The PGMOL Apologies Thread

[SebastianBlue]

Magic word when you want to get it wrong “subjective”

The “clear and obvious error” threshold was solely devised to allow for continued manipulation via officiating, as it allows VAR to defer to the referee for any “subjective” decision (most of the decisions that are made), regardless of whether there was an “error” made, essentially allowing referees to continue to influence matches when it suits and provide following the LotG as cover for it.

In nearly every other sport using a version of video replay, the threshold is “was an error made”, whether or not it was clear or obvious.

In fact, the point of video replay is to catch the incidents that could not have been clear or obvious to the officials, so making that the threshold negates much of the utility of video replay.

At which point any reasonable person should ask themselves why the governing bodies would want to effectively substantially lower the utility of video replay (and why it is being used differently to most other sports).

 

[cheekybids]

I don’t know what the solution is. Whoever came in, be it independent or AI, the first time something goes for or against someone it will all start again, the questioning of if it’s all being done correctly.

For me what needs to be done is VAR gets scrapped and just leave it how it used to be. I’m sick of the waiting to see if goals stand, the ridiculous lines on the telly. The whole thing is shit.

Keep goal line tech as that is indisputable, but get rid of VAR and go back to an instant decision. Some you get, some you don’t but at least then we are all in the same boat.

I’m the opposite because no way would a ref who has a get out of “I didn’t see it” ever give that.

So it’s simple VAR can’t make mistakes. They’ve lied by saying it wasn’t clear & obvious when it was. Just apply the law & the cover up needs investigating by the premier league. Surely the members don’t just complain about City, surely they say it is important to re-referee when refs are shit scared of giving decisions at OT or Anfield against them.

 

[mattcity5]

I don’t know what the solution is. Whoever came in, be it independent or AI, the first time something goes for or against someone it will all start again, the questioning of if it’s all being done correctly.

For me what needs to be done is VAR gets scrapped and just leave it how it used to be. I’m sick of the waiting to see if goals stand, the ridiculous lines on the telly. The whole thing is shit.

Keep goal line tech as that is indisputable, but get rid of VAR and go back to an instant decision. Some you get, some you don’t but at least then we are all in the same boat.

I guess the direct alternative for "clear and obvious" would be the ref getting over to see everything that they may have got wrong, being shown it and then making the decision from the side of the pitch. The main issue with this is that games would last even longer than so far this season.

 

[LangleyBlue1970]

I’m the opposite because no way would a ref who has a get out of “I didn’t see it” ever give that.

So it’s simple VAR can’t make mistakes. They’ve lied by saying it wasn’t clear & obvious when it was. Just apply the law & the cover up needs investigating by the premier league. Surely the members don’t just complain about City, surely they say it is important to re-referee when refs are shit scared of giving decisions at OT or Anfield against them.

I don’t see why they’re scared of giving decisions at Trafford. When taggart was there, yes, as they were successful. Today they’re just another club in the league.

Liverpool maybe.

 

[SebastianBlue]

I guess the direct alternative for "clear and obvious" would be the ref getting over to see everything that they may have got wrong, being shown it and then making the decision from the side of the pitch. The main issue with this is that games would last even longer than so far this season.

True, but then we should scrap VAR altogether if the purposes is not to correct errors in officiating but just the ones VAR decides are worth correcting.

 

[GaudinoMotors]

We get on our high horses about subcontinent cricket betting scams, far eastern betting cartels and organised matched fixing elsewhere, yet we are happy to tolerate something as open and unregulated to abuse like VAR .... and look no further than "skybet". Quite how a sports broadcaster with vested interest in outcomes was ever licensed, is an appalling scandal and extremely dangerous.
It's all linked - get uncertainty out of the equation and the usual suspects will profit. Corruption is rife.

 

[cheekybids]

I don’t see why they’re scared of giving decisions at Trafford. When taggart was there, yes, as they were successful. Today they’re just another club in the league.

Liverpool maybe.

They are scared of making career effecting decisions. Attwell wasn’t dropped after the ridiculous offside, he even got VAR at the cup final, that’s clearly a reward.

Nothing has to be said, corruption is making decisions that you think will benefit your career.

 

[Fred_Quimby]

F..k me, 'clear and obvious' not so last night but was at the Final for their penalty. I can't think why.

 

[melrose40yarder]

They need microphones so we can here how they arrive at these ridiculous descisions.They also need to watch in real time not slow motion.

 

[Stephen230]

In nearly every other sport using a version of video replay, the threshold is “was an error made”, whether or not it was clear or obvious.

Which sports are you thinking about when you say that?

In the sports I can think of, the most weight virtually always goes with the on field official and evidence is needed that he was wrong to overturn. Similar to football.

In cricket, for LBW decisions where the ball tracker has half the ball hitting the stumps, they stick with Not Out, if that was the umpires original decision.

In rugby league, the referee must always make a decision and the video referee needs conclusive proof he was wrong, to overturn it.

The NFL is similar to rugby league. For the vast majority of incidents, the on field referee has to make a decision and it’s up to the video people to find proof he is wrong, or his call stands.

Tennis is different because it’s more or less just goal line technology for every dispute.

The only one I can think of where the video ref has the most say is for run outs in cricket, where the on field umpire isn’t required to make a decision at all and can refer it to the video adjudicator for the first and final opinion.

Don’t really know anything about rugby union.

Are there other sports I’ve forgotten about that use it?