Return of Supporters

[Deleted member 77198]

After reading some of the comments I feel I have to make my feelings felt. I got my first season ticket in 1974,( 16 years old) as I started work, I followed City home and away, travelled on Football specials, coaches and by car, missing very few games, 1986(28 years old) I got married so things had to change, I now had a mortgage and a wife, luckily she new what I was, and let me keep my season ticket, so I could go to all the home games, but away games were restricted to distance, unless it was a final. So I have had my season ticket for a lifetime and have only missed a hand full of home games,(Personal reasons) which averages one miss at home every 10 years ?. Around the time we moved to the new stadium a new Points system came into play, Loyalty Points, we were given 1,500 points at the time this was accepted but did it really show what we had all gone through, as we had all gone to hell and back on the biggest roller coaster ride ever ?. But we carried on, I have two adult children who I took to the games at a cost when they were younger but they were never interested so no longer go. City then started back in Europe, and my personal situation changed, I could afford to go, and my wife allowed me to go, so I have been very fortunate to have been to quite a few European trips, but 5 years ago circumstances changed again, and so all away games apart from Finals etc have stopped.
I have got 17,800 points, but this seems to be ridiculed, in some quarters, as maybe these points are from home games only ?, I respect anyone who has amassed Loyalty points, and who goes to every home game like myself, regardless of who we are playing and whatever the competition, we need to get the Stadium full, so to ridicule people for just attending home games is downright wrong, we want to see the stadium expanded with a Blue wall, the only way this will happen is if we fill the stadium first, so points for attending home games are very important if not more so than away games, as the club benefits more. I have rambled on to long, my point is that the Loyalty points system does work, if someone overtakes me on the points system great they deserve it, but also season cards are also important, as the Fans who buy them are committed to the club.
City Matters need to understand that there are many thousands of Loyal fans at the club who may not have all the points, but you need to consider the history of those same supporters who are being ridiculed.

You make your missus sound like a prison warden. No messing with her!

Indeed though. Everyone’s points have been accumulated in different ways. Some, like you, will have been going for decades and Loyalty Points just happened to come in decades after you started attending, so your loyalty to the club isn’t really represented in your points total. Whereas another fan might never have been arsed about City as a kid but their Dad dragged him along with their first game being 2001 on the first day LPs came in and he might be on well over 20k, but still never been that arsed about football, he just went along to spend time with his Dad. A third example could be a lad in his mid-20s, never attended as a kid as his parents didn’t like football but he was a mad City fan, managed to be able to afford to get tickets after finishing uni at 21 and now has a small number of points behind him but is someone prepared to follow the club like you did from 1974 and person #2 was from 2001.

Who’s more deserving of a ticket?

 

[percypawpaw]

I understand that, but I would say that that example is a rare one, a Football fan follows a similar path to life, when you are young and single you want to go and nothing can stop you, like my short story, you go home and away, until a time comes when they all settle down and get married, not always but on the whole yes, and they have kids etc. The current system has its faults I don't disagree, it has become more difficult for the younger supporter to get tickets and a change needs to come but not at the expense of guys who have gone all there lives.
I have seen many Supporters come and go over the years, at my age more have gone for many reasons. I want to see young people get the chance, I think we are mainly talking about away games, the distribution of away tickets needs to be debated but everyone needs to be involved, I back the idea we need to encourage the younger supporter, but without disrespecting the older supporter who has devoted his life to the club.

 

[percypawpaw]

You make your missus sound like a prison warden. No messing with her!

Indeed though. Everyone’s points have been accumulated in different ways. Some, like you, will have been going for decades and Loyalty Points just happened to come in decades after you started attending, so your loyalty to the club isn’t really represented in your points total. Whereas another fan might never have been arsed about City as a kid but their Dad dragged him along with their first game being 2001 on the first day LPs came in and he might be on well over 20k, but still never been that arsed about football, he just went along to spend time with his Dad. A third example could be a lad in his mid-20s, never attended as a kid as his parents didn’t like football but he was a mad City fan, managed to be able to afford to get tickets after finishing uni at 21 and now has a small number of points behind him but is someone prepared to follow the club like you did from 1974 and person #2 was from 2001.

