The Labour Government

[The Future’s Blue!]

Incredible just how obvious it is that austerity by one party is evil and if another party employs it then it's needed.

Where’s the austerity, you not seen the recent pay rises?

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

£10.3Bn per year back in the coffers from that, if they need £20Bn thats more than half way and I would suggest is palatable to most people. Scrapping the VAT exemption on private schools £1.7Bn per year and as I suggested earlier removing the VAT exemption for financial services which benefits the wealthy would raise a further £8.7Bn per year.

Piss easy this, thats £20.7Bn. No cuts or anything else needed. Restructure the payment of interest to commercial banks and that's another £11Bn per year.

https://neweconomics.org/2023/11/go...nglands-interest-payments-to-commercial-banks

So what are they all pissing about at.

Good calls. Still can’t understand the Tory giveaway, and they would never have contemplated what you’ve stated.

 

[urban genie]

Incredible just how obvious it is that austerity by one party is evil and if another party employs it then it's needed.

nope austerity by anyone is a failing of governance or vision.

 

[Vic]

There are a ton of people at my work sat waiting to retire in their late 50's/early 60s, they'll all leave on final salary pensions with houses already paid for, their houses will be worth 100x what they originally paid. They're probably debt free and don't have student loans to repay because they were free.

It's absolutely impossible that anybody working today will get those kind of benefits and that standard of living. People are talking up private pensions because the fact is workplace pensions alongside the state pension aren't going to be enough. And that's if they can even afford to put money into a private pension in the first place.

I keyed in mine recently and I only need to put in a measly extra £500pm to get a decent standard of living in retirement, and that's retiring at retirement age, not 60! My mortgage won't be paid off until I'm 65. My house will be my pension and unlike the oldies I'll probably have to sell it to get the income.

I can understand why some have little sympathy for the older folk. Young people are absolutely screwed, plain and simple.

Apart from describing £500pm as measly, I think you've explained why the older (Tory-voting) generation don't get much sympathy - most have never had it so good.

The issues are that many low-paid workers didn't really have that good an occupational pension - but good enough to mean they can't claim pension credit so will lose the WF allowance - and the social care issue that means the best laid retirement plans can be all but wiped out.

Finding a fair way to insure against the costs of care would be brilliant - but it would have to be done via taxes and it seems most people would rather pay less tax and risk the cost of care wiping out their savings and estate. (Though the complaints often come from the people who would have inherited the estate.)

 

[M18CTID]

There are a ton of people at my work sat waiting to retire in their late 50's/early 60s, they'll all leave on final salary pensions with houses already paid for, their houses will be worth 100x what they originally paid. They're probably debt free and don't have student loans to repay because they were free.

It's absolutely impossible that anybody working today will get those kind of benefits and that standard of living. People are talking up private pensions because the fact is workplace pensions alongside the state pension aren't going to be enough. And that's if they can even afford to put money into a private pension in the first place.

I keyed in mine recently and I only need to put in a measly extra £500pm to get a decent standard of living in retirement, and that's retiring at retirement age, not 60! My mortgage won't be paid off until I'm 65. My house will be my pension and unlike the oldies I'll probably have to sell it to get the income.

I can understand why some have little sympathy for the older folk. Young people are absolutely screwed, plain and simple.

Some good points but as always it won’t be as black and white as that.

Many people of pensionable age won’t have paid into a private pension scheme or had access to a company pension at their place of work so will only be getting the state pension.

Awareness of pensions - along with choice and accessibility - is a lot greater these days of course and while the workplace pension isn’t great as you quite rightly point out, someone paying into it from an early age - say 21 - could end up with a tidy sum come retirement age. We’ve got someone aged 17 who has just started at our place and I’ve advised him to start paying into a workplace pension as soon as he’s eligible to do so. I wish that option had been available to me when I started my first job 35 years ago but it wasn’t. On the flip side though, who knows if there will even be such a thing as a state pension in 30 or 40 years time? My suspicion is that that is why the workplace pension was introduced in the first place. Either that or the state pension age will be something stupid like 75.

 

[inbetween]

Apart from describing £500pm as measly, I think you've explained why the older (Tory-voting) generation don't get much sympathy - most have never had it so good.

