but sending people to Rwanda without the option of having their cases heard. That is why the UK scheme is so egregious.

Greece has been found in breach by the ECHR, although given the reports of deliberate drownings and deaths by Greek authorities, I think we are way beyond breaches of international law.

The Tories post 2016 and, specifically under Johnson, sought to break established norms and codes of practice allowing us to reach a point where we deliberately craft laws with disregard to international law and allow public servants to place bets using insider information - a criminal offence - and no one is remotely surprised.

As I said I was merely pulling you up for saying that other countries act within ECHR and international law. They don’t.

Why you then have to turn this in to a “yeah but your serial killer is worse than mine” is beyond me. I’m sure you have a point to make but I can’t be arsed trying to decipher it.
 
Ultimately I believe the UK won’t have to leave the ECHR, because over the next 10-15 years or so they’ll be a dramatic shift in the mainstream political opinion across Europe towards the migration issue, and the sort of schemes which appear controversial now will become the norm. Any legal or constitutional impediments will simply be moved out of the way.

You only have to look at the global population projections and where that growth is concentrated to see the sort of pressure that migration will place on Europe. Expecting all of this to disappear with Rishi Sunak, like most of the people on here expect, simply isn’t rational.
What global population growth? It's nearly peaked.

Now climate change is another matter. I expect you'd think someone leaving their parched patch of earth was an economic migrant.
 
Would you have total faith in any new government that has no track record because the other side have been in power for 14 years?

What we know as fact is that under the current government people have on average got poorer, international trade is more difficult, the health service and education system have both got worse, corruption amongst politicians has gone through the roof, other public services have been cut right back, infrastructure spending has slowed right down and growth has been negligible.

There’s absolutely no justification for voting for more of the same. Anything a new government does can be judged once they’ve been in power for a while.
Someone expected the proof of the pudding before it's even on the table let alone eaten.
 
I’d agree with that but I’d counter the comment and say that anybody who has total faith in Labour atm is also going to struggle to get into MENSA
So if you have anything short of total faith in Labour you'd be OK in MENSA.

Are you doing this mangling of logic on purpose?
 
I do understand the difference, which is why I’ve used the term migration.

Migration correctly describes the increased displacement of people expected to develop as a consequence of the population growth projected for the next two decades. All major intergovernmental agencies refer to this as migration; some use the term irregular migration. You should also note that I referred to the challenges presented by migration in a Europe-wide context, rather than any individual country, which further supports to use of migration rather than asylum.

Thanks.

What I noted was that in the context of a comment about human rights issues in the context of asylum claims, you used the word migration as if the two were interchangeable.

You’re welcome.
 
A bit of faith, a lot of hope, and I expect the Tory meltdown to be a thing of glory.
Having lived through five Labour governments and watched them gradually dumb the country down, it makes me sad they’ll beelected. I know the ordinary working man will end up worse off. I am sad for our children and grandchildren because we’ll have to watch the same meltdown that we’ve watched before. No faith whatsoever, seen it all before and this bunch of liberal elites are worse than ever.
 
Having lived through five Labour governments and watched them gradually dumb the country down, it makes me sad they’ll beelected. I know the ordinary working man will end up worse off. I am sad for our children and grandchildren because we’ll have to watch the same meltdown that we’ve watched before. No faith whatsoever, seen it all before and this bunch of liberal elites are worse than ever.

You have literally lived through the worst government in history.

The NHS is not fit for purpose
Children cannot get dentists appointments.
Our justice system is broken.
The prisons are so full that the courts cannot send anyone there anyway.
Our civil service is massively overworked to the point that they cannot process the work, including immigration and asylum applications, that it receives.
Our military is rapidly losing capacity.
We do not have enough police, firefighters, teachers, nurses or doctors.
Our rivers and beaches are full of shit.

They absolutely trashed the economy, with dire consequences for homeowners and rent payers alike.

And it is a government that lies with impunity and thinks the rules don’t apply to them. That is why the Queen was lied to about the prorogation of Parliament, why Boris Johnson lied to Parliament, why parties were held during lockdown at number 10 and why in one last show of their rotten underbelly, the latest bunch of insider traders were using confidential knowledge to bet on the date of the election.

And your response is ‘But Labour?’

Seriously?
 
You have literally lived through the worst government in history.

The NHS is not fit for purpose
Children cannot get dentists appointments.
Our justice system is broken.
The prisons are so full that the courts cannot send anyone there anyway.
Our civil service is massively overworked to the point that they cannot process the work, including immigration and asylum applications, that it receives.
Our military is rapidly losing capacity.
We do not have enough police, firefighters, teachers, nurses or doctors.
Our rivers and beaches are full of shit.

They absolutely trashed the economy, with dire consequences for homeowners and rent payers alike.

And it is a government that lies with impunity and thinks the rules don’t apply to them. That is why the Queen was lied to about the prorogation of Parliament, why Boris Johnson lied to Parliament, why parties were held during lockdown at number 10 and why in one last show of their rotten underbelly, the latest bunch of insider traders were using confidential knowledge to bet on the date of the election.

And your response is ‘But Labour?’

Seriously?
Yes agree but I fear this next lot more, watch your pensions, they always raid something or saddle the country with debt. Growth, they know nothing about it.
 
Having lived through five Labour governments and watched them gradually dumb the country down, it makes me sad they’ll beelected. I know the ordinary working man will end up worse off. I am sad for our children and grandchildren because we’ll have to watch the same meltdown that we’ve watched before. No faith whatsoever, seen it all before and this bunch of liberal elites are worse than ever.
Can you elaborate e.g. in which way or measured against Sunak et al
 

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