Tories win Copeland b-election.

[Dave Ewing's Back 'eader]

Nail on the head mate. The vast majority of the electorate fall into the centrist category - they have no appetite for hard-left or hard-right politics and just want to get along in life. Labour have systematically failed to claim that middle ground in recent general elections, and by lurching further to the left under Corbyn they're making it even harder for themselves. I wouldn't mind but it's not like the Conservatives are actually that good, and I doubt that a lot that have started voting for them suddenly consider themselves as staunch Tories - they just come across as more capable of running the country and that's what appeals more to many centrist voters.

Blair and Brown took the middle ground and they turned out be lying canutes. The centrist with a decent message that gets across will always win, over sectarian, cultist (that's cultist not canute-ish) groups, but Blair would always describe himself as 'centrist' when all the time he was the biggest disappointment to millions since Neville buggered up in Munich! Of the current crop, Corbyn and Fallon are caricatures of Pantomime ne'er do owts, laughable in the extreme, and so St Theresa occupies the centre ground a substantial swathe left and right of centre with ne'er a sign of opposition that would effectively challenge.

 

[kevin horlocks wand]

Is he solely to blame though ? For various reasons (primarily his stance on nuclear weapons and Trident) he is an enemy of the establishment and media (Murdoch in particular). I don't think I've ever seen anyone in my lifetime portrayed as poorly as Corbyn has been on TV and in the written press. As much as people like to say they think for themselves the media shapes the vast majority of opinion amongst the electorate.

Not seen the trump coverage have you?

 

[bluemoonmatt]

Honestly some of the fools on this thread spouting excuses and bullshit about a flowery world with no war or nuclear and no nasty right wingers. Can they honestly not see how in promoting and supporting this non existent socialist nirvana they are simply extending the Tory parties hold on power. FFS please please wake up, wake up before we end up with the Tories actually being the preferred alternative to an even further right wing party of opposition. Take your momentum, take your new militant buddies and reform the socialist workers party and take those fucking useless unelectable arseholes Corbyn, Mcdonnell & Abbott with you, and leave labour to us centist Blairite people who actually won three elections and did a fucking sight more for this country than just take us to a war for oil.

 

[The perfect fumble]

Honestly some of the fools on this thread spouting excuses and bullshit about a flowery world with no war or nuclear and no nasty right wingers. Can they honestly not see how in promoting and supporting this non existent socialist nirvana they are simply extending the Tory parties hold on power. FFS please please wake up, wake up before we end up with the Tories actually being the preferred alternative to an even further right wing party of opposition. Take your momentum, take your new militant buddies and reform the socialist workers party and take those fucking useless unelectable arseholes Corbyn, Mcdonnell & Abbott with you, and leave labour to us centist Blairite people who actually won three elections and did a fucking sight more for this country than just take us to a war for oil.

Have you considered the Liberal Democrats?

 

[Hamann Pineapple]

Honestly some of the fools on this thread spouting excuses and bullshit about a flowery world with no war or nuclear and no nasty right wingers. Can they honestly not see how in promoting and supporting this non existent socialist nirvana they are simply extending the Tory parties hold on power. FFS please please wake up, wake up before we end up with the Tories actually being the preferred alternative to an even further right wing party of opposition. Take your momentum, take your new militant buddies and reform the socialist workers party and take those fucking useless unelectable arseholes Corbyn, Mcdonnell & Abbott with you, and leave labour to us centist Blairite people who actually won three elections and did a fucking sight more for this country than just take us to a war for oil.

Flowery Nirvana ? Can you explain to me how all these countries without nuclear deterrent have not been invaded yet all those with the largest arsenals seem to be involved in perpetual war ? There was a time when weapons were manufactured to combat war, now it seems conflicts are manufactured to sell weapons.

 

[bluemoonmatt]

Yes, it has been an excuse by the left for some time now that Labour was just 'Tory Lite.'
Unless they understand that that's exactly what the electorate want, they won't get near power.

Very well put. I hazard a guess that a 2005 Blair (ie not at his prime) would trounce todays Theresa the Appeaser. Fuck it even the widely despised Brown only got ousted in a hung parliament. It so fucking clear that an increasingly left leaning Labour movement is in an alarming state of regression. Its a fact that 'New Labour' appealed to the electorate not the £3 a member socialist worker/momentum hijacked Communist lite we now have under dear leader Corbyn.

 

[manctheknife]

Have you considered the Liberal Democrats?

The Whigs are the only opposition to the Tories....

 

[bluemoonmatt]

Flowery Nirvana ? Can you explain to me how all these countries without nuclear deterrent have not been invaded yet all those with the largest arsenals seem to be involved in perpetual war ? There was a time when weapons were manufactured to combat war, now it seems conflicts are manufactured to sell weapons.

Is it not reasonably self explanatory? The world Corbyn and his cohorts promote does not nor never will exist. He is against nuclear full stop, including power which as it happens I'm all in favour of, its relatively green and comparatively efficient. As for weapons have we ever used them, the key is deterrent.

 

[bluemoonmatt]

Have you considered the Liberal Democrats?

I'll not be voting comrade Corbyn I'm a centrist so yes, I will consider an alternative for the first time in my life, and hopefully when he is, as he will be, roundly trounced he might rediscover some honour and fuck off stage left.

 

[mayo31]

Great for the Tories. Shite for the electorate. A representative democracy needs a strong opposition and Corbyn has ruined Labour despite what some strange people on here think 'as he fills town halls and has boosted party membership'.

Have Labour got it in them to have another coup? And when will the hard left realise that its ideology is dead as far as normal people are concerned?

Labour as it was was ruined years ago by a combination of thatcher, foot, Blair and brown.

Hard left is dead. Hard right needs killing but has shown some life recently. I not sure being too to the centre is right either.

Sounds like I making a new formation for Pep