Var debate 2019/20

[BlueHammer85]

Shame really last night's game was one of the best I've seen at the etihad

As a neutral to the game (wanted city to win)
VAR added to the excitement. The game had every twist and turn possible. It was bloody epic.

 

[prestonibbo_mcfc]

Looks like we've all been hoodwinked by the introduction of VAR. It was supposed to iron out obvious errors,
but is in fact being used as tool for more drama for the TV companies. Football is being taken into soap opera
land by the media. They turn everything into a fucking pantomime.

 

[Ohrodneyrodney]

Yeah I agree with you I thought I would like VAR I went crazy last night when sterling scored, hugged my son hugged the woman next to me, who wasn't my wife but it was all in vain , ah well never mind let's go for the league and FA cuo

Young kids near me literally crying with joy when Sterling scored, only to have it taken away despite the officials 'giving' the goal initially. How to alienate youngsters from the game

 

[Roachy]

Are we blaming VAR for us going out or just it's participation? We went out last night for the following reasons along with VAR controversy 1. Missed pen in 1st leg, awarded by VAR. 2.Poor defending leading to 1st leg lead for them. 3. Not a very good performance 1st leg. 4. Spuds first 2 goals last night down to calamitous defensive mistakes. 5. Spuds 3rd goal poorly defended by us compounded by VAR involvement. We could not affect VAR useage but all the above points we could have. I am still mightily brassed off but those are the facts.

 

[Ohrodneyrodney]

Are we blaming VAR for us going out or just it's participation? We went out last night for the following reasons along with VAR controversy 1. Missed pen in 1st leg, awarded by VAR. 2.Poor defending leading to 1st leg lead for them. 3. Not a very good performance 1st leg. 4. Spuds first 2 goals last night down to calamitous defensive mistakes. 5. Spuds 3rd goal poorly defended by us compounded by VAR involvement. We could not affect VAR useage but all the above points we could have. I am still mightily brassed off but those are the facts.

We can all look for all sorts of reasons. But the fact is no VAR we are through. If they were clear and obvious errors we would accept it. They weren't.

 

[Burtonblue]

Don’t like VAR
It still involves subjective interpretation (or complete misrepresentation as in their 3rd goal)
It breaks up the flow of the game and takes any spontaneity out of it.
Controversial decisions have always been part of the game but this takes thing to a new level.
This is a retrograde step for football.

 

[ballinio]

Fans have power but because of the tribalism in football we won’t come together but I tell you now we absolutely need to get organised & stop this vile concept that will ruin the game, they’re taking our game off us & repackaging it for tv round the world , dreading next year to watch the game I used to love changed forever.

 

[dennishasdoneit]

Give one to us and two to them. It's called pretending to be fair.

For those of us with our eyes open....

 

[ballinio]

As a neutral to the game (wanted city to win)
VAR added to the excitement. The game had every twist and turn possible. It was bloody epic.

Of course it did , it’s designed to thrill the neutral fan , tv soap opera gerrymandered bollocks , great viewing to sell round the world ......match going fan who’s team it fucks over ? Fuck em

 

[dennishasdoneit]

Of course not. They won't even use it to stop us from getting screwed. Remember when they had a faulty screen and didn't even use VAR. Bent.

As Fuck...

 

[cleavers]

It will continue to be a joke until the the match going fans can see the replays.

Correct.

 

[Marvin]

UEFA provided clarification for the Telegraph where they highlight that ref's are told to rule out goals that directly go in off the hand. Yesterday the ref clearly indicated that he can't see a hand ball and it came off his hip. First of all I find it ridiculous that he is shown the worst angle. This is down to the interpretation of the referee to apply the rule and depending on who it is you get a different outcome. Not surprising the rule is changing because there is no difference in the ball ultimately going in via the hand or from the hand assisting in the control of it. If he permitted the goal then his decision raises an important question about what is offside. Aguero was ruled offside, which was correctly overturned according to the rule. However, if we compare it to the hand ball offence by Llorente one can rightfully argue that Eriksen's initiated pass barely clipping the City player still would have made it to Aguero and provided no difference to the outcome. Should that be offside? He did not gain an unfair advantage, and in no way greater of an advantage than Llorente with his use of his arm permitting the correct ricochet for their goal. If we are applying offsides by the book then how did Son's goal in their home game count? Half his body is offside but it is not deemed as a clear enough for VAR to conclude it is an obvious error. Which part of the body do you count as offside, because they clearly looked at his feet only otherwise the conclusion would have been that he is offside. Harry Kane was offside vs Chelsea in the same manner as Son but people using VAR ignored that you can score with the upper half of your body. Then again Llorente being allowed to use his makes for the argument that under current rules you are allowed to use the arm in assistance to score. Yet again that means that Son is most definitely offside. Then we need to discuss the referee ignoring Rose effecting Bernardo's ability to score. He makes no contact with the ball, (referee did not give a corner hence indicating that Rose did not play the ball) but the referee decides that Rose flying into Bernardo is deemed as fair try at preventing a goal. The issue is not with VAR, but with application of the rules by referees

The clarification / comment that I have seen from UEFA officials and provided to reporters relates more to the blocking of shots eg PSG / Man Utd and Ota at Schalke.