Plenty of sarcasm in the measly amount :)

 

[Kirkstall Blue]

Younger people are not screwed by the older generation you are screwed by the people you elect to parliament most of whom see it as a job to make money. Successive governments are living like kings we only need one King MPs are there to do a job and manage the money fairly.

It’s down to every generation to fight for what they need, in the past a TV was the price of a years wages no one had a TV.or a car back then, I agree that the older generation bought a house but the mortgage rate was twice what it is now we paid for our house three times over.
The majority of pensioners won’t have that unless they bought their council house which was a thatcher decision. Now there’s none left for youngsters
Only if the tax rate goes back to what it was 90% in the 1950s and 60s will we be able to have a proper funded state health care pensions and council houses but no one wants to fight for 90% income tax on their wages so pensioners get what they deserve respect because they earned it.

 

[Eccles Blue]

I don’t want to get into arguments about this but please can the youngsters remember that things were very different when we old oldies started out. I was born before the NHS started for example and when I first started work at 15 pensions were the last thing on my mind.
Renting or council accommodation was our choice (only choice in most cases) and some firms still didn’t keep women on after marriage (some not all). When you had children lots of us gave up work to bring them up. There weren’t as many Nursery schools as today at all.
Eventually, when the children started school some women got part time jobs, again without pension facilities, although times were starting to change.
I’m not going into more detail but some, myself included, managed to get enough money to get a deposit for a house and mortgage.
In my early 30s with 4 children I managed to train to be a teacher and paid 6% of my salary into a pension.
I could write a lot more but just want people to think before they judge us old oldies. As I said in an earlier post I manage and I’m not pleading either poverty or wealth. I manage because my only real expense is a certain football team. :-)
We don’t want pity, we don’t want sympathy we would, well I would, just ask the remembrance that times have changed.
Nobody really supports me except me. By that I mean I am not asking for anything from the Government except fairness.
Thank you for reading this ‘essay’ and I apologise for having to say it but I really dislike it when Blue judges Blue as if everyone is in the same boat with the same problems.

Sorry. :-) :-)

 

[The Future’s Blue!]

I don’t want to get into arguments about this but please can the youngsters remember that things were very different when we old oldies started out. I was born before the NHS started for example and when I first started work at 15 pensions were the last thing on my mind.
Renting or council accommodation was our choice (only choice in most cases) and some firms still didn’t keep women on after marriage (some not all). When you had children lots of us gave up work to bring them up. There weren’t as many Nursery schools as today at all.
Eventually, when the children started school some women got part time jobs, again without pension facilities, although times were starting to change.
I’m not going into more detail but some, myself included, managed to get enough money to get a deposit for a house and mortgage.
In my early 30s with 4 children I managed to train to be a teacher and paid 6% of my salary into a pension.
I could write a lot more but just want people to think before they judge us old oldies. As I said in an earlier post I manage and I’m not pleading either poverty or wealth. I manage because my only real expense is a certain football team. :-)
We don’t want pity, we don’t want sympathy we would, well I would, just ask the remembrance that times have changed.
Nobody really supports me except me. By that I mean I am not asking for anything from the Government except fairness.
Thank you for reading this ‘essay’ and I apologise for having to say it but I really dislike it when Blue judges Blue as if everyone is in the same boat with the same problems.

Sorry. :-) :-)

Succinctly put and we all should be supporting you as you supported us.

We are all in the same boat and all need a safety net when things go wrong.

 

[Vic]

I don’t want to get into arguments about this but please can the youngsters remember that things were very different when we old oldies started out. I was born before the NHS started for example and when I first started work at 15 pensions were the last thing on my mind.
Renting or council accommodation was our choice (only choice in most cases) and some firms still didn’t keep women on after marriage (some not all). When you had children lots of us gave up work to bring them up. There weren’t as many Nursery schools as today at all.
Eventually, when the children started school some women got part time jobs, again without pension facilities, although times were starting to change.
I’m not going into more detail but some, myself included, managed to get enough money to get a deposit for a house and mortgage.
In my early 30s with 4 children I managed to train to be a teacher and paid 6% of my salary into a pension.
I could write a lot more but just want people to think before they judge us old oldies. As I said in an earlier post I manage and I’m not pleading either poverty or wealth. I manage because my only real expense is a certain football team. :-)
We don’t want pity, we don’t want sympathy we would, well I would, just ask the remembrance that times have changed.
Nobody really supports me except me. By that I mean I am not asking for anything from the Government except fairness.
Thank you for reading this ‘essay’ and I apologise for having to say it but I really dislike it when Blue judges Blue as if everyone is in the same boat with the same problems.