Who’s more deserving of a ticket?

My comments were for yourself, and I do agree that something needs to change, a debate is needed to find a way forward.

 

[Trevor morleys tash]

I understand that, but I would say that that example is a rare one, a Football fan follows a similar path to life, when you are young and single you want to go and nothing can stop you, like my short story, you go home and away, until a time comes when they all settle down and get married, not always but on the whole yes, and they have kids etc. The current system has its faults I don't disagree, it has become more difficult for the younger supporter to get tickets and a change needs to come but not at the expense of guys who have gone all there lives.
I have seen many Supporters come and go over the years, at my age more have gone for many reasons. I want to see young people get the chance, I think we are mainly talking about away games, the distribution of away tickets needs to be debated but everyone needs to be involved, I back the idea we need to encourage the younger supporter, but without disrespecting the older supporter who has devoted his life to the club.

Sadly balancing that out is very tough and probably won't work.its one or the other.supporters clubs these days are full of young supporters between 18 and 30 you see at away games come from supporters clubs mainly.

 

[joenorth]

I'm interested to know how far back the club know the history of each fan , do they know if someone has a season ticket 40 years or so?

 

[bluekeith]

For all those on the reserve list put the kettle on grab some toast their go poop, and good luck .

 

[RegMuffin]

I'm interested to know how far back the club know the history of each fan , do they know if someone has a season ticket 40 years or so?

I've had mine for 40 years but don't fall into the Loyalty Window as set out in City's approach to what loyalty is....

One thing is for sure, the current system is broken and needs to change because if the divisive 22k affair shows anything, it's that the current system is too self fulfilling for the few and seriously alienating the many.

 

[Bandofblues]

You cannot just throw away the loyalty of fans who have gone for years.

My suggestion would be setting a flat rate of 50 points per game and a cap on loyalty points with those who exceed the cap retaining their points and prioritisation for tickets (at the moment).
Combine this with a new ballot style process based on loyalty points tiers with a minimum tier level to ensure that everyone in the ballot has a proven loyalty / attendance record.
In the next 3 years the number of tickets for those currently on the very higher points who exceed the cap gets reduced drawing people back into the ballot process.

Something like (and I haven't worked out the split it's just an example):

Loyalty point maximum cap: 10k points
Loyalty points tier minimum entry 1k points


Above cap : 1st priority at tickets - as now
9-10k points : 30% of remaining tickets via ballot
8-9k points : 20% of remaining tickets via ballot
7-8k points : 15% of remaining tickets via ballot
..
..
Down to 1-2k points of remaining tickets via ballot.

As the ticket allocation is weighted then all of the ballots would be able to run simultaneously so you wouldn't have a drawn out process of waiting days on end to find out if you have a ticket.

Then a general sale for any remaining tickets to anyone who didn't qualify via the ballot giving those who didn't get a ticket a 2nd chance if any remain.

Finally and only if tickets remain after this do they go to open sale.


This way you get an equal spread of fans and more likely an equal spread of ages as well. Those with the track record have greater chance of a ticket, those with fewer points still get a chance albeit a lesser chance.
Anyone would have to have attended a minimum of 20 matches to start to qualify for the ballots. Those below the cap only get a chance if tickets go to open sale.

No solution is perfect but a weighted ballot process is likely the best alternative to the current points process, and it's better than an open ballot.

Once such a process is established it would soon become routine.

 

[lancs blue]

I'm interested to know how far back the club know the history of each fan , do they know if someone has a season ticket 40 years or so?

No. They know as far back as the points scheme goes, effectively. Business records only have to be kept for up to 6 years after the accounting date so if there was no overriding reason for keeping them - such as the points scheme - it's unlikely s/t records would be kept for that long.

 

[joenorth]

I've had mine for 40 years but don't fall into the Loyalty Window as set out in City's approach to what loyalty is....

One thing is for sure, the current system is broken and needs to change because if the divisive 22k affair shows anything, it's that the current system is too self fulfilling for the few and seriously alienating the many.

I went to all the league Cup mid week games at maine Road and the etihad when the gate would be 13,ooo or so ,but like you say the club don't see that as loyalty.