They argued that handball in those games was awarded because of the distance of travel, the body was being enlarged to make the defender's body bigger, or the ball hitting the defender's arm changing the direction to the defender's advantage.

This time we had a melee at a corner and there was no time for Llorente to react and the ball flicks off his arm and is not significantly diverted. it was very lucky/unlucky but not in my mind related in any way to the incidents of handball in previous CL games.

 

[dennishasdoneit]

I can’t believe there isn’t more uproar that the clip of Llorente clearly using his arm wasn’t seen by the match official. UEFA say it was, yet we watched the ref watching the monitor watching the same clip over and over. And some still think it’s ok. Unbelievable.

Some footy fans are deluded dumb down zombies.so I'm not surprised

 

[Marvin]

i for one will be bailing out of the game,i cant sit there and watch this nonsense every time a suspect goal is scored,under normal circumstances with just the ref we would have won 5-3 last night, with VAR if properly used it should have been 4-2, VAR has to be a 360 degree simulation of the incident which is viewed from all angles for it to work and improve the game.we managed for over 100 years with a ref and two linesmen and i'm quite sure we could do another 100 years, i feel cheated from last night not bitter at going out but cheated and that's not value for money

It's not cheating. It's a change in procedure but I do agree with you that it fundamentally changes the way we as fans respond to goals. We just can;t celebrate them any more. It's like a slow motion offside flag. The linesman or referee any time in the next 2-3 minutes might well say hang on a minute.

It will get thrown out or changed cos football fans will rebel. Quite rightly.

 

[Marvin]

Some footy fans are deluded dumb down zombies.so I'm not surprised

How do you know that the referee didn't see it strike his arm and yet still regard it as unintentional and therefore good? It definitely flicks his arm but the collision that directs it to goal is his hip.

I've re-read the rules and watched it back. The goal in my opinion is fortunate but good. I'm no more competent than you so just an opinion.

 

[Ohrodneyrodney]

How do you know that the referee didn't see it strike his arm and yet still regard it as unintentional and therefore good? It definitely flicks his arm but the collision that directs it to goal is his hip.

I've re-read the rules and watched it back. The goal in my opinion is fortunate but good. I'm no more competent than you so just an opinion.

Because the referee clearly signalled, after watching the video, that it didn't hit his arm, just his hip. He was quite clearly incorrect with that.

 

[Metalartin]

The ball was significantly diverted, Ederson seemed to think so as he was going the other way until it hit the elbow... to me it looks like he's expecting it to glance off him and there's a good case for it. We will never know for sure, so the only fair thing in those situations, is to say it shouldn't have been allowed.

It is all about opinions but I don't know how anyone can look at the video below and claim otherwise:




It was more than unlucky it was incorrect but the reason it was incorrect was down to the fact the ref didn't see this contact with the arm. His remarks have been confirmed to say as such by a Spanish journo/pundit earlier in this thread.

We have Mark Clattenburg, Dermot Gallagher, Shaka Hislop(IFAB) all saying it should have been ruled out in their interpretations of handball goals.

 

[ballinio]

It's not cheating. It's a change in procedure but I do agree with you that it fundamentally changes the way we as fans respond to goals. We just can;t celebrate them any more. It's like a slow motion offside flag. The linesman or referee any time in the next 2-3 minutes might well say hang on a minute.

It will get thrown out or changed cos football fans will rebel. Quite rightly.

It’s cheating , this is a multi million pound gravy train , there is no way those decisions would have been given against Utd or Liverpool , let alone Barcelona or Real Madrid

 

[Marvin]

It’s cheating , this is a multi million pound gravy train , there is no way those decisions would have been given against Utd or Liverpool , let alone Barcelona or Real Madrid

I don't believe that. It's the same people reviewing the game and coming to a decision.

I am against VAR but for a different reason: the inherent delay in the game.

 

[Marvin]

The ball was significantly diverted, Ederson seemed to think so as he was going the other way until it hit the elbow... to me it looks like he's expecting it to glance off him and there's a good case for it. We will never know for sure, so the only fair thing in those situations, is to say it shouldn't have been allowed.

It is all about opinions but I don't know how anyone can look at the video below and claim otherwise:




It was more than unlucky it was incorrect but the reason it was incorrect was down to the fact the ref didn't see this contact with the arm. His remarks have been confirmed to say as such by a Spanish journo/pundit earlier in this thread.

We have Mark Clattenburg, Dermot Gallagher, Shaka Hislop(IFAB) all saying it should have been ruled out in their interpretations of handball goals.

The signficant goal bound collision is with his body not forearm. If the ref missed it, this only proves its insignificance