31 | Ederson - 2021/22 Performances

[kun]

I wouldn’t be he had a dodgy spell last season other than that he’s been world class consistently. Every keeper makes mistakes prime Schmeichel did for the scum. Difference between Ederson and someone like Alisson is he rarely makes top saves and has chocolate wrists. Alisson and the real top keepers are also much better in one on ones. Great passer though and a great watch out Eddie just nowhere near world class as a shot stopper.

Absolute bollocks. He makes more mistakes than Ederson.

"Rarely makes top saves" more bollocks. He only gets about 1 or 2 shots to save per game and still ends up with several top top saves every season.

Alisson is a "real top keeper" but Ederson isn't? Give the fuck over. Either you are a dinosaur who believes shot stopping is the only really valid skill for a goalkeeper, or you just dislike Eddie for some unknown reason. I'd also be willing to bet you only see Alisson play twice a season.

 

[mccity]

Whilst he does every now and again get it comically wrong, his positioning I've noticed is very good most of the time. It's not a coincidence that a lot of shots he saves seem to go straight at him.

 

[Sir peace frog]

He's fucking great for us, we couldn't get a better keeper for what we need, pep wants a keeper good on the ball, there isn't a better one about

 

[Tugay One Cup]

Robert Sanchez

I missed the first half yesterday so watched it back last night and I thought it was interesting to see how he dealt with two of those goals.

First one he gets it all wrong and isn't strong enough when he comes to collect it (something, by the way, you could never accuse Ederson of lacking) and the third one he had "chocolate wrists" when it came to him after a deflection. I think that second comment is a bit harsh of me, given how little time he had to react, but you can tell from his reaction that he knew he should have gone better.

I think he looks like a really good keeper but there seems to be an attitude on here where our own players are held to impossible standards. I wouldn't mind about that so much if the alternatives from other clubs were getting held to that same standard.

Look at Sterling for instance. He's been crap for a long time now but some of his most outspoken critics had previously suggested names like Adama Traore as a replacement. Adama Traore for fuck's sake.

People need to learn to appreciate our player's strengths instead of constantly looking for weaknesses all the time and then thinking some bloke who plays for mid table/ relegation candidates because they just so happened to turn it on in three of the four games they watched one season.

I know you weren't directly suggesting Sanchez would be an improvement on Ederson but the fact that you've thrown those three names in the ring speaks to a wider issue with how City supporters tend to be overly critical of their own players while not putting others under anywhere near the same level of scrutiny.

And, once again, our way has been shown to be the best way. We won 4-1 last night and people were still falling over themselves to complain about Grealish and Ederson is coming off the back of winning two Golden Gloves in a row.

 

[leo_city]

I missed the first half yesterday so watched it back last night and I thought it was interesting to see how he dealt with two of those goals.

First one he gets it all wrong and isn't strong enough when he comes to collect it (something, by the way, you could never accuse Ederson of lacking) and the third one he had "chocolate wrists" when it came to him after a deflection. I think that second comment is a bit harsh of me, given how little time he had to react, but you can tell from his reaction that he knew he should have gone better.

I think he looks like a really good keeper but there seems to be an attitude on here where our own players are held to impossible standards. I wouldn't mind about that so much if the alternatives from other clubs were getting held to that same standard.

Look at Sterling for instance. He's been crap for a long time now but some of his most outspoken critics had previously suggested names like Adama Traore as a replacement. Adama Traore for fuck's sake.

People need to learn to appreciate our player's strengths instead of constantly looking for weaknesses all the time and then thinking some bloke who plays for mid table/ relegation candidates because they just so happened to turn it on in three of the four games they watched one season.

I know you weren't directly suggesting Sanchez would be an improvement on Ederson but the fact that you've thrown those three names in the ring speaks to a wider issue with how City supporters tend to be overly critical of their own players while not putting others under anywhere near the same level of scrutiny.

And, once again, our way has been shown to be the best way. We won 4-1 last night and people were still falling over themselves to complain about Grealish and Ederson is coming off the back of winning two Golden Gloves in a row.

To be clear, the 3 names I've mentioned relate directly to Ederson's profile, specifically in their ability to distribute, I went as far to say they are inherently copies of what City aimed with Ederson's profile, we set the standard. There is no one better at distribution than him, and that's something barely up for debate.

But...

There is an argument however, for his handling and ability when it comes to shot stopping not being as good. It's okay as long as the backline protects him, but when we're under pressure, he's hardly the Edouard Mendy or Alisson of shot stopping to help us out. His save percentage is the lowest as I've posted before, he would know himself he could do better. That's something up for discussion and my main point really.

