Will MP`s vote for an attack on IS ?

[Malty]

Would this be a good time to talk about austerity and cut backs.....?

Who is going to fund this war to the tune of billions? More pay cuts, more jobless, more homeless, less doctors, nurses and teachers? Further cut backs in the armed forces?

Our leaders seem incapable of learning any lessons.

We can't just sit on our hands and not get stuck in when the rest of the leading nations are having some of that.

 

[Malty]

Great another war we've been dragged into. They have taken over about a quarter of the country do they really think us sending a few jets and dropping a few bombs is really going to stop IS? There is no way you can win against them from the air which means the next step will be sending in troops and trust me that will eventually happen. Most likely they will all say they don't want to send ground troops and then after the election British men and women will be sent there to get killed.

It's the reason they join the army etc, they know this is a risk they can get killed, sadly! all part of the job description.. they can't have it all their own way.

 

[hilts]

Would this be a good time to talk about austerity and cut backs.....?

Who is going to fund this war to the tune of billions? More pay cuts, more jobless, more homeless, less doctors, nurses and teachers? Further cut backs in the armed forces?

Our leaders seem incapable of learning any lessons.

We can't just sit on our hands and not get stuck in when the rest of the leading nations are having some of that.

Why? many european nations have a history of it

 

[Balti]

Would this be a good time to talk about austerity and cut backs.....?

Who is going to fund this war to the tune of billions? More pay cuts, more jobless, more homeless, less doctors, nurses and teachers? Further cut backs in the armed forces?

Our leaders seem incapable of learning any lessons.

We can't just sit on our hands and not get stuck in when the rest of the leading nations are having some of that.

Why? many european nations have a history of it

this war is already in our midst as well as over there

we can't ignore it

much as we might want to

 

[hilts]

We can't just sit on our hands and not get stuck in when the rest of the leading nations are having some of that.

Why? many european nations have a history of it

this war is already in our midst as well as over there

we can't ignore it

much as we might want to

We could quite easily not get involved in air strikes and certainly not troops on the ground, homeland security obviously we have to to be very vigilant about

 

[Balti]

Why? many european nations have a history of it

this war is already in our midst as well as over there

we can't ignore it

much as we might want to

We could quite easily not get involved in air strikes and certainly not troops on the ground, homeland security obviously we have to to be very vigilant about

we could

but why would we want to grant our enemy such a stronghold from which to cause even more grief for the much hated western infidel?

fuck that lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

its war plain and simple

 

[hilts]

this war is already in our midst as well as over there

we can't ignore it

much as we might want to

We could quite easily not get involved in air strikes and certainly not troops on the ground, homeland security obviously we have to to be very vigilant about

we could

but why would we want to grant our enemy such a stronghold from which to cause even more grief for the much hated western infidel?

fuck that lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

its war plain and simple

The world is a big place and we are a small country, if we sat on our hands like others have in the past i feel this would not be a problem, let me ask this question what countries do middle east terrorists have the biggest gripe with?

 

[BigJoe#1]

So what do we do?

Sorry Ducado, couldn't sleep!

That is a good question.

We could bomb the fuck out of them, the problems with that are (not exclusively)

1. The IS will in no time whatsoever be using innocents, women and children as human shields
2. Other innocent civilians will be hit in error
3. It will up the ante for the IS and give them an opportunity to issue further threats against innocent civilians and any other hostages they have and may take in the future
4. It delivers an opportunity for them to "invade" our country and carry out atrocities here in the UK - I am not suggesting that it won't happen anyway but the UK bombing them justifies it in their minds.
5. It will be a great recruiting tool for the IS globally.

So, what to do?

Suggestions only. Assuming we have the massive support in the area and worldwide (notably excluding Russia)

1. Choke them, make it impossible for oil to be moved from the area they occupy.
2. No arms deals with any nation that sympathises with them or supplies them with arms
3. Track their assets and finances and freeze all cash revenue streams and assets wherever possible, do likewise with any nation that trades with them or supplies them with .
4. Get this to be a global activity so it is a co-ordinated approach.

I appreciate this may be a slow burn solution and that whilst it's happening innocent civilians and hostages will be tortured and killed, however, regardless of what we do, and that includes nothing, this sadly is going to happen in any case.

I just think that we have been here many times before and failed and to respond solitary might is just not the answer.

