This transfer window/Marwood

[Freestyler]

Selling our only 'true' winger/wideman. Before making sure we have replaced him, genius marketing.

 

[supercrystal7]

Brian Marwood's role is to identify, nurture and care for talent with the intention of creating value for the football club. In other words "asset management." The resources to achieve this are:

Scouting to recruit and review talent and their background
Player care to serve their NON-football needs (housing, insurances, concierge service, etc)
Academy organization - next generation
+ Medical

Marwood's role as administration provider is to report on all talent for the purpose of update to the board. Provide reviews of identified new, finished, developing and undeveloped talent. He makes recommendations to the board according to the information at hand.

Mancini just wants players and cares NOT for Financial Fair play or any other such business guideline. Fair enough - but Marwood and everyone else in the City administration do care about sustainable business and Financial Fair Play.

Scouting....Stefan Savic, Edin Dzeko, Mario Balotelli, Kolarov, Owen Hargreaves, Pantilimon.......everyone of those Marwood recommended NOT to sign. Marwood's scouting and academy staff have all been driven off for Mancini hires.

Player decisions are made by Khaldoon at the end of the day.......nobody else and this year Khaldoon is adamant no buys without sales.....Previously, Cook managed with a little friendly persuasion and charm to open up the purse strings in search of glory......by working with the manager and taking on the big battles with the owner on his behalf....as in all of those players listed above plus Nasri, Aguero, Yaya Toure and Silva (the owners wanted to slow the process for those players, but with Yaya in particular, Cook went to bat). The CEO must balance the egos, the responsibilities, the business process and understanding and support everyone where possible.......That has been missing since Cook left. Mcbeath has been passive as CEO and Mancini is now the most strident voice.

You can blame Marwood if you want, but he is standing in the gap trying to build sustainable success for the club around real talent under some real constraints - it's not his job to change those constraints. Maybe things will turn around with the new CEO. But I wouldn't hold out hope for much good to happen in this transfer window.

Would not be surprised if most of this this was true. Kolorov, Balotelli, Savic etc are clearly players Mancini likes a lot and wanted at the club. Not so sure about Dzeko, but if the person is ITK then might be true.

However, equally I would bet Mancini was very keen on Yaya Toure, Nasir, Silva and Aguero as well not just Cook. If he is really ITK maybe he will be fair and reveal how hard Mancini was pushing for particularly Toure or Marwood's opinion of Toure, Silva and Aguero?

Nor does it mention the signings Marwood was pushing for, that Mancini was against.

If the owners are done spending then you cannot complain and that is a different issue. If they feel they have invested enough and that is fair enough. They have spent hundreds of million of their own money and helped you win the FA cup and League title; memories I am sure you will cherish for the rest of your lifes. However, then you have to adjust your expectations. Coming 2nd in the league, winning a cup and the quarters in the CL will be a good season. A sustained period of dominance over Chelsea and United not going to happen. Still, being a threat for the league for the foreseeable future winning cups and going deep in the CL is what 99% of fans dream of. I think I would give my right nut for that at Palace.

"A sustained period of dominance over Chelsea and United not going to happen"

Why Not?

As you know you tend to dislike teams, who you have banter with their fans. So growing up in London I hate Manchester United and Arsenal. Sadly United even more so, since until Chelsea's rise they were the biggest supported club in the London. I hate Millwal and Charlton for other reasons (being rivals and guess Brighton too), but fairly impartial to most other teams across the top leagues.

That said I feel United have a better squad than you and are favourites for the league title this year. In the case of Chelsea, they have so many players that could turn world class. There squad is very complete and strong in all areas. This year maybe too soon, but by next year I would say they too have a good chance of having a superior squad. Then in the CL of course you can fluke it like Chelsea, but Bayern, Madrid and Barca have better squads. PSG may be come a threat in time and if Juventus can sort out their match fixing issues they are ready for another push.

 

[VOOMER]

Brian Marwood's role is to identify, nurture and care for talent with the intention of creating value for the football club. In other words "asset management." The resources to achieve this are:

Scouting to recruit and review talent and their background
Player care to serve their NON-football needs (housing, insurances, concierge service, etc)
Academy organization - next generation
+ Medical

Marwood's role as administration provider is to report on all talent for the purpose of update to the board. Provide reviews of identified new, finished, developing and undeveloped talent. He makes recommendations to the board according to the information at hand.

