Mr Bates vs the Post Office

Blue Mist said:
What is also worrying is that the Post Office and HM Customs and Excise can still do their own investigations and prosecution’s. This should be stopped now.
One reason so many innocents went to prison is they were 'threatened' with 2 years jail if they pleaded not guilty but were found guilty. Out of fear they had no choice but to go guilty for a reduced sentence.
Further they were threatened with having to pay prosecution costs of many hundreds of thousands. It was/is a national disgrace and rightly called the biggest miscarriage of justice ever.
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Private prosecutions are a long-established common law principle. Anyone can prosecute another legal person. The law would need looking at more widely than the PO and HMRC.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
Private prosecutions are a long-established common law principle. Anyone can prosecute another legal person. The law would need looking at more widely than the PO and HMRC.
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Not really I think this is purely down to Government sourced civil prosecussions. There needs to be a separation of concerns and a separate dept that is part of the MoJ like the Dept of Public Prosecussions but not under the control of HMRC, Dept of Business and Trade or whatever.
In fact a section of the DPP would probably fit the bill.
 
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BlueAnorak said:
Not really I think this is purely down to Government sourced civil prosecussions. Tgere needs to be a separation of concerns and a separate depth that is part of the MoJ.
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There is no such thing as a civil prosecution. A prosecution requires a criminal offence to be involved.

What about local authorities who regularly prosecute people for trading standards and food safety offences?

Like I say, it’s not a straightforward as suggested and private prosecutions are a long held common law right which allow people to seek justice when they don’t believe they are getting it from the state.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
Private prosecutions are a long-established common law principle. Anyone can prosecute another legal person. The law would need looking at more widely than the PO and HMRC.
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I fully accept that IF it is run properly, this shows it is abused.
I remember a judge stating the Customs had committed Piracy on the high seas....... and then threw the case out.
Accountability..... end of.
 
The British establishment, monopoly organisations, the risible honours system and UK justice at their very worst.

Whatever your politics, this is a bunch of stinking shite.

Among lots of flabbergasting moments, the most outrageous take was the breathtaking lack of humanity on view.

That OBE needs to be rescinded and at least two senior execs hounded with the same alacrity as they did to the small people.

Please sign the Paula Vennells petition. We know fcuk all of note will result but at least make some of these low life bastards squirm.

Edit: CBE, not OBE. Equally inappropriate though.
 
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sir baconface said:
The British establishment, monopoly organisations, the risible honours system and UK justice at their very worst.

Whatever your politics, this is a bunch of stinking shite.

Among lots of flabbergasting moments, the most outrageous take was the breathtaking lack of humanity on view.

That OBE needs to be rescinded and at least two senior execs hounded with the same alacrity as they did to the small people.

Please sign the Paula Vennells petition. We know fcuk all of note will result but at least make some of these low life bastards squirm.
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Currently at 914k.
you.38degrees.org.uk

Post Office Scandal: Strip Paula Vennells of her CBE

I just signed the petition calling on Paula Vennells, the former CEO of the Post Office to be stripped of her CBE. Will you sign too?
you.38degrees.org.uk you.38degrees.org.uk
 
Another to be called to account is the husband of the current education secretary.

Michael Keegan is currently employed as a crown representative to the Cabinet Office, managing cross-government relationships with BAE Systemsas a strategic supplier to the Government, having previously been Head of Fujitsu UK and Ireland during the latter part of its involvement with the Post Office scandal.
 
Why weren’t Fujitsu systems managers sub-poena’d to answer under oath whether postmaster accounts could be overridden remotely?

I know the whistleblower only emerged late on but surely the whole case was founded on the premise that this was impossible.
 
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gordondaviesmoustache said:
Private prosecutions are a long-established common law principle. Anyone can prosecute another legal person. The law would need looking at more widely than the PO and HMRC.
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@gordondaviesmoustache I fully accept private prosecutions are a long established principle but I am sure you will agree, any that a private citizen takes is quickly taken over by the CPS and even quicker, they discontinue it. These 2 organisations are funded solely by the Government and therefore have unlimited funds, something that was highlighted perfectly by this programme. To have such financial might without proper safeguards is very dangerous for any individual accused of a crime by them.
 
gordondaviesmoustache said:
There is no such thing as a civil prosecution. A prosecution requires a criminal offence to be involved.

What about local authorities who regularly prosecute people for trading standards and food safety offences?

Like I say, it’s not a straightforward as suggested and private prosecutions are a long held common law right which allow people to seek justice when they don’t believe they are getting it from the state.
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A lot of the post office charges against SPMs were civil cases. Not criminal.
 
BlueAnorak said:
The Computer Weekly involvement is stated here:

Post Office Horizon scandal explained: Everything you need to know | Computer Weekly

Computer Weekly has investigated the Post Office Horizon scandal since 2008 and is, in fact, part of the story. This guide covers essential information about the scandal.
www.computerweekly.com www.computerweekly.com
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If I read that right, MPs from both sides agitated and got an investigation launched.

Just before its final report, the investigation was shut down - around 2015.

Surely someone must know who ordered that to be shut down.
 
Absolutely disgraceful the way these ordinary citizens were treated. The Post Office using billions of public money to cover up their ineptitude is shocking. The lack of knowledge by the management of how their company operated does not surprise me at all. These people draw huge salaries and bonuses for just heading up the operation. Handing out awards to what are basically criminals is all that is wrong with our country. Pull your finger out HMG and compensate these people without further delay.
 
MillionMilesAway said:
If I read that right, MPs from both sides agitated and got an investigation launched.

Just before its final report, the investigation was shut down - around 2015.

Surely someone must know who ordered that to be shut down.
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The investigation was being funded by the Post Office. So the board of the post office.
 
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