 

[OB1]

Whilst he does every now and again get it comically wrong, his positioning I've noticed is very good most of the time. It's not a coincidence that a lot of shots he saves seem to go straight at him.

That's a very good point. I played in goal fairly regularly for nigh on 30 years, not at anything better than Hough End levels but keeper was my main position. One thing that improved over the years was my positioning and being in the right place at the right time is very useful.

 

[Tugay One Cup]

To be clear, the 3 names I've mentioned relate directly to Ederson's profile, specifically in their ability to distribute, I went as far to say they are inherently copies of what City aimed with Ederson's profile, we set the standard. There is no one better at distribution than him, and that's something barely up for debate.

But...

There is an argument however, for his handling and ability when it comes to shot stopping not being as good. It's okay as long as the backline protects him, but when were under pressure, he's hardly the Edouard Mendy or Alisson of shot stopping to help us out. His save percentage is the lowest as I've posted before, he would know himself he could do better. That's something up for discussion and my main point really.

I get that point but then it can be countered pretty easily. Save percentages aren't the best because of the lack of information on quality of shots faced. I've seen conflicting data with regards to keepers over performing in terms of xg conceded but, from memory, Ederson is usually in the top five keepers in the league. That being said, I've not seen any statistics on this since about midway through last season.

Then there's the more intangible stuff like being an absolute fucking nutter who opponents are afraid to challenge and being able to remain concentrated when our team is totally dominating possession and playing in the opponent's defensive third for about 50% of each game. People like Joe Hart totally excelled for Birmingham and with us when we were being constantly pressured by team like Dortmund and Barcelona. Keeping alert at all times is a skill in itself.

If people want to criticise particular aspects of his game then that's fair enough but it's silly to act like Ederson is a problem which needs fixing and that's the vibe which has been creeping in on this forum.

 

[leo_city]

I get that point but then it can be countered pretty easily. Save percentages aren't the best because of the lack of information on quality of shots faced. I've seen conflicting data with regards to keepers over performing in terms of xg conceded but, from memory, Ederson is usually in the top five keepers in the league. That being said, I've not seen any statistics on this since about midway through last season.

Then there's the more intangible stuff like being an absolute fucking nutter who opponents are afraid to challenge and being able to remain concentrated when our team is totally dominating possession and playing in the opponent's defensive third for about 50% of each game. People like Joe Hart totally excelled for Birmingham and with us when we were being constantly pressured by team like Dortmund and Barcelona. Keeping alert at all times is a skill in itself.

If people want to criticise particular aspects of his game then that's fair enough but it's silly to act like Ederson is a problem which needs fixing and that's the vibe which has been creeping in on this forum.

I wouldn't necessarily go with that vibe, but it's a problem enough for us to stop conceding silly goals because there will come a time when the defenders will eventually make errors and as a top keeper he will have to show his quality, we know he's capable, and not just in distribution.

 

[Fiftyyearsandcounting]

That's a very good point. I played in goal fairly regularly for nigh on 30 years, not at anything better than Hough End levels but keeper was my main position. One thing that improved over the years was my positioning and being in the right place at the right time is very useful.

Never understood why GKs catch the ball then, for no apparent reason, drop to their knees or lie on the ground clutching the ball and sunbathe for a minute.

 

[kun]

Not particularly often. Hugely overrated due to his phenomenal left peg and nonchalance. Yes he suits our style but as a shot stopper he’s very average. The scouse keeper is miles better for a start.

He just isn't

 

[eastmanc]

Whilst he does every now and again get it comically wrong, his positioning I've noticed is very good most of the time. It's not a coincidence that a lot of shots he saves seem to go straight at him.

And he is brave as a lion, perfect fit for City is our Eddie.

 

[chesterbells]

Never understood why GKs catch the ball then, for no apparent reason, drop to their knees or lie on the ground clutching the ball and sunbathe for a minute.

To waste time if their team are winning maybe ?

 

[mccity]

And he is brave as a lion, perfect fit for City is our Eddie.

Yeah and that shows when it comes to crosses. I don't have the statistics but in the last year or two I doubt there's a keeper with a better rate of catching crosses.

 

[samarasra]

To be clear, the 3 names I've mentioned relate directly to Ederson's profile, specifically in their ability to distribute, I went as far to say they are inherently copies of what City aimed with Ederson's profile, we set the standard. There is no one better at distribution than him, and that's something barely up for debate.

But...