Mancini just wants players and cares NOT for Financial Fair play or any other such business guideline. Fair enough - but Marwood and everyone else in the City administration do care about sustainable business and Financial Fair Play.

Scouting....Stefan Savic, Edin Dzeko, Mario Balotelli, Kolarov, Owen Hargreaves, Pantilimon.......everyone of those Marwood recommended NOT to sign. Marwood's scouting and academy staff have all been driven off for Mancini hires.

Player decisions are made by Khaldoon at the end of the day.......nobody else and this year Khaldoon is adamant no buys without sales.....Previously, Cook managed with a little friendly persuasion and charm to open up the purse strings in search of glory......by working with the manager and taking on the big battles with the owner on his behalf....as in all of those players listed above plus Nasri, Aguero, Yaya Toure and Silva (the owners wanted to slow the process for those players, but with Yaya in particular, Cook went to bat). The CEO must balance the egos, the responsibilities, the business process and understanding and support everyone where possible.......That has been missing since Cook left. Mcbeath has been passive as CEO and Mancini is now the most strident voice.

You can blame Marwood if you want, but he is standing in the gap trying to build sustainable success for the club around real talent under some real constraints - it's not his job to change those constraints. Maybe things will turn around with the new CEO. But I wouldn't hold out hope for much good to happen in this transfer window.

Excellent post and a great insight for the "Why haven't we signed...." & "Garry Cook was a tosser" brigades.

If it's true that Mancini signed all those players against advice then it's no wonder we were talking to Mourinho before we offered RM a new contract.

You said it PB, if its true. Personaly, I don't think it is. Mario, AK and Savic I would agree, Edin no. Pants and Hargreaves cost zlitch, so Austin is clutching at straws on that. Marwood has no track record in the area he occupies, aside from worming his way onto,or into the PFA. He was appointed by the last CEO, who like the manager wasn't our owners choice and with zero track record in running a club with global ambitions. Yet we are to believe that a manager, who has won more major trophies than either fungus, or arse had at the same age, in two of the top 3 leagues in the world is the problem? Utter *ollocks. No manager gets it right every time, but he has taken players he had, De Jong, Vinnie, Micah, Zabs, Lescott and Hart and improved them, in some cases out of all recognition to the same players, when under the previous manager. The previous manager, was allowed to sign not just one, but two players who failed, part of their medicals, sign several players on massive contracts, way out of line with their actual quality. Mancini, has taken Yaya, from defensive lynch pin, to being the stuff of mightmares for the rest of the league. Aside from Edin and AK, Savic isn't horrendously expensive, or over paid, infact few players at City are paid more than Ade and AK less than Bridge! He has steared us towards 3 trophies in 3 years and is hoping to gain more this season, let alone in the forthcoming years. Aside from his managerial career, (which BM never had), as a player, he has truly scaled the heights. The shit happened on the previous shift and the connection was BM, who WILL be gone by the start of next season.

 

[VOOMER]

Would not be surprised if most of this this was true. Kolorov, Balotelli, Savic etc are clearly players Mancini likes a lot and wanted at the club. Not so sure about Dzeko, but if the person is ITK then might be true.

However, equally I would bet Mancini was very keen on Yaya Toure, Nasir, Silva and Aguero as well not just Cook. If he is really ITK maybe he will be fair and reveal how hard Mancini was pushing for particularly Toure or Marwood's opinion of Toure, Silva and Aguero?

Nor does it mention the signings Marwood was pushing for, that Mancini was against.

If the owners are done spending then you cannot complain and that is a different issue. If they feel they have invested enough and that is fair enough. They have spent hundreds of million of their own money and helped you win the FA cup and League title; memories I am sure you will cherish for the rest of your lifes. However, then you have to adjust your expectations. Coming 2nd in the league, winning a cup and the quarters in the CL will be a good season. A sustained period of dominance over Chelsea and United not going to happen. Still, being a threat for the league for the foreseeable future winning cups and going deep in the CL is what 99% of fans dream of. I think I would give my right nut for that at Palace.

