Bloody Sunday: Soldier F faces murder charges

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

Whatever this soldier has done it can’t be any worse than cold blooded killing of innocents. .

You know he shot a killed children? Unarmed children, who were running away?

 

[hilts]

Where in the name of God are you getting that from what I wrote.
It's the whole point of everything I've been arguing.
You wrote;
Whatever this soldier has done it can’t be any worse than cold blooded killing of innocents.

Whether intentional or not there is an inference in that statement that this was not the cold blooded killing of innocents and other killings by terrorists were.
Both were. I can't make that any clearer. However your statement demonstrates what the families of innocent victims in the Bloody Sunday massacre are still dealing with within some sectors of British society.

There was no inference at all and I’m a tad puzzled you even drew that conclusion. I’m saying whatever he has done can’t be any worse because there is no worse. Innocents were killed by all sides. This isn’t justifying his action for Christ sake. Work on your comprehension.

 

[The blue phantom]

You know he shot a killed children? Unarmed children, who were running away?

And thousands of bikers marched in support of that at the weekend.

 

[hilts]

You know he shot a killed children? Unarmed children, who were running away?

I give up. And how is that worse than blowing up kids or shooting them. What makes his abhorrent crime(case pending) any worse than terrorists doing the same in the eyes of the law.

 

[The blue phantom]

I give up. And how is that worse than blowing up kids or shooting them. What makes his abhorrent crime(case pending) any worse than terrorists doing the same in the eyes of the law.

Its not, both as you say are abhorrent.

 

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

I give up. And how is that worse than blowing up kids or shooting them. What makes his abhorrent crime(case pending) any worse than terrorists doing the same in the eyes of the law.

its not worse...i never said it was. YOU said, whatever he did cant be as bad as killing innocents.

 

[hilts]

its not worse...i never said it was. YOU said, whatever he did cant be as bad as killing innocents.

No I didn’t.

 

[hilts]

Its not, both as you say are abhorrent.

And that’s all I have been saying all this time, I do wonder sometimes.

 

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

It’s irrelevant in fact it only strengthens my case. Whatever this soldier has done it can’t be any worse than cold blooded killing of innocents. Or do we know look at murder on a scale? You have either committed a crime or you haven’t. If you want to give people amnesty then you give to everyone, it’s not a hard concept.

No I didn’t.

er, this says you did

It’s irrelevant in fact it only strengthens my case. Whatever this soldier has done it can’t be any worse than cold blooded killing of innocents. Or do we know look at murder on a scale? You have either committed a crime or you haven’t. If you want to give people amnesty then you give to everyone, it’s not a hard concept.

 

[hilts]

er, this says you did

It’s irrelevant in fact it only strengthens my case. Whatever this soldier has done it can’t be any worse than cold blooded killing of innocents. Or do we know look at murder on a scale? You have either committed a crime or you haven’t. If you want to give people amnesty then you give to everyone, it’s not a hard concept.

You have literally just quoted me proving my point, you have even underlined it. Read it again and think, crying out loud.

 

[AlexWilliamsGloves]

You have literally just quoted me proving my point, you have even underlined it. Read it again and think, crying out loud.

ah, ok...fair enough i have misinterpreted what you were saying. Apologies. I read it to be you thought what he had done, was not as bad as a terrorist....i was trying to argue its exactly like that of a terrorist.

 

[BobKowalski]

There was no inference at all and I’m a tad puzzled you even drew that conclusion. I’m saying whatever he has done can’t be any worse because there is no worse. Innocents were killed by all sides. This isn’t justifying his action for Christ sake. Work on your comprehension.

The inference is that the people shot on that day were not innocents. It’s the same with the Hillsborough victims. To shift responsibility it’s argued that they were in some way to blame for what happened. The people shot that day were on a civil rights march so by being there they share some responsibility for what happened.

The same argument would not be used if it was a terrorist attack on say a peace rally. We wouldn’t blame the people attending. We wouldn’t be arguing that IRA command should take more responsibility than the person setting the bomb. There is no qualification with respect to a terrorist attack whereas we have a lot of qualification over this attack on unarmed civilians.

I accept you may not have meant this but that is the message I got.