Sorry. :-) :-)

Sorry, but I suspect your rent wasn't half what you earned. And married women could give up work to raise a family because one average wage was enough to get a mortgage on a house that didn't cost ten times annual salary.

And if you have a teacher's pension, and state pension (at 65), and no housing costs, and £10 to travel anywhere in Greater Manchester , how would you not manage?

 

[stonerblue]

That makes no sense, if you're not claiming for what you're entitled to but kicking off that you will lose your warm home allowance then you're a fool.

Yep

 

[stonerblue]

Who is your current supplier? Can swap to edf or octopus and get £50 credit, also 2 bank swaps worth £175 each at the moment one ends tonight takes 5 minutes to fill out. If you and your Mrs do that it should cover the loss of the wfp.

There will always be people on the threshold unfortunately, just have to hope in October they revise it and go off council tax band instead, which would surely be easier to implement.

Labour have also said they will be putting a proper windfall tax on energy suppliers

 

[stonerblue]

My Mother in law and her late husband worked their arses off and right now she’s paying out over £2k a month for a flat and care in a sheltered complex when more than half of the other residents get it for fuck all because they sat on their arses doing the bare minimum and now the state are paying their bills…

It’s fucking scandalous.. she never claimed a thing now she has all the financial worries

Some good points but as always it won’t be as black and white as that.

Many people of pensionable age won’t have paid into a private pension scheme or had access to a company pension at their place of work so will only be getting the state pension.

Awareness of pensions - along with choice and accessibility - is a lot greater these days of course and while the workplace pension isn’t great as you quite rightly point out, someone paying into it from an early age - say 21 - could end up with a tidy sum come retirement age. We’ve got someone aged 17 who has just started at our place and I’ve advised him to start paying into a workplace pension as soon as he’s eligible to do so. I wish that option had been available to me when I started my first job 35 years ago but it wasn’t. On the flip side though, who knows if there will even be such a thing as a state pension in 30 or 40 years time? My suspicion is that that is why the workplace pension was introduced in the first place. Either that or the state pension age will be something stupid like 75.

Fuck that.
I'm sure all those that were told a workplace pension would see them set for life are more than a bit pissed off when it turns out they're not.
Tell the kid to do 12 months, save as much as possible then jack it in and explore the world..

 

[stonerblue]

I don’t want to get into arguments about this but please can the youngsters remember that things were very different when we old oldies started out. I was born before the NHS started for example and when I first started work at 15 pensions were the last thing on my mind.
Renting or council accommodation was our choice (only choice in most cases) and some firms still didn’t keep women on after marriage (some not all). When you had children lots of us gave up work to bring them up. There weren’t as many Nursery schools as today at all.
Eventually, when the children started school some women got part time jobs, again without pension facilities, although times were starting to change.
I’m not going into more detail but some, myself included, managed to get enough money to get a deposit for a house and mortgage.
In my early 30s with 4 children I managed to train to be a teacher and paid 6% of my salary into a pension.
I could write a lot more but just want people to think before they judge us old oldies. As I said in an earlier post I manage and I’m not pleading either poverty or wealth. I manage because my only real expense is a certain football team. :-)
We don’t want pity, we don’t want sympathy we would, well I would, just ask the remembrance that times have changed.
Nobody really supports me except me. By that I mean I am not asking for anything from the Government except fairness.
Thank you for reading this ‘essay’ and I apologise for having to say it but I really dislike it when Blue judges Blue as if everyone is in the same boat with the same problems.

