COVID-19 — Coronavirus

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mosssideblue said:
How do you intend to protect the vulnerable exactly!
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you should have read that i wasnt entirely sure. But we could do more. We didnt do enough in the spring and now we are not doing enough. No politician wants a two tier society but i can see that happening. We definitely need better messaging and leadership.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
We are all going to get this virus sooner or later so why not let those least at risk get on with their lives while doing more to protect the vulnerable. I repeat what we are doing isn't sustainable for another 6-12 months. If we want a future for our children very hard decisions are going to have to be made im afraid Kaz
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If more of the population could be trusted to follow the masks and the 2 meter rule that might be an option. Unfortunately every day too many examples of people who don't give a toss. So until they wise up you can forget your solution.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
We are all going to get this virus sooner or later so why not let those least at risk get on with their lives while doing more to protect the vulnerable. I repeat what we are doing isn't sustainable for another 6-12 months. If we want a future for our children very hard decisions are going to have to be made im afraid Kaz
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What more can be done to protect the vulnerable other than locking them up? Do we ban contact and movement outright for anyone over 65 until March? Is everyone in that bracket on here in favour then?

I seriously doubt any of that is sustainable either so really we have two choices, take our chances and accept people will die or we slow things down to bring cases down.

The reason why we are in this position is because our tracking and tracing measures at the local level are non-existent. So with whatever measures we fancy dreaming up, this problem will repeat again until that improves or obviously a gamechanger like a vaccine comes along.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
you should have read that i wasnt entirely sure. But we could do more. We didnt do enough in the spring and now we are not doing enough. No politician wants a two tier society but i can see that happening. We definitely need better messaging and leadership.
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We are all in this together and as @kaz7 says, you cannot simply say let the young uns simply live life whilst the vulnerable are kept at arms length.

Posted earlier today and I stand by it, whilst we have people who knowingly and deliberately ignore the rules, no measures will work. These people are the scourge of society and need to be punished accordingly. That should be a priority imo.
 
kaz7 said:
The whole point is delaying it , to protect the nhs in winter and get through to spring , preventing 1,000 people dying every day

Again i say the vulnerable include large swaths of the very people looking after us , they cannot be protected , it is the most meaningness thing said on here, it is not practical

The young and fit can catch and spread it , that is the clearest thing we know , they have to be part of the solution not allowed to just get on with their lives , they are a big part of the jigsaw, we are all in this together
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it doesn’t feel like we are all in it together to me.

i can only assume all those people shouting for greater lockdown measures don’t live in greater Manchester .

even before the tier restrictions Were announced in which we were obviously shoved straight in tier 3, we in greater Manchester had our very own special extra restrictions on our lives and livelihoods For weeks before.

these measures and restrictions were forced on us at a time when our cases were far lower than those experienced by large parts of the country including London now.

it’s people in the south applauding Germany and France for announcing more restrictions now and being decisive seemingly forget that we in Manchester have not been able to visit family and friends for months already.

meanwhile whilst our liberties are curtailed and businesses struggle our Covid rate continues to rise. strange isn’t it.
 
France is expected to follow Germany's lead and enter its own four-week national lockdown soon, local media has widely reported.

France reported its highest daily death count since April on Tuesday, with 523 virus-linked deaths. It has also been confirming tens of thousands of cases each day, with a record 52,010 reported on Saturday.

And more than half of the country's intensive care units are filled with COVID-19 patients.

Why are we mucking about , we got it wrong last time
 
Blue Llama said:
If more of the population could be trusted to follow the masks and the 2 meter rule that might be an option. Unfortunately every day too many examples of people who don't give a toss. So until they wise up you can forget your solution.
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whats your suggestion then? I believe the police and local authority should be doing more. Shutting shops who dont enforce masks would soon. change their ways.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
We are all going to get this virus sooner or later so why not let those least at risk get on with their lives while doing more to protect the vulnerable. I repeat what we are doing isn't sustainable for another 6-12 months. If we want a future for our children very hard decisions are going to have to be made im afraid Kaz
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It is not all about the risk to them, they spread it , we are too busy dithering to make proper decisions , france, germany and wales are not mucking about , i suppose we will be able judge whether it is correct when we watch what happens , i appreciate the difficulty but we dithered and went for herd immunity in march /april, we must have learnt something shirley

The kids will find their own new normal when this is over , the war kids did it after all
 
inbetween said:
What more can be done to protect the vulnerable other than locking them up? Do we ban contact and movement outright for anyone over 65 until March? Is everyone in that bracket on here in favour then?

I seriously doubt any of that is sustainable either so really we have two choices, take our chances and accept people will die or we slow things down to bring cases down.