 

[hilts]

ah, ok...fair enough i have misinterpreted what you were saying. Apologies. I read it to be you thought what he had done, was not as bad as a terrorist....i was trying to argue its exactly like that of a terrorist.

Apology accepted

 

[hilts]

The inference is that the people shot on that day were not innocents. It’s the same with the Hillsborough victims. To shift responsibility it’s argued that they were in some way to blame for what happened. The people shot that day were on a civil rights march so by being there they share some responsibility for what happened.

The same argument would not be used if it was a terrorist attack on say a peace rally. We wouldn’t blame the people attending. We wouldn’t be arguing that IRA command should take more responsibility than the person setting the bomb. There is no qualification with respect to a terrorist attack whereas we have a lot of qualification over this attack on unarmed civilians.

I accept you may not have meant this but that is the message I got.

If you read a post and jump to conclusions that is your problem, not having a go but I have posted time and time again that murdering innocents by whoever is just fucking wrong. I have not once defended the soldier on any of these posts in fact the opposite. People see what they want.

 

[Neville Kneville]

What the hell are you talking about man, you would have to show me where I said our military doesn’t need standards. Do you or do you not believe if we prosecute this soldier it is right to try and prosecute every murderer during the troubles. They have all left misery to victims families.

Yes or no it’s pretty straightforward.

I personally think that terrorists should be prosecuted.

I also, think, actually, I also know that our armed forces have a standard to adhere to.

So the two things are completely unrelated.

We shouldn't prosecute terrorists for revenge, we should prosecute for the crimes they committed.

We shouldn't choose whether we prosecute soldiers, because of what we decide to do with terrorists, we prosecute our people if we think they have broken the law because WE don't agree with them shooting or killing inoccent people.

We should want justice for innoccent people in both cases, but it's not a competition, nick one on one side, balance it with one from the other.

If our soldiers murder people, nail them for it.

 

[hilts]

I personally think that terrorists should be prosecuted.

I also, think, actually, I also know that our armed forces have a standard to adhere to.

So the two things are completely unrelated.

We shouldn't prosecute terrorists for revenge, we should prosecute for the crimes they committed.

We shouldn't choose whether we prosecute soldiers, because of what we decide to do with terrorists, we prosecute our people if we think they have broken the law because WE don't agree with them shooting or killing inoccent people.

We should want justice for innoccent people in both cases, but it's not a competition, nick one on one side, balance it with one from the other.

If our soldiers murder people, nail them for it.

The moral side of the argument speaks for itself in relation to murder. I don’t think anyone can hand on heart say the govt. the law or the police have been busting a gut to bring murderers to justice since the GFA was signed .

Why this guy gets special treatment as opposed to a multitude of barbaric behaviour doesn’t smell right.

 

[Neville Kneville]

The moral side of the argument speaks for itself in relation to murder. I don’t think anyone can hand on heart say the govt. the law or the police have been busting a gut to bring murderers to justice since the GFA was signed .

Why this guy gets special treatment as opposed to a multitude of barbaric behaviour doesn’t smell right.

That's a different argument.

A bigger one imo would be why he has got away with it for so long, if the evidence is there.

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

There was no inference at all and I’m a tad puzzled you even drew that conclusion. I’m saying whatever he has done can’t be any worse because there is no worse. Innocents were killed by all sides. This isn’t justifying his action for Christ sake. Work on your comprehension.

I accept that's not what you meant but your statement has enough ambiguity in it to be interpreted as what the soldier has done can't be worse than the killing of innocent people.
Misunderstanding. I apologise if your offended.
I do however think the victims reputations were tarnished and the cover up of the truth about the killings is worse than what other victims may have endured.
But I agree it's not a competition in misery.

 

[hilts]

That's a different argument.

A bigger one imo would be why he has got away with it for so long, if the evidence is there.

Not a different argument it’s all entwined and political

 

[mancity2012_eamo]

The moral side of the argument speaks for itself in relation to murder. I don’t think anyone can hand on heart say the govt. the law or the police have been busting a gut to bring murderers to justice since the GFA was signed .

Why this guy gets special treatment as opposed to a multitude of barbaric behaviour doesn’t smell right.

It should go higher, there is no doubt.
Let's see the evidence. Maybe it will.