And yet the polls show Labour as winning the most seats.whp.blue said:blueinsa said:Watching PMQ's and Milliband is being handed his arse on a plate by Cameron. Im from a Labour voting family and have voted so myself for most of my adult life but Milliband and this current crop of Labour are completely unelectable imo.
100% agree and this is why Labour should have binned this clown months ago
Len Rum said:And yet the polls show Labour as winning the most seats.whp.blue said:blueinsa said:Watching PMQ's and Milliband is being handed his arse on a plate by Cameron. Im from a Labour voting family and have voted so myself for most of my adult life but Milliband and this current crop of Labour are completely unelectable imo.
100% agree and this is why Labour should have binned this clown months ago
Don't be fooled by PMQs, not many people watch it and Dave won't get away with not answering questions in the tv debates where Ed will perform much better.
Sorry, but I think that's nonsense. If the Labour party had a Blair-like figure now (without the taint of Iraq), they would absolutely piss the next election. A lot of the far left believe that Labour is not left enough, and that if they were, the masses would clamour for their election. This completely avoids the unassailable fact that the British populace has never had a taste for this kind of politics, hence the reason Foot and Kinnock were wiped out by Maggie.Damocles said:Labour aren't unelectable due to Milliband. It is because after Blair took them to the right, they have lost their political identity. Why vote for ToryLite when you can have the real thing?
People who vote for Labour in 2015 are the same people who like shandy over lager.
With gdp lower than before the last election, borrowing more than EVERY Labour government in history, 1 million relying on foodbanks, 3.5 million children living in relative poverty, the longest period of wage stagnation in his history, the much publicised "new jobs" being a mixture mainly of struggling self employed that cant make ends meet and low or zero hours contracts with the tax payer making up the difference, there is plenty to attack Dave's record on the economyLen Rum said:"Miliband will have a field day with him......possibly on the economy".malg said:No. I've posted previously that I was unsure why he was doing so, especially given his lambasting of Gordon Brown last time round. I'm just throwing out another idea for discussion.Len Rum said:Oh sorry there's urmston as well.
Personally, I think his advisors have told him that Miliband will have a field day with him on the NHS and possibly even the economy, and that Farage will hammer him on immigration and Europe, and even the Lib Dems will try their hardest to distance themselves from him. He's on a hiding to nothing, and this Green angle is something to cling to, and if he gets his way I reckon the only loser would be Miliband.
I don't think so , this is Dave's big plus ( albeit a con, but nevertheless a good one).
Farage will also hammer Ed on Europe and immigration.
So Cam's by no means in a more difficult situation than Ed.
He's just bottled it, using the Greens as an excuse.
Malty said:Think a change wouldn't hurt.
gordondaviesmoustache said:There is a simple truth at the heart of Labour's shift to the right in the last generation.
As living standards have continued to rise since WW2 the number of people who consider themselves working class has decreased and the number of people who consider themselves to be middle class has increased.
Therefore any party with hard left policies is now unelectable, certainly under the current electoral system.
In terms of absolute poverty; absolutely there's less. This is a undeniable fact. It is a linked point.foxy said:gordondaviesmoustache said:There is a simple truth at the heart of Labour's shift to the right in the last generation.
As living standards have continued to rise since WW2 the number of people who consider themselves working class has decreased and the number of people who consider themselves to be middle class has increased.
Therefore any party with hard left policies is now unelectable, certainly under the current electoral system.
What you have said surely suggests that there is now less poverty than ever which surely means there is little demand for hard left policies....
Malty said:Think a change wouldn't hurt.
gordondaviesmoustache said:In terms of absolute poverty; absolutely there's less. This is a undeniable fact. It is a linked point.foxy said:gordondaviesmoustache said:There is a simple truth at the heart of Labour's shift to the right in the last generation.
As living standards have continued to rise since WW2 the number of people who consider themselves working class has decreased and the number of people who consider themselves to be middle class has increased.
Therefore any party with hard left policies is now unelectable, certainly under the current electoral system.
What you have said surely suggests that there is now less poverty than ever which surely means there is little demand for hard left policies....
Rascal said:gordondaviesmoustache said:In terms of absolute poverty; absolutely there's less. This is a undeniable fact. It is a linked point.foxy said:What you have said surely suggests that there is now less poverty than ever which surely means there is little demand for hard left policies....
If it were the case per se, the NHS would be a long forgotten dinosaur of Socialist medicine.
As for"hard" left policies, what is sad is that its the now standard neo liberal concensus that pervades the media and anything remotely left wing is percieved to be somehow "Stalinist" . Neo-liberalism is more Stalinist than Socialism, as Neo Liberalismhas achieved what Stalinism did and that is to concentrate power in the hands of an unelected elite
Dream on Ron.Ronnie the Rep said:Malty said:Think a change wouldn't hurt.
Agreed. Get rid of the coalition and replace it with a solid Conservative majority
Expanded for accuracy.de niro said:Malty said:Think a change wouldn't hurt.
believe me it would hurt me.
Len Rum said:Expanded for accuracy.de niro said:Malty said:Think a change wouldn't hurt.
believe me it would hurt me.
Your postulation about the NHS is hopelessly anachronistic.Rascal said:gordondaviesmoustache said:In terms of absolute poverty; absolutely there's less. This is a undeniable fact. It is a linked point.foxy said:What you have said surely suggests that there is now less poverty than ever which surely means there is little demand for hard left policies....
If it were the case per se, the NHS would be a long forgotten dinosaur of Socialist medicine.
As for"hard" left policies, what is sad is that its the now standard neo liberal concensus that pervades the media and anything remotely left wing is percieved to be somehow "Stalinist" . Neo-liberalism is more Stalinist than Socialism, as Neo Liberalismhas achieved what Stalinism did and that is to concentrate power in the hands of an unelected elite
de niro said:Len Rum said:Expanded for accuracy.de niro said:believe me it would hurt me.
i'll be least affected from my business. i could retire right now. one of the reasons i dont is 8 other people are affected. if labour got in at least 3 of them would go overnight. in time maybe a couple more. i'll still be fine and dandy but they wont. well done gibberish Ed.
can't see how going back to the thirties is going to help the sale of carpets mate, but you know better than me.de niro said:Len Rum said:Expanded for accuracy.de niro said:believe me it would hurt me.
i'll be least affected from my business. i could retire right now. one of the reasons i dont is 8 other people are affected. if labour got in at least 3 of them would go overnight. in time maybe a couple more. i'll still be fine and dandy but they wont. well done gibberish Ed.