"A sustained period of dominance over Chelsea and United not going to happen"

Why Not?

As you know you tend to dislike teams, who you have banter with their fans. So growing up in London I hate Manchester United and Arsenal. Sadly United even more so, since until Chelsea's rise they were the biggest supported club in the London. I hate Millwal and Charlton for other reasons (being rivals and guess Brighton too), but fairly impartial to most other teams across the top leagues.

That said I feel United have a better squad than you and are favourites for the league title this year. In the case of Chelsea, they have so many players that could turn world class. There squad is very complete and strong in all areas. This year maybe too soon, but by next year I would say they too have a good chance of having a superior squad. Then in the CL of course you can fluke it like Chelsea, but Bayern, Madrid and Barca have better squads. PSG may be come a threat in time and if Juventus can sort out their match fixing issues they are ready for another push.

Would you care to expand on this point?

 

[avoidconfusion]

I'll say it again, this window has been an absolute disaster and farce so far and with only a couple of days left to make any signings I cannot see that changing... and no signing Sinclair (or even Walcott) would not change that.

We had since May to further strengthen our squad and it was blatently obvious where we need strengthening.

 

[FanchesterCity]

Brian Marwood's role is to identify, nurture and care for talent with the intention of creating value for the football club. In other words "asset management." The resources to achieve this are:

Scouting to recruit and review talent and their background
Player care to serve their NON-football needs (housing, insurances, concierge service, etc)
Academy organization - next generation
+ Medical

Marwood's role as administration provider is to report on all talent for the purpose of update to the board. Provide reviews of identified new, finished, developing and undeveloped talent. He makes recommendations to the board according to the information at hand.

Mancini just wants players and cares NOT for Financial Fair play or any other such business guideline. Fair enough - but Marwood and everyone else in the City administration do care about sustainable business and Financial Fair Play.

Scouting....Stefan Savic, Edin Dzeko, Mario Balotelli, Kolarov, Owen Hargreaves, Pantilimon.......everyone of those Marwood recommended NOT to sign. Marwood's scouting and academy staff have all been driven off for Mancini hires.

Player decisions are made by Khaldoon at the end of the day.......nobody else and this year Khaldoon is adamant no buys without sales.....Previously, Cook managed with a little friendly persuasion and charm to open up the purse strings in search of glory......by working with the manager and taking on the big battles with the owner on his behalf....as in all of those players listed above plus Nasri, Aguero, Yaya Toure and Silva (the owners wanted to slow the process for those players, but with Yaya in particular, Cook went to bat). The CEO must balance the egos, the responsibilities, the business process and understanding and support everyone where possible.......That has been missing since Cook left. Mcbeath has been passive as CEO and Mancini is now the most strident voice.

You can blame Marwood if you want, but he is standing in the gap trying to build sustainable success for the club around real talent under some real constraints - it's not his job to change those constraints. Maybe things will turn around with the new CEO. But I wouldn't hold out hope for much good to happen in this transfer window.

Excellent post and a great insight for the "Why haven't we signed...." & "Garry Cook was a tosser" brigades.

If it's true that Mancini signed all those players against advice then it's no wonder we were talking to Mourinho before we offered RM a new contract.

You said it PB, if its true. Personaly, I don't think it is. Mario, AK and Savic I would agree, Edin no. Pants and Hargreaves cost zlitch, so Austin is clutching at straws on that. Marwood has no track record in the area he occupies, aside from worming his way onto,or into the PFA. He was appointed by the last CEO, who like the manager wasn't our owners choice and with zero track record in running a club with global ambitions. Yet we are to believe that a manager, who has won more major trophies than either fungus, or arse had at the same age, in two of the top 3 leagues in the world is the problem? Utter *ollocks. No manager gets it right every time, but he has taken players he had, De Jong, Vinnie, Micah, Zabs, Lescott and Hart and improved them, in some cases out of all recognition to the same players, when under the previous manager. The previous manager, was allowed to sign not just one, but two players who failed, part of their medicals, sign several players on massive contracts, way out of line with their actual quality. Mancini, has taken Yaya, from defensive lynch pin, to being the stuff of mightmares for the rest of the league. Aside from Edin and AK, Savic isn't horrendously expensive, or over paid, infact few players at City are paid more than Ade and AK less than Bridge! He has steared us towards 3 trophies in 3 years and is hoping to gain more this season, let alone in the forthcoming years. Aside from his managerial career, (which BM never had), as a player, he has truly scaled the heights. The shit happened on the previous shift and the connection was BM, who WILL be gone by the start of next season.