 

[Balti]

We could quite easily not get involved in air strikes and certainly not troops on the ground, homeland security obviously we have to to be very vigilant about

we could

but why would we want to grant our enemy such a stronghold from which to cause even more grief for the much hated western infidel?

fuck that lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

its war plain and simple

The world is a big place and we are a small country, if we sat on our hands like others have in the past i feel this would not be a problem, let me ask this question what countries do middle east terrorists have the biggest gripe with?

yes we could try to hide away for a while but ultimately our democratic nation represents values that they hate

but it wouldn't work anyway as there are jihadists in our midst

it's not all about the middle east

it's a clash of ideologies

most of us would always respect their right to have different religious beliefs

they don't seem to be so tolerant lol

some of them want sharia law here for example and hate us enough to behead one of our soldiers in the street

lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

we can't simply be victims in the name of political correctness

fuck that

we fight

 

[Ducado]

So what do we do?

Sorry Ducado, couldn't sleep!

That is a good question.

We could bomb the fuck out of them, the problems with that are (not exclusively)

1. The IS will in no time whatsoever be using innocents, women and children as human shields
2. Other innocent civilians will be hit in error
3. It will up the ante for the IS and give them an opportunity to issue further threats against innocent civilians and any other hostages they have and may take in the future
4. It delivers an opportunity for them to "invade" our country and carry out atrocities here in the UK - I am not suggesting that it won't happen anyway but the UK bombing them justifies it in their minds.
5. It will be a great recruiting tool for the IS globally.

So, what to do?

Suggestions only. Assuming we have the massive support in the area and worldwide (notably excluding Russia)

1. Choke them, make it impossible for oil to be moved from the area they occupy.
2. No arms deals with any nation that sympathises with them or supplies them with arms
3. Track their assets and finances and freeze all cash revenue streams and assets wherever possible, do likewise with any nation that trades with them or supplies them with .
4. Get this to be a global activity so it is a co-ordinated approach.

I appreciate this may be a slow burn solution and that whilst it's happening innocent civilians and hostages will be tortured and killed, however, regardless of what we do, and that includes nothing, this sadly is going to happen in any case.

I just think that we have been here many times before and failed and to respond solitary might is just not the answer.

All of what you have said is being done, the oil they sell is smuggled there is a huge black market for oil always has been, and it's worldwide, hence the reason they US have been bombing the small oil fields they control in Syria, I don't think you will find a country in the world that is now supply them with arms and munitions most of what they have has been looted, it stands to reason that governments will be tracking assets, they have a lot of experience in doing this.

I think you think that we are fighting a real country, we are not we are fighting a complex group of terrorists and disaffected Sunni Arabs

 

[hilts]

we could

but why would we want to grant our enemy such a stronghold from which to cause even more grief for the much hated western infidel?

fuck that lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

its war plain and simple

The world is a big place and we are a small country, if we sat on our hands like others have in the past i feel this would not be a problem, let me ask this question what countries do middle east terrorists have the biggest gripe with?

yes we could try to hide away for a while but ultimately our democratic nation represents values that they hate

but it wouldn't work anyway as there are jihadists in our midst

it's not all about the middle east

it's a clash of ideologies

most of us would always respect their right to have different religious beliefs

they don't seem to be so tolerant lol

some of them want sharia law here for example and hate us enough to behead one of our soldiers in the street

lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

we can't simply be victims in the name of political correctness

fuck that

we fight

You don't get what i am saying

 

[Balti]

The world is a big place and we are a small country, if we sat on our hands like others have in the past i feel this would not be a problem, let me ask this question what countries do middle east terrorists have the biggest gripe with?

yes we could try to hide away for a while but ultimately our democratic nation represents values that they hate

but it wouldn't work anyway as there are jihadists in our midst

it's not all about the middle east

it's a clash of ideologies

most of us would always respect their right to have different religious beliefs

they don't seem to be so tolerant lol

some of them want sharia law here for example and hate us enough to behead one of our soldiers in the street

lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

we can't simply be victims in the name of political correctness

fuck that

we fight

You don't get what i am saying

I think I do

We don't participate in the air strikes etc

They don't bomb/ behead us etc quite so much cos they're too busy beheading yanks and froggies instead

for now

that it?

 

[Le Havre Oswald]

Give me a 50 cal Barrett (the one from Call of duty 4) and I'll be over by next week.




If anyone's got a ghillie suit pm me.

Thanks

 

[BigJoe#1]

All of what you have said is being done, the oil they sell is smuggled there is a huge black market for oil always has been, and it's worldwide, hence the reason they US have been bombing the small oil fields they control in Syria, I don't think you will find a country in the world that is now supply them with arms and munitions most of what they have has been looted, it stands to reason that governments will be tracking assets, they have a lot of experience in doing this.

