Southport | 9 year old girl confirmed as third victim

[Keeper!]

How do you sort it though? The Police can get rough but that only works when there's enough of them but there aren't enough. The courts can get stricter but the courts exist for after something has happened in which case it's too late.

There is also the element of kids who are not being brought up properly in stable households which again comes down to complicated things like the parent's own upbringing and poverty. The countries with the highest levels of poverty also tend to have the highest levels of violence and crime.

The US is a great example, it is a rich country but where it's poor it's really poor. That also tends to be where the murders, gangs and worst of the crime happens.

Zero tolerance and Police on the streets, most of the issues in our country have been caused by defunding the public services by an alarming level.

We in the last 5 years are seeing the consequences, police, health, roads you name it , it's a mess.

Is the UK still a first world country? It's a country in terminal decline for me.

The amount of drugie, piss heads and homeless on the streets of the UK is alarming and a vast majority are British, how the **** has this been allowed to happen?

 

[carlosthejackal]

Migrant or not the migration problem is out of control no normal british person wants any more here they don’t respect our land when they are here and that’s just scratching the surface for another day and topic. What happened yesterday is absolutely despicable and if that was my daughter lying in the street full of blood and it was someone who did this because of political or religious views I think I’d be doing life in jail . I honestly hate this country right now

Morning Tommy

 

[Magicpole]

As if it isn’t bad enough that so many children were attacked and two killed, by someone wielding a knife. What we or their families don’t need, is this tragedy to be highjacked for far right political motives. Ghouls feeding on heartbreak, that requires a certain type of utter loathsome ****. I actually found it too distressing to watch more of the reports last night. What the families and those other kids who witnessed it are going through, is beyond belief.

Have a bit of class, if you don’t possess class, pretend, or just keep you hate masquerading as concern to yourself. At the very least, go to a right wing racist group and knock yourselves out.

My heartfelt sympathy to all those poor children and their families.

 

[Keeper!]

Sadly, it's the same every time incidents like this occur. People start speculating about the ethnicity or religion of the perpetrator before the facts emerge, and then start with the anti-immigration rhetoric. The actual victims almost quickly become an afterthought as political agendas take hold. It's depressingly predictable.

Sadly the same issue is spreading the World over, the local population seem to be the ones with issues.

 

[inbetween]

Zero tolerance and Police on the streets, most of the issues in our country have been caused by defunding the public services by an alarming level.

We in the last 5 years are seeing the consequences, police, health, roads you name it , it's a mess.

Is the UK still a first world country? It's a country in terminal decline for me.

The UK is a first world country but not everywhere you go. If you go to certain areas of Manchester then it's anything but first world, this has never been any different. My dad used to hate walking around Maine Road after a night game as Moss Side was notorious at the time (maybe it still is?).

It's pretty simple really, a sizeable and growing number are poor and haven't been brought up properly. There is less law enforcement and there are easy opportunities to make money by for example selling drugs. It's a lethal but obvious combination.

This is part and parcel of why I refuse to live anywhere near a city but then again Southport is only 10 miles from me.....

 

[youngbob]

Sadly, it's the same every time incidents like this occur. People start speculating about the ethnicity or religion of the perpetrator before the facts emerge, and then start with the anti-immigration rhetoric. The actual victims almost quickly become an afterthought as political agendas take hold. It's depressingly predictable.

With all due respect, and as much as I agree with you here - if this happens on Bluemoon so often that you can spot the "depressingly predictable" signs then why aren't these users being banned from the forum? Or at least being banned from viewing Off Topic? You have ultimate control over what happens to them. I've been here long enough to remember when this forum had a good mix of informed opinions on all things but since the mid-2010s the number of ill-informed right-wing posters has started to outweigh the number of posters from other parts of the political spectrum. Right-wing posters, much as I loathe their views, are allowed to have a space on here, but there's a big difference between the two types of right-wing posters you find in these thread and it's the ill-informed who drag this place down and make it a chore to read sometimes.

You can see in this thread (and in others) that the anti-immigration beliefs these users hold aren't really the problem, it's that they dive into these discussions bereft of facts but full of fury. This is a murder case involving someone born in Cardiff but the discussion has descended into the usual back and forth over the pros and cons of immigration and the apparently sinister intentions of "woke culture". The rest of us, including the moderators, then have to waste time hosing the forum down after they've sprayed shit all over it. These posters bring the quality of discussion down by arriving at conclusions that are miles wide of the mark and creating tangent after tangent. As I write this, there are 532 posts in this thread and I'd imagine at least 200 of them are made up of the same pattern: 1) ill-informed right-wing poster arrives at some mad point that's not relevant to the thread, 2) everyone else has to debunk what they've said.

It'd save everyone the bother if the usual suspects were identified and prevented from spoiling almost every discussion we have on cases like this.

 

[Keeper!]

The UK is a first world country but not everywhere you go. If you go to certain areas of Manchester then it's anything but first world, this has never been any different.

It's pretty simple really, a sizeable and growing number are poor and haven't been brought up properly. There is less law enforcement and there are easy opportunities to make money by for example selling drugs. It's a lethal but obvious combination.

This is part and parcel of why I refuse to live anywhere near a city but then again Southport is only 10 miles from me.....

I would say a lot of the wealthy and rulers of this country have also not been brought up well.

This used to be a country of compassion and fairness, I now see total division, corruption and distain.

The last government were symbolic of that, disgusting, corrupt and immoral.

 

[Lauz9888]

one difficulty is its often juveniles carrying weapons-do you send them all to prison for a decade? what happens when they come out?

its v complicated-you obv need a deterrent/stop and search etc but only as a part of a much wider solution.

On top of knife amnesties and a punishment severe enough to deter it, you've got to do something to address why anyone feels the need to carry a knife, too.

And that means tackling gangs and other criminals, making communities safer, giving victims of crime a reasonable shot at justice.

I'm willing to bet that a large number of people who carry knives aren't like this bloke in Southport, they're people who for whatever reason feel they're in danger and that a knife is the best way to defend themselves. Properly effective policing would go a reasonable way in reducing that.

I don't know what you do about evil cunts who just want to hurt and kill people, though.

I refuse to believe that opening the doors of a dance studio during a class on a hot summer day is reckless or risk-taking behaviour. You absolutely should be able to do that.

If the perpetrator has a criminal record then you can argue there may have been opportunities missed to apply a deterrent or address whatever it is in his life or head that he thinks is reason to do this (don't ask me how you address it, I just don't know).

But maybe it's his first crime, or the first he's been arrested for. Especially at such a young age, it's not impossible.

Is there anything that teachers or social services might have been able to do? Does someone who commits atrocities show signs in childhood of who they'll become? Maybe, maybe not.

I don't know what the answer is. It seems to need a concerted effort from multiple agencies and even then you can't completely remove the risk.

One thing, though - this guy should never see the outside of prison for the rest of his life. For some crimes, rehabilitation is possible. Not this, though.

 

[Blue Llama]

Tighter borders and the end to uncontrolled migration

That's said, this isn't the time or the place for it, thoughts with the fanilies

Not sure you could brick up the M4 at Bristol.

 

[youngbob]

Tighter borders and the end to uncontrolled migration

That's said, this isn't the time or the place for it, thoughts with the fanilies

The attacker was born in Cardiff. How would you tighten the border in this instance? Blow up the Severn Crossing?