I'm not sure Mancini as 'the problem' is quite an accurate portrayal of his argument.

I think he's explaining that there's a natural (and correct) difference in rationale between the manager and the purse holder. Mancini cannot, and should not just have 'free reign' to spend as he sees fit. I don't think Fergie has THAT much reign.
Of course, he should have an opinion and a good say in the matter, but there (and should be) financial constraints that all managers have to comprehend and work within the parameters of.

Now, that's not saying City don't have 50million (say) to spend... but it NEEDS someone to remind the manager that if he spends that 50 million now, what happens in January when (say) Cavani becomes available, or if Tevez pulls another stunt? buying now because there's a hole burning in his pocket might be unwise.

All in all, the manager needs a counter - someone to challenge his buys, and if necessary pull the plug.

That's certainly no criticism of Mancini or his choices... it's just the natural order of things.

I think of it like a woman... All in all, she's the right person to decorate the house. She'll do a good job. Much better then we could. But, you don't give her your credit card... you monitor her spending and you 'police' her buys... so she's not paying 40 quid for some posh wallpaper when you can get similar one for 20 quid.
Of course she'll complain, but once the decorating is done, she forgets all about it, and still congratulates herself on how well she's done... while you save a small fortune in the process.

 

[ABU inc GDR]

Letting AJ go without first securing the signature of a replacement is pure stupidity. We either agreed the price and Swansea have now backed out or the deal was never that far advanced, Swansea are showing Marwood and the transfer team at City no respect, which is a big worry. With time on our hands why do we leave the final negoatiations this late that we put ourselves in this position, we didn't have to sell AJ. What if Sinclair fails the medical at the last minute?

Mancini complaints 3 weeks ago have proven over time to be valid and despite this there has been no improvement in our management of transfers in or out! The papers will have a feild day with this and rightfully so, who thinks it's possible to get 3 signings in 3 days at the right price and salary?

 

[FanchesterCity]

Letting AJ go without first securing the signature of a replacement is pure stupidity. We either agreed the price and Swansea have now backed out or the deal was never that far advanced, Swansea are showing Marwood and the transfer team at City no respect, which is a big worry. With time on our hands why do we leave the final negoatiations this late that we put ourselves in this position, we didn't have to sell AJ. What if Sinclair fails the medical at the last minute?

Mancini complaints 3 weeks ago have proven over time to be valid and despite this there has been no improvement in our management of transfers in or out! The papers will have a feild day with this and rightfully so, who thinks it's possible to get 3 signings in 3 days at the right price and salary?

Chicken and egg that...

What it we bought Sinclair then couldn't shift AJ?... even MORE wages plus the transfer fee.

It's already quite clear that City need to reduce the wage bill, and that means 'some' level of pain for us. e.g. Having to let Ade go for a pittance AND still subsidise some of his wages, letting AJ go etc.

We've already read that a number of clubs are all to eager to start being FFP 'police' esp not City are doing well - so there's going to be some serious politics in the football world quite soon (and we are one of the uninvited guests at the party). We need to do as much as we can to make sure our books stack up... 'cos we KNOW folks are gunning for us.

Clearly, we're not expecting the bailiffs or anything, but if we're to stick to the owners original plans (and so far so good), we have to curb some of the spending... and that starts with cutting off some of the fat from the squad.

 

[supercrystal7]

"A sustained period of dominance over Chelsea and United not going to happen"

Why Not?

As you know you tend to dislike teams, who you have banter with their fans. So growing up in London I hate Manchester United and Arsenal. Sadly United even more so, since until Chelsea's rise they were the biggest supported club in the London. I hate Millwal and Charlton for other reasons (being rivals and guess Brighton too), but fairly impartial to most other teams across the top leagues.