The reason why we are in this position is because our tracking and tracing measures at the local level are non-existent. So with whatever measures we fancy dreaming up, this problem will repeat again until that improves or obviously a gamechanger like a vaccine comes along.
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track and trace need to be radically overhauled and taken out og the hands of Harding etc. The app should be compulsory for everyone, checks should be made on people asked to isolate, we are simply too liberal in this country and not strong enough.

You cant count on a vaccine.
 
Gaylord du Bois said:
How on earth could that be enforced when there's thousands of journeys to and fro every day ?Let alone railway commuters. In reality it's just not workable. Probably for the same reasons other borders haven't been closed within the UK.
Also I'd imagine that the tourist industry would argue strongly about the idea that it's only partially open during winter.

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The same way it was inforcable in the national lockdown , we are only talking a couple of weeks , social travelling have to curtailed , it is an option to keep them safe , locals can still move aroud normally , all this is a theory , a way for those who live there and hospitality etc to stay open
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
track and trace need to be radically overhauled and taken out og the hands of Harding etc. The app should be compulsory for everyone, checks should be made on people asked to isolate, we are simply too liberal in this country and not strong enough.

You cant count on a vaccine.
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I guess you are banking on a) everyone having a smart phone and b), the wherewithal to use it.

I suspect there is a lot in this country who don't have either
 
kevin horlocks wand said:
it doesn’t feel like we are all in it together to me.

i can only assume all those people shouting for greater lockdown measures don’t live in greater Manchester .

even before the tier restrictions Were announced in which we were obviously shoved straight in tier 3, we in greater Manchester had our very own special extra restrictions on our lives and livelihoods For weeks before.

these measures and restrictions were forced on us at a time when our cases were far lower than those experienced by large parts of the country including London now.

it’s people in the south applauding Germany and France for announcing more restrictions now and being decisive seemingly forget that we in Manchester have not been able to visit family and friends for months already.

meanwhile whilst our liberties are curtailed and businesses struggle our Covid rate continues to rise. strange isn’t it.
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Are you all sticking strictly to the rules? I have read so much about rule breaking there .You want the vulnerable , whoever they are, locked down when they were in lockdown the longest last time and still are

It is not a north south thing for people , the government it absolutely is but i dont feel like that , we have to muddle through the winter any way we can , it is not going to be fair but we have no choice , as dont any other countries
 
mosssideblue said:
We are all in this together and as @kaz7 says, you cannot simply say let the young uns simply live life whilst the vulnerable are kept at arms length.

Posted earlier today and I stand by it, whilst we have people who knowingly and deliberately ignore the rules, no measures will work. These people are the scourge of society and need to be punished accordingly. That should be a priority imo.
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But I think you should be able to let the majority get on with their lives while protecting the vulnerable. If we could protect the vulnerable would you be in favour of others getting on with their lives.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
track and trace need to be radically overhauled and taken out og the hands of Harding etc. The app should be compulsory for everyone, checks should be made on people asked to isolate, we are simply too liberal in this country and not strong enough.

You cant count on a vaccine.
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The app can't be made compulsory, much as I tend to agree with your point.
Not everyone has a mobile phone, especially those most vulnerable. My parents for instance, have an old nokia that they use for emergencies only. They wouldnt know what an app was, let alone how to use it.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
track and trace need to be radically overhauled and taken out og the hands of Harding etc. The app should be compulsory for everyone, checks should be made on people asked to isolate, we are simply too liberal in this country and not strong enough.

You cant count on a vaccine.
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It’s worrying how many times on this thread you keep reading ‘until a vaccine comes along.‘

I suspect governments understandably don’t want to relay to people that even if we do get a vaccine it will not be the silver bullet everyone understand it to be in their heads. It will be another very important mitigation tool at our disposal - however, what I suspect a lot of people on here refer to as ‘the vaccine’ is actually a sterilizing vaccine which provides life long immunity which as I understand it seems very unlikely from leading scientists and the WHO.

So, the same question which in my head has always been key to getting global population compliance with immediate strategies is - what exactly is our exit strategy if we accept that this virus will probably not be eradicated for some considerable time?
 
mosssideblue said:
I guess you are banking on a) everyone having a smart phone and b), the wherewithal to use it.

I suspect there is a lot in this country who don't have either
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Make them compulsory, they are about £50 retail so give them to people who cant afford. the cost would be peanuts compared to what we have wasted.
 
Churchlawtonblue said:
track and trace need to be radically overhauled and taken out og the hands of Harding etc. The app should be compulsory for everyone, checks should be made on people asked to isolate, we are simply too liberal in this country and not strong enough.

You cant count on a vaccine.
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The NHS app is anonymous.
You cannot be traced through it.
So it cannot be enforced.
It’s why people who self isolate after getting notified by it are not entitled to any financial support.
 
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