I think you think that we are fighting a real country, we are not we are fighting a complex group of terrorists and disaffected Sunni Arabs

I fully appreciate they are not a "real" country which is why bombing them, IMO, is not a realistic option. They have no infrastructure to go for, they will move bases and locations overnight and this makes them a difficult, almost impossible target. Therefore we bomb the oil wells, but I think we (the US led coalition) will end up killing innocent civilians. I just don't think we will achieve anything doing this, furthermore what are we defining as success criteria? I feel bombing them will result in greater resentment.

We have to ring fence them, no-one in, no-one out and take extremely hard sanctions, no charity, no aid not even to the innocents, to me this is the only way. As I've said bombing will just up the ante, cause resentment and breed further hatred which will have much longer term implications.

 

[Balti]

All of what you have said is being done, the oil they sell is smuggled there is a huge black market for oil always has been, and it's worldwide, hence the reason they US have been bombing the small oil fields they control in Syria, I don't think you will find a country in the world that is now supply them with arms and munitions most of what they have has been looted, it stands to reason that governments will be tracking assets, they have a lot of experience in doing this.

I think you think that we are fighting a real country, we are not we are fighting a complex group of terrorists and disaffected Sunni Arabs

I fully appreciate they are not a "real" country which is why bombing them, IMO, is not a realistic option. They have no infrastructure to go for, they will move bases and locations overnight and this makes them a difficult, almost impossible target. Therefore we bomb the oil wells, but I think we (the US led coalition) will end up killing innocent civilians. I just don't think we will achieve anything doing this, furthermore what are we defining as success criteria? As I feel bombing them will result in greater resentment.

We have to ring fence them, no-one in, no-one out and take extremely hard sanctions, no charity, no aid not even to the innocents, to me thus the only way. As I've said bombing will just up the ante, cause resentment and breed further hatred which will have much longer term implications.

let them form a state and pretend to give it state like,errr, status

then when its full of jihadist scum

then nuke it :-)

 

[hilts]

yes we could try to hide away for a while but ultimately our democratic nation represents values that they hate

but it wouldn't work anyway as there are jihadists in our midst

it's not all about the middle east

it's a clash of ideologies

most of us would always respect their right to have different religious beliefs

they don't seem to be so tolerant lol

some of them want sharia law here for example and hate us enough to behead one of our soldiers in the street

lets kill as many of the jihadist fuckers as we can

we can't simply be victims in the name of political correctness

fuck that

we fight

You don't get what i am saying

I think I do

We don't participate in the air strikes etc

They don't bomb/ behead us etc quite so much cos they're too busy beheading yanks and froggies instead

for now

that it?

No what i am saying is if we get involved or not it will change nothing, air strikes will still happen and the future will not alter by our involvement, so for once just don't bother, we have nothing to gain by getting involved

 

[Balti]

You don't get what i am saying

I think I do

We don't participate in the air strikes etc

They don't bomb/ behead us etc quite so much cos they're too busy beheading yanks and froggies instead

for now

that it?

No what i am saying is if we get involved or not it will change nothing, air strikes will still happen and the future will not alter by our involvement, so for once just don't bother, we have nothing to gain by getting involved

I disagree mate. We have no choice but to get involved. The enemy is concentrated there. Sadly some of them travelled there from blighty and even claim to be British! Imagine that ffs.....they'll be bombed by the RAF soon enough sadly

 

[hilts]

I think I do

We don't participate in the air strikes etc

They don't bomb/ behead us etc quite so much cos they're too busy beheading yanks and froggies instead

for now

that it?

No what i am saying is if we get involved or not it will change nothing, air strikes will still happen and the future will not alter by our involvement, so for once just don't bother, we have nothing to gain by getting involved

I disagree mate. We have no choice but to get involved. The enemy is concentrated there. Sadly some of them travelled there from blighty and even claim to be British! Imagine that ffs.....they'll be bombed by the RAF soon enough sadly

Please explain why we have no choice but to get involved

 

[Balti]

No what i am saying is if we get involved or not it will change nothing, air strikes will still happen and the future will not alter by our involvement, so for once just don't bother, we have nothing to gain by getting involved

I disagree mate. We have no choice but to get involved. The enemy is concentrated there. Sadly some of them travelled there from blighty and even claim to be British! Imagine that ffs.....they'll be bombed by the RAF soon enough sadly

Please explain why we have no choice but to get involved

 

[BlueHammer85]

Galloway was brilliant in the debate. Roundly turned on by many. Then a Tory got up and said pretty much everything George had said and he got Yeah Yeah yeahs from the chamber.



Galloway pointed out that a previous Tory Defence minister had said we should bomb there bases, then George pointed out that ISIS dont have any bases to bomb. So who and what will be bombed??

Utterly brilliant as ever

<a class="postlink" href="http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cVgSAniqfRs" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cVgSAniqfRs</a>