Russian invasion of Ukraine

[flook]

I hate to defend trump but he didn't look to eliminate Nato.
There is agreement that every country spends, I believe, 2% of their budget on Nato defence. A number of countries especially Germany, hadn't been doing this for some time. Trump basically said, if you don't pay your dues we won't either.
The invasion of Ukraine has woken a lot of countries up, tbf to the orange one, that's what he was trying to do.

Who the fuck really knows what Trump would have done, the man was as out of control as Putin in his own way. From an interview with some dude from Bloomberg:

Halperin, March 23: Should America be the leader of NATO or not necessarily?

Trump: I think NATO may be obsolete. NATO was set up a long time ago — many, many years ago when things were different. Things are different now. We were a rich nation then. We had nothing but money. We had nothing but power. And you know, far more than we have today, in a true sense. And I think NATO — you have to really examine NATO. And it doesn’t really help us, it’s helping other countries. And I don’t think those other countries appreciate what we’re doing.

Heilemann: So, just to be clear, you made two slightly different arguments there and I just want to clarify. One of them is that you might want to see the U.S. pay less money into NATO because …

Trump: That one definitely. That one definitely.

Heilemann: But it’s possible that NATO is obsolete and should be gotten rid of?

Trump: It’s possible. It’s possible. I would certainly look at it. And I’d want more help from other people. The one thing definitely — we’re paying too much. As to whether or not it’s obsolete, I’ll make that determination.

 

[BlueAnorak]

If was playing wargames with Russian soilders like Putin is allegedly doing then I'd be pulling troops out of the Izyum salient to defend the Ukrain advance or within a week or so there could be the be the beginning of a Russian miliary disaster on his hands. (Kiev and Kharkiv being mere bagatelles.)

 

[When The Levee Breaks]

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

Maybe the world should turn a blind eye to it eh?

No.

finding explosions impressive is a bit voyeuristic when people are dying.

 

[AlgarveBlu]

I hate to defend trump but he didn't look to eliminate Nato.
There is agreement that every country spends, I believe, 2% of their budget on Nato defence. A number of countries especially Germany, hadn't been doing this for some time. Trump basically said, if you don't pay your dues we won't either.
The invasion of Ukraine has woken a lot of countries up, tbf to the orange one, that's what he was trying to do.

Who the fuck really knows what Trump would have done, the man was as out of control as Putin in his own way. From an interview with some dude from Bloomberg:

Halperin, March 23: Should America be the leader of NATO or not necessarily?

Trump: I think NATO may be obsolete. NATO was set up a long time ago — many, many years ago when things were different. Things are different now. We were a rich nation then. We had nothing but money. We had nothing but power. And you know, far more than we have today, in a true sense. And I think NATO — you have to really examine NATO. And it doesn’t really help us, it’s helping other countries. And I don’t think those other countries appreciate what we’re doing.

Heilemann: So, just to be clear, you made two slightly different arguments there and I just want to clarify. One of them is that you might want to see the U.S. pay less money into NATO because …

Trump: That one definitely. That one definitely.

Heilemann: But it’s possible that NATO is obsolete and should be gotten rid of?

Trump: It’s possible. It’s possible. I would certainly look at it. And I’d want more help from other people. The one thing definitely — we’re paying too much. As to whether or not it’s obsolete, I’ll make that determination.

Remember as well this is the man who stated the following in an interview after the invasion began :-

"The smartest one gets to the top," Trump told the crowd. "That didn't work so well recently in our country. But they ask me, 'Is Putin smart?' Yes, Putin was smart. And I actually thought he was going to be negotiating. I said, 'That's a hell of a way to negotiate, put 200,000 soldiers on the border.'"

So the man he admires so much for being smart has manged to expand Nato's borders by 800 KM on his door step the very thing he was trying to avoid with Ukraine, unify the EU on an actual policy which is no easy task, take the Russian economy back by about 20 years, trigger the migration of thousands of Russia's most talented people across the border, significantly degrade their fighting capability, vanquished any notion of Russia being a military force to be reckoned with and has also managed to ostracise Russia from all global sporting and cultural events for the foreseeable future. That's Trumps definition of smart??

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

I hate to defend trump but he didn't look to eliminate Nato.
There is agreement that every country spends, I believe, 2% of their budget on Nato defence. A number of countries especially Germany, hadn't been doing this for some time. Trump basically said, if you don't pay your dues we won't either.
The invasion of Ukraine has woken a lot of countries up, tbf to the orange one, that's what he was trying to do.

I hate trump but tbf what he was saying was fair.

His recent comments though, about how putin is bluffing with nukes, could have led us down a darker path.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

I hate to defend trump but he didn't look to eliminate Nato.
There is agreement that every country spends, I believe, 2% of their budget on Nato defence. A number of countries especially Germany, hadn't been doing this for some time. Trump basically said, if you don't pay your dues we won't either.
The invasion of Ukraine has woken a lot of countries up, tbf to the orange one, that's what he was trying to do.

Trump tried to blackmail Zelensky to smear Biden or lose aid.

Trump–Ukraine scandal - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I think we can similarly be pretty confident grift would also be what drove a Trump response to this war, as it did with literally everything else he ever did in his life.

The current US administration support for Ukraine has been exemplary.

 

[meltonblue]

I hate to defend trump but he didn't look to eliminate Nato.
There is agreement that every country spends, I believe, 2% of their budget on Nato defence. A number of countries especially Germany, hadn't been doing this for some time. Trump basically said, if you don't pay your dues we won't either.
The invasion of Ukraine has woken a lot of countries up, tbf to the orange one, that's what he was trying to do.

Depends where you read to be fair, there were plenty that thought Trump only said that at the time as an excuse.

With someone like him, I’d be very wary of assuming the underlying motivation and intent, whatever the words used. No one really knows!

 

[BlueAnorak]

No.

finding explosions impressive is a bit voyeuristic when people are dying.

So long as it's Russians whose track record dealing with Ukrainian civililians is seriously shite, I really don't give a fuck, let alione a flying fuck, to be honest. The more that die the better. Either they die or Ukrainian civilians die and/or suffer greatly. They can always surrender.
This revalation rathher shocks my caring sharing soul but their you go.

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

So long as it's Russians whose track record dealing with Ukrainian civililians is seriously shite, I really don't give a fuck, let alione a flying fuck, to be honest.

Not sure what you mean m8, flying fuck about what?