Sorry. :-) :-)

Your story is very very similar to my Ma's. She had 5 kids, council house, lots of part time jobs and nightschool before getting her first teaching job and then buying her first house. I remember her fighting with the bank because they didn't want to give a mortgage to a woman.
After years of moving around the country she ended up in a nice little bungalow. Self sufficient til the end.
Massive respect to you Eccles )

 

[Eccles Blue]

Sorry, but I suspect your rent wasn't half what you earned. And married women could give up work to raise a family because one average wage was enough to get a mortgage on a house that didn't cost ten times annual salary.

And if you have a teacher's pension, and state pension (at 65), and no housing costs, and £10 to travel anywhere in Greater Manchester , how would you not manage?

I said I wasn’t going to argue and I won’t. Suffice it to say you are wrong. :-)

 

[Eccles Blue]

Your story is very very similar to my Ma's. She had 5 kids, council house, lots of part time jobs and nightschool before getting her first teaching job and then buying her first house. I remember her fighting with the bank because they didn't want to give a mortgage to a woman.
After years of moving around the country she ended up in a nice little bungalow. Self sufficient til the end.
Massive respect to you Eccles )

Thank you. I also fought with a bank, changed to another one and had the best Bank Manager ever there. So much so that whenever he got promoted I changed branches! *lol*
I remember when I went for the interview at Teacher Training College the interviewer asking me what my husband would do if I was earning more than him!

The things women weren’t allowed to do or sign is a whole other story isn’t it? :-)

Well done to your Mum @stonerblue. :-)

 

[I'm With Stupid]

I said I wasn’t going to argue and I won’t. Suffice it to say you are wrong. :-)

People love to look for someone to blame and so we end up in this BS old vs young debate, when in reality, ordinary working people have been screwed pretty consistently throughout history. Houses were cheaper back then. What about food? Or clothing? I could only find figures for America, but I assume the UK is the same, but in 1947, people had to spend 23% of their income to feed their family. Last year, that was 7%. Clothes accounted for over 10% of annual spending in the 60s, but that was down to around 4% last year.

"It was easy for you with your £4 a month mortgage" and "I managed it, just stop buying takeaway coffees" are equally unhelpful comments. "Look at these rich bastards taking all the money for themselves while all of our costs go up" is a far more useful comment.

 

[metalblue]

Sorry, but I suspect your rent wasn't half what you earned. And married women could give up work to raise a family because one average wage was enough to get a mortgage on a house that didn't cost ten times annual salary.

And if you have a teacher's pension, and state pension (at 65), and no housing costs, and £10 to travel anywhere in Greater Manchester , how would you not manage?

You know @Eccles Blue life better than her? Behave yourself.

 

[Kompany Car]

Sorry, but I suspect your rent wasn't half what you earned. And married women could give up work to raise a family because one average wage was enough to get a mortgage on a house that didn't cost ten times annual salary.

And if you have a teacher's pension, and state pension (at 65), and no housing costs, and £10 to travel anywhere in Greater Manchester , how would you not manage?

It does feel like you are blaming her for societal change which was one of the things that made housing and rents unaffordable for people on a single wage. The major downside of more women entering the workplace was that of more disposable income for couples and in particular in the 80s/90s the rise of the so called professional couples known as DINKs (Double Income No Kids). This coupled with banks giving away pretty much free money to those with capital, the selling of council housing stock and the move to private rental without any reasonable controls, screwed the system.

As for pensions it depends when she retired, if it wasn't relatively recently it wont be on the new state pension but on the old one which is significantly less generous (yes I know its not generous at all by comparison to most EU countries).

 

[M18CTID]

Fuck that.
I'm sure all those that were told a workplace pension would see them set for life are more than a bit pissed off when it turns out they're not.
Tell the kid to do 12 months, save as much as possible then jack it in and explore the world..

I’m talking about the workplace pension scheme that was brought in around 2016 mate. Starts off at 1% employee, 1% employer in the first year, then 3%/2% in the second year, and 5%/3% for each year after that. It came in way too late for me to end up with a nice retirement pot from it as I was 46 at the time but mine is still worth nearly £20k already. Someone saving into one of those from the age of 18 or 21 ought to see it grow considerably over the next 35-40 years. And 5% deducted from your wages at source isn’t really going to be missed. He could do that and still save enough to take a few weeks off and travel the world. Especially as the lucky fucker isn’t even paying any keep to his parents yet!