But what does Russia arm them with?
Mobilized trroops have been complaining for weeks about no armour,weapons etc.
No good putting 1,2,300k on the ground with absolute no protection,IMO.
Slava Ukraini.
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Russian invasion of Ukraine
- Thread starter feedmpenzaandhewillscore
- Start date
Mobilized trroops have been complaining for weeks about no armour,weapons etc.
No good putting 1,2,300k on the ground with absolute no protection,IMO.
Slava Ukraini.
cleavers
Moderator
Well not if you want to win, or care for the people anyway.No good putting 1,2,300k on the ground with absolute no protection,IMO.
bluesince76
Well-Known Member
Because the Russians famously get on with the Afghans... Putin's probably on a war crimes list there as wellThe sun is reporting putin trying to get the weapons America left in Afghan from the taliban
Gareth Barry Conlon
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This is part of the mystery. Are we saying Russia, biggest country and population of 140m can't manufacture its own basic kit? Or buy it from China?More likely fit them out with old gear and rusty rifles.
Are they that broke/corrupt/incompetent. Seems like they are. Does Putin just not care or is he not willing to do the work to make it happen?
grunge
Well-Known Member
This is part of the mystery. Are we saying Russia, biggest country and population of 140m can't manufacture its own basic kit? Or buy it from China?
Are they that broke/corrupt/incompetent. Seems like they are. Does Putin just not care or is he not willing to do the work to make it happen?
Well they are certainly sending out people with ww1 level hardware…
They are buying from North Korea and Iran, in all honesty I don’t think China will sell to them. Or if they are there has been no evidence of it.
The very fact they are buying from those 2 says there manufacturing is a mess.
roubaixtuesday
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This is part of the mystery. Are we saying Russia, biggest country and population of 140m can't manufacture its own basic kit? Or buy it from China?
Are they that broke/corrupt/incompetent. Seems like they are. Does Putin just not care or is he not willing to do the work to make it happen?
Priorities. Super yachts and palaces don't pay for themselves.
Your last paragraph probably answers it mate.This is part of the mystery. Are we saying Russia, biggest country and population of 140m can't manufacture its own basic kit? Or buy it from China?
Are they that broke/corrupt/incompetent. Seems like they are. Does Putin just not care or is he not willing to do the work to make it happen?
Svatove area,the Russians are getting slaughtered.....they have nothing.
Hand guns and machine guns is all they got......Ukrainian artillery picking them off......it's fuckin mental what is being asked of them,if i'm being honest.
Slava Ukraini.
Brightwell’s left peg
Well-Known Member
Fantastic insight…thanks for sharing.Slightly off topic
As the Abrahams is jet fuelled and it's a fact is uses twice the volume of a diesel MBT, I googled to find the answer and stumbled across this
How come only the US Army decided to use a gas turbine for its M1 Abrams main battle tank despite its advantages while all other countries chose diesel engines?
Despite?
The first thing that must be understood about the Abrams, the one piece of perspective that makes everything else about it make sense, is this:
In 1970, the United States decided it was possible to defeat the Warsaw Pact in conventional battle in Europe.
That's it. That's the show.
From 1950–1970, the Soviet juggernaut was considered invincible. Mutually Assured Destruction was the strategy. If the USSR had gone West in 1965, the NATO allies would have used up their available ground forces, then plastered most of everything from the Netherlands to Switzerland, Bonn to Moscow, with thermonuclear fire, then retreated to a handful of facilities and waited for the Soviet bombs to drop.
Nuclear Armageddon. The 7th Angel pouring their bowl forth. Game over, man.
Something weird happened in the 1970′s, though. The Space Race began to alter how the US saw itself, especially in comparison to the USSR. Remember, the West knew diddly-squat about the true state and power of the Communist East… until Apollo straight up left the Soviets eating dust.
The West also started to get better intelligence assets. Not Human ones, those had always been in the game, and by necessity taken with a grain of salt. No, the West started getting pictures from satellites. Started tapping in on phones with microwave antennas far above the Earth.
Started to find out that the Red Army was mostly a paper tiger.