There is an argument however, for his handling and ability when it comes to shot stopping not being as good. It's okay as long as the backline protects him, but when we're under pressure, he's hardly the Edouard Mendy or Alisson of shot stopping to help us out. His save percentage is the lowest as I've posted before, he would know himself he could do better. That's something up for discussion and my main point really.

Tim Krul made a string of saves v. Chelsea yet conceded 7, most scored when his defence left him exposed, save percentages don't show the full picture. Ederson's concessions mainly come when he is exposed not because of shot stopping errors.

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

Today there were 2 shots that a top GK would easily catch, and he barely blocked them. Another shot to the body and it almost went under his arm, a top GK deflects it to the corner with no problem.

Ederson is a great sweeper, a great passer and great with high balls. He is an average shot-stopper and below average on 1v1. I don’t get why people fight about this, when it’s really clear. Luckily for us, Ederson is a top 3 GK even with his limitations. But for most teams, Ederson would not be a top 10 GK, and it’s okay, the only thing that matters is that he is important for us.

31 | Ederson - 2021/22 Performances

he made lots of good saves today. but one thing that is clear is that when you test the last line of defense consistently then he inevitably has a rush of blood. I think it has got to do more with his personality, he seems to be a bit of a nutter in real life. he seems to be like the the one who...

forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk

Thoughts?
Top for shotstopping at the point we had effectively won the league last season. Based on the quality of shots faced using an advanced GK xG model.

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

Yeah and that shows when it comes to crosses. I don't have the statistics but in the last year or two I doubt there's a keeper with a better rate of catching crosses.

You are not wrong - see this from earlier in the thread about corner claims

31 | Ederson - 2021/22 Performances

he made lots of good saves today. but one thing that is clear is that when you test the last line of defense consistently then he inevitably has a rush of blood. I think it has got to do more with his personality, he seems to be a bit of a nutter in real life. he seems to be like the the one who...

forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk

 

[city warrior]

31 | Ederson - 2021/22 Performances

he made lots of good saves today. but one thing that is clear is that when you test the last line of defense consistently then he inevitably has a rush of blood. I think it has got to do more with his personality, he seems to be a bit of a nutter in real life. he seems to be like the the one who...

forums.bluemoon-mcfc.co.uk

Thoughts?
Top for shotstopping at the point we had effectively won the league last season. Based on the quality of shots faced using an advanced GK xG model.

That with stats you can show almost any point you want. I was talking about individual actions in Brighton’s match.

Second if you think Ederson is a better shot-stopper than Mendy and Schmeichel, we are never gonna agree then.

With stats you can show that 80% of midfielders in the league have more offensive talent than Bernardo.

You think that Ederson is the best shot-stopper of the league? If you had a 1v1 that defines the league, would you choose Ederson above any other GK?
Why do you think Ederson’s shot-stopping are so divisive?
Why do none mention Ederson as a top shot-stopper other than some City fans? Pundits and other fans have no problem in saying that Foden is the best English young player, KDB best midfielder for some years…

 

[Pablo ZZZ Peroni]

That with stats you can show almost any point you want. I was talking about individual actions in Brighton’s match.

Second if you think Ederson is a better shot-stopper than Mendy and Schmeichel, we are never gonna agree then.

With stats you can show that 80% of midfielders in the league have more offensive talent than Bernardo.

You think that Ederson is the best shot-stopper of the league? If you had a 1v1 that defines the league, would you choose Ederson above any other GK?
Why do you think Ederson’s shot-stopping are so divisive?
Why do none mention Ederson as a top shot-stopper other than some City fans? Pundits and other fans have no problem in saying that Foden is the best English young player, KDB best midfielder for some years…

I asked you for you thoughts but fuck me you just go off on one.

FWIW that chart is from the most comprehensive goal keeping data analysis out there and, ironically, with other data published and lots of lots of commentary ( I've heard him speak in detail 3 or 4 times) backs up lots of what you are saying re 1v1s, distributions, claims etc with, er, data. Data being that thing YOU object to...

By the way your 1v1 argument depends on the type of 1v1. Close up 1v1s Ederson is great. When he has a player running at him from a long way out the data is not great and he gets panned.

And FWIW, I don't think Ederson is the best shot stopper out there. But he is not as bad as I think YOU perceive.

 

[BlueTG]

Never understood why GKs catch the ball then, for no apparent reason, drop to their knees or lie on the ground clutching the ball and sunbathe for a minute.

To waste time.

Particularly if the opposing team are on the front foot - hence the shot. Aims to take the momentum out of them when they continue.

 

[Chippy_boy]

Honestly I don't care if he's the best or near the best or not. I just love the bloke. He's great entertainment and is certainly good enough. Worth it for the 70 yard assists alone.