The Scottish Politics thread

[Churchlawtonblue]

I 'm not saying he hasn't experienced it, I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I'm saying it's rare, I'm also saying it isn't linked to Sturgeon announcing any referendum, as yousa saying it happened in August shows. Most people can disagree and debate without any nationalist feeling creeping in. In fact I know English people argue for independence against unionist Scots.

They have lived up north for the past 15 or so years and he said they had noticed an increase since the 2014 vote.

 

[Coatigan]

Are you saying Sturgeons agenda isn't causing division and nationalist ire and unpleasantness. That would probably be a first anywhere if that were the case.

You're right Brexit certainly caused this across the UK, and there is no reason to think it isn't happening north of the border to an extent due to Scottish nationalism. I post an example and some on here refuse to beleive it, I guess simply because it doesn't fit their narrative.

What I am saying is there is no rise in anti -english sentiment and unpleasantness. For whatecer combination of reasons.

You are saying there is, and it is because of her. Based on nothing than a friend you know and your conviction.

I'm saying there isn't. What you want to attribute that to is up to you.

It is a genuine offering of honest opninion from someone exposed to a lot more, take it or leave it mate, I say it in good faith.

 

[Coatigan]

Are you saying Sturgeons agenda isn't causing division and nationalist ire and unpleasantness. That would probably be a first anywhere if that were the case.

You're right Brexit certainly caused this across the UK, and there is no reason to think it isn't happening north of the border to an extent due to Scottish nationalism. I post an example and some on here refuse to beleive it, I guess simply because it doesn't fit their narrative.

In fact I will go as far as saying, yes, that is what I am saying. As a general, rather than one-offs.

 

[Coatigan]

what she says she will do if the Supreme Court says no, is run in the next G election on a single policy. Independence. I would assume the Scottish Greens will do the same. If they win that in Scotland they will use it as a legal mandate. To be honest she has been quite cute in how she has pitched this and I think Johnson is faced with a lose,lose scenario. The major risk she runs is the polling in Scotland is still very close. She will be hoping that her campaign can sway the undecided and if Johnson continues being an arrogant **** (as if thats a question) that he will push voters her way too.

It is not as much of lose lose though for him. He has far better chances with allowing a referendum than denying one, because there is every chance the result would still be a no, and there would also be no 'denying the will of the people' claims to cling to. It is a gamble. He stands to lose the Union, and support thatbhe has gained by being tough on the issue.

Saying no though, if the route above is where it goes is far riskier, because a single issue GE up is probably likelyn to result in a pro independence majority, through that mechanism rather than straight forward yes vs no. How that would then be dealt with legally gets messy.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

What I am saying is there is no rise in anti -english sentiment and unpleasantness. For whatecer combination of reasons.

You are saying there is, and it is because of her. Based on nothing than a friend you know and your conviction.

I'm saying there isn't. What you want to attribute that to is up to you.

It is a genuine offering of honest opninion from someone exposed to a lot more, take it or leave it mate, I say it in good faith.

Same here, I'm saying it in good faith also. Not saying there is a lot, just an increase and our friends, who I have known for 30 yrs, definitely beleive it is being driven by the SNPs agenda. Best we agree to dissagree. Have a good day.

 

[Gabriel]

Are you saying Sturgeons agenda isn't causing division and nationalist ire and unpleasantness. That would probably be a first anywhere if that were the case.

You're right Brexit certainly caused this across the UK, and there is no reason to think it isn't happening north of the border to an extent due to Scottish nationalism. I post an example and some on here refuse to beleive it, I guess simply because it doesn't fit their narrative.

The agenda, as you describe it, does not belong to Sturgeon in much the same way as it didn't belong to Salmond or Wilson, or any SNP leader since the 1930s. She is just the current voice of what is now a large body of the Scottish population. In Sturgeon's defense, she's actually one of the more careful public speakers and generally talks about Westminster, Conservatives, and the UK, not England.

The two nations are drifting apart again, unsurprisingly since they've politically been longer apart than ever together, and the closer they come to separating there will inevitably be isolated unpleasantness, on both sides.

 

[Gabriel]

It is not as much of lose lose though for him. He has far better chances with allowing a referendum than denying one, because there is every chance the result would still be a no, and there would also be no 'denying the will of the people' claims to cling to. It is a gamble. He stands to lose the Union, and support thatbhe has gained by being tough on the issue.

Saying no though, if the route above is where it goes is far riskier, because a single issue GE up is probably likelyn to result in a pro independence majority, through that mechanism rather than straight forward yes vs no. How that would then be dealt with legally gets messy.

Johnson and the SNP know full well that the UK is going to tip into recession later this year and recognize that it will be a protracted one. Even the BoE is predicting high inflation for longer than expected, well into next year. On top of that, there is simply no money in Westminster to fund large-scale projects that might bring the countries together again; why would Westminster even consider doing so if it expects Scotland to leave? By 2014, the UK had rebounded from the financial crisis and economically things were looking comparatively rosy. In 2023, the situation is likely to be much different, so granting a referendum is a huge risk for Johnson.

 

[Coatigan]

Same here, I'm saying it in good faith also. Not saying there is a lot, just an increase and our friends, who I have known for 30 yrs, definitely beleive it is being driven by the SNPs agenda. Best we agree to dissagree. Have a good day.

Likewise pal.

I find it unfortunate that is what you Want to believe, and nothing will change that. And that you can't accept more positive views, but entirely your call.

See you on the Raz thread where everything is just peachy.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Likewise pal.

I find it unfortunate that is what you Want to believe, and nothing will change that. And that you can't accept more positive views, but entirely your call.

See you on the Raz thread where everything is just peachy.

Touché, see you on the Raz thread ;-)

 

[Gabriel]