In addition, Vietnam had really rattled a lot of American cages. It had become clear that draftees just… weren't good enough anymore. Not the levels of patriotism or verve the vast majority of draftees brought to the Service, but the time needed to make a modern warrior. A proper Infantryman now took nearly 18 months to train correctly. Tankers, aviators, sailors in Nuclear powered ships, they needed even longer to train. And so the United States and much of NATO (not all), went to volunteer units, who stayed in at least 4 years instead of 2.
The Soviets didn't.
A strange thing happens with volunteer forces. By virtue of greater practice and training, not to mention lots of people wanting a second hitch, or even a career, you start developing a really professional fighting force that knows what it is about. They can handle weapons systems that drafted Soldiers simply cannot learn in time to be useful.
And so weapons develop in complexity and power.
This brings me back to the Abrams. Its turbine was adopted at a time when Abrams was a lot lighter, and was governed to 50mph, not that much faster than other NATO tanks of the day. However, my father trained the 3rd Infantry Division's maintenance guys on their new Abrams back in the 80′s. In a pinch, a real pinch, that governor came right off and the engine worked just fine without it, allowing the Abrams to sprint at far greater speeds and still hit T-72 size targets at 1,000 meters or more.
See, the German Bundeswehr had to, for obvious reasons, defend every inch of their soil. Can't very well just allow the Soviets to march all the way to the Rhine and then start resisting. However, even the mighty US Army was not going to stop the whole Soviet Army right on the border, so the idea was this:
Set up in a line, foxholes, artillery aiming points, close air support to include A-10s, Apache helicopters, and F-16s, and wait. The Soviets would attack in Echelon, one regiment following the next. Remember, simpler tactics because their guys have not practiced as much. The NATO, especially American and British, units, were to rip the faces off that first echelon, kill as many Soviets as possible, and then disappear.
Pull back a kilometer or two, and get set in the same sort of positions. Do this again and again and again until the spearpoint of the Soviet Army, equipped by 1985 with T-62, T-72, and T-80 tanks, was destroyed. The Soviets would increasingly place their Category B divisions (broadly equivalent to US Army Reserve formations) in the field with older equipment.
And NATO would push into the attack.
The Abrams-equipped US Army would race forward, supported by British, French, and West German troops, would begin a blitzkrieg style assault across Germany, aiming generally at Moscow. Here, again, the turbine engine if the Abrams would shine once more, outpacing anything the enemy could throw up, annihilating support and maintenance battalions, and making further resistance by Soviet front line troops untenable.
Eventually, the Soviet Army or the Soviet leadership would collapse. Most leading thinkers on the subject figure the Soviet Union would release Nuclear weapons against a single target, probably in England, and then the United States would respond from Minuteman silos in the Continental United States to make the point- yes, MAD is still in effect. At which point, the current Soviet leadership would likely be overthrown and executed, and the matter settled at the conference table.
All of this to say that the US picked a turbine engine because blitzkrieg remains the best way to defeat Russia, and the United States does blitzkrieg better than anyone else.
AlgarveBlu
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The russian military lacks discipline, motivation, technology, strategy, experience (mobiks) and any real trust from the kremlin - well documented that even top army commanders didn’t even know about the invasion till the very last day . The secret police did know which is why it’s russias and Putin’s most important cabinet department and they are effectively a semi military operation that are russias last stand at their borders if the army collapses.This is part of the mystery. Are we saying Russia, biggest country and population of 140m can't manufacture its own basic kit? Or buy it from China?
Are they that broke/corrupt/incompetent. Seems like they are. Does Putin just not care or is he not willing to do the work to make it happen?
he’s miscalculated on a biblical scale and needs an out but with the illusion of some kind of a win to sell back to his people… he’s done in my opinion.
Mate,i seen photo's the other day,some Russians had been captured.Well they are certainly sending out people with ww1 level hardware…
They are buying from North Korea and Iran, in all honesty I don’t think China will sell to them. Or if they are there has been no evidence of it.
The very fact they are buying from those 2 says there manufacturing is a mess.
About 4 of them had womens knee high boots on,because they were better than what they had been given.
I can swear that on my Grandsons life.
Slava Ukraini.