That said I feel United have a better squad than you and are favourites for the league title this year. In the case of Chelsea, they have so many players that could turn world class. There squad is very complete and strong in all areas. This year maybe too soon, but by next year I would say they too have a good chance of having a superior squad. Then in the CL of course you can fluke it like Chelsea, but Bayern, Madrid and Barca have better squads. PSG may be come a threat in time and if Juventus can sort out their match fixing issues they are ready for another push.

Would you care to expand on this point?

Yes I backed City to win the league last year on the strength of your first team, but this year United have closed the gap between first teams and their squad is still better.

Just comparing keepers; Hart is better than De Gae at the moment, but De Gae is improving rapidly and I don't think he will be far off Hart's level by January. As for second choice both Pantimilon and Lindergaard seem pretty good to me. Pantimilon not played much, but looks more than good enough for a second choice.

Left backs-you have the advantage. Clichy is better than Evra now and I know nothing about this dutch bloke. So would assume Kolorov is better. The Dutch bloke should need time to settle in anyway.

Centre backs-Now this is where there is a real difference. Kompany is the best outright centre back out of the bunch. Vidic once he gets going will not be far off his level. Ferdinand still better than Lescott though. Then both Smalling and Evans are better than Toure and Savic. Jones is not bad extra cover there. The thing is the United group of Evans, Smalling and Jones are young and will probably improve through even the course of this season.

Right backs-you have the advantage. Richards is the best out of the bunch. Zabaleta the 2nd, but once again the United players are young and improving rapdily. Rafael is impetuous, but still fairly good and improving.

Wingers/Wide playmakers-Another big advantage to United. First team wise you have the edge with Silva and Nasri. Seen a lot of Kagawa and he is very good. So Silva and Nasri better than Kagawa and Nani. Problem is Valencia and Young, much better than Milner and Kolorov. Like with the centre backs their is big gap between the quality of the reserves and the first team.

Central Midfield-Yaya is a class apart. Easily best central midfielder in the country. United have no one near as good. Carrick though is probably the next best out of the bunch. Barry is not far off that level. De Jong a bit overrated on this forum. He is not really any better than Fletcher. Cleverly better than Rodwell, but I think Rodwell has more potential and will turn out to be the better player. In addition United have Scholes, Giggs and Anderson to cover the midfield. You have no one else.

Strikers-This is by far the strongest area of your squad. No team in the world has the quality you have. That said RVP for me is the best of the bunch. Though would argue Aguero and Tevez both better than Rooney. Dzeko and Balotelli both better than Welbeck or Hernandez too.

Comparing player for player, though does not take into account how dependent your style of football is on certain players. Ferguson has the advantage that EVERY player at the club was his choice and plays the way he wants. Yes United are going through a transitional period on how to play, but you can take out any one player without weakening the team too much.

An example. Lets say you are playing a top team, How would you feel if Kompany was out injured? Do you think United would miss Vidic as much? Or how about Yaya out? Would United miss Carrick as badly? How about taking Silva out of the team? Would United miss Nani as badly? Even upfront where you have better players, if you took out RVP, United would miss him only slightly more than you would Aguero. In fact it's only at full back where an injury blow/suspension to a star player effects United considerably more than you. Hence why there is cause for concern.

 

[FanchesterCity]

As you know you tend to dislike teams, who you have banter with their fans. So growing up in London I hate Manchester United and Arsenal. Sadly United even more so, since until Chelsea's rise they were the biggest supported club in the London. I hate Millwal and Charlton for other reasons (being rivals and guess Brighton too), but fairly impartial to most other teams across the top leagues.

That said I feel United have a better squad than you and are favourites for the league title this year. In the case of Chelsea, they have so many players that could turn world class. There squad is very complete and strong in all areas. This year maybe too soon, but by next year I would say they too have a good chance of having a superior squad. Then in the CL of course you can fluke it like Chelsea, but Bayern, Madrid and Barca have better squads. PSG may be come a threat in time and if Juventus can sort out their match fixing issues they are ready for another push.

Would you care to expand on this point?

Yes I backed City to win the league last year on the strength of your first team, but this year United have closed the gap between first teams and their squad is still better.

Just comparing keepers; Hart is better than De Gae at the moment, but De Gae is improving rapidly and I don't think he will be far off Hart's level by January. As for second choice both Pantimilon and Lindergaard seem pretty good to me. Pantimilon not played much, but looks more than good enough for a second choice.

Left backs-you have the advantage. Clichy is better than Evra now and I know nothing about this dutch bloke. So would assume Kolorov is better. The Dutch bloke should need time to settle in anyway.

Centre backs-Now this is where there is a real difference. Kompany is the best outright centre back out of the bunch. Vidic once he gets going will not be far off his level. Ferdinand still better than Lescott though. Then both Smalling and Evans are better than Toure and Savic. Jones is not bad extra cover there. The thing is the United group of Evans, Smalling and Jones are young and will probably improve through even the course of this season.

Right backs-you have the advantage. Richards is the best out of the bunch. Zabaleta the 2nd, but once again the United players are young and improving rapdily. Rafael is impetuous, but still fairly good and improving.

Wingers/Wide playmakers-Another big advantage to United. First team wise you have the edge with Silva and Nasri. Seen a lot of Kagawa and he is very good. So Silva and Nasri better than Kagawa and Nani. Problem is Valencia and Young, much better than Milner and Kolorov. Like with the centre backs their is big gap between the quality of the reserves and the first team.

Central Midfield-Yaya is a class apart. Easily best central midfielder in the country. United have no one near as good. Carrick though is probably the next best out of the bunch. Barry is not far off that level. De Jong a bit overrated on this forum. He is not really any better than Fletcher. Cleverly better than Rodwell, but I think Rodwell has more potential and will turn out to be the better player. In addition United have Scholes, Giggs and Anderson to cover the midfield. You have no one else.

Strikers-This is by far the strongest area of your squad. No team in the world has the quality you have. That said RVP for me is the best of the bunch. Though would argue Aguero and Tevez both better than Rooney. Dzeko and Balotelli both better than Welbeck or Hernandez too.

Comparing player for player, though does not take into account how dependent your style of football is on certain players. Ferguson has the advantage that EVERY player at the club was his choice and plays the way he wants. Yes United are going through a transitional period on how to play, but you can take out any one player without weakening the team too much.

An example. Lets say you are playing a top team, How would you feel if Kompany was out injured? Do you think United would miss Vidic as much? Or how about Yaya out? Would United miss Carrick as badly? How about taking Silva out of the team? Would United miss Nani as badly? Even upfront where you have better players, if you took out RVP, United would miss him only slightly more than you would Aguero. In fact it's only at full back where an injury blow/suspension to a star player effects United considerably more than you. Hence why there is cause for concern.

But we all know, football doesn't quite work that way.

You could argue that United have clearly enhanced the squad with RvP, but at the same time, Scholes is another year older, as is Giggs, and there's no obvious and equal replacement for them still. Stronger upfront, weaker in midfield, and defensively, it's questionable if Ferdinand and Vidic are ever going to be the powerhouse they once were.
You could argue that United's fighting spirit will be as strong as ever and their wounded animal attitude will come to the fore to reclaim the title. Equally, it could be argued that the perceived decline of last year might actually start to show properly this year, having fought bravely to the bitter end last season.

At City, there's no clear improvement in the squad at all, but no obvious weakening either. There's arguably and increased self belief in the team and the fans - which already has salvaged points for them. Plus, there's a more coherent understanding between players who are now enjoying their second or third season together.
Equally, City now face the threats of complacency and a fervour to claim their scalp at EVERY single game. Teams raised their game against City last season, there's even more cause for them to do so now we're champions.

All in all, I'd say both teams remain neck and neck... it's Chelsea that have strengthened / changed the most... and remain the wildcard. They are an unknown quantity right now, and that could prove to be dangerous for United and City.

With respect to Spurs, Arsenal, Liverpool, Newcastle and Everton - all are capable of fantastic performances and pose a danger to the City, United and Chelsea, but across the course of a season, it's very difficult to see them compete.
Arsenal of course have the most pedigree in the last 20 years, and there's no reason to suspect their current weaknesses will be so damning as to cause them serious difficulties. They'll come good as they always do... just unlikely to be good enough.
Liverpool too are much like Arsenal, but coming from a position of weakness and believing they have a renewed strength... it will be interesting to see them over the course.