Coronavirus (2021) thread

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True_Blue69 said:
Have you tried getting hold of a doctor recently? They don’t want to help people at the best of times never mind deal with hundreds of phone calls to validate someone’s covid mask status. Plus I’m pretty sure GDPR wouldn’t allow them to discuss patients medical records with a random shop keeper.
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the shop keeper wouldn't be the person issuing a fine, thats the police and would be the ones checking up.

the shop keepers could phone the police to get them involved if there were issues.
 
The Light Was Yellow Sir said:
Even though the boss of Moderna has said, this afternoon, that it looks like the vaccines will suffer a ‘material drop in effectiveness against the new variant?‘
Seems like it’s more about control than health now.
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It’s nothing to do with control. It’s a government trying to limit deaths whilst keeping the country open to keep the economy going.

I don’t feel controlled. I went to a health centre, had a booster and was home again in 20 mins.

How is that control?
 
Alan Harper's Tash said:
It’s nothing to do with control. It’s a government trying to limit deaths whilst keeping the country open to keep the economy going.

I don’t feel controlled. I went to a health centre, had a booster and was home again in 20 mins.

How is that control?
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Because the jab will put a tracker in your every move and then kill you. apparently.
 
True_Blue69 said:
Getting too deep this now.
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Not really, £200 fine for not wearing a mask, that fine will be administered by the police so they would be the ones who check up on any expemption.

Not that its relevant as Doctors have never given out exceptions. we'd have to create a whole new infrastructure for it so its all hypotheticals.
 
I'm not anti mask but just like the first time we get all the barrack room lawyers spouting nonsense when a simple click on the Gov UK website gives you the facts

The public are asked to be mindful of people who are exempt from wearing a face covering. The list of exemptions, which has been in place since face coverings became mandatory on public transport, includes hidden conditions such as anxiety or panic disorders, autism, breathing difficulties, dementia, reduced vision or if you are with someone who relies on lip reading to communicate.

Under the regulations, members of the public will need to wear face coverings that cover the nose and mouth in shops, supermarkets, shopping centres and transport hubs, to help curb the spread of the virus.

People are not required to prove they are exempt and it is for individuals to choose how they would want to communicate this to others. For those who would feel more comfortable showing something that says they do not have to wear a face covering, exemption cards are available to print or display on mobile phones from gov.uk.
 
The Light Was Yellow Sir said:
Even though the boss of Moderna has said, this afternoon, that it looks like the vaccines will suffer a ‘material drop in effectiveness against the new variant?‘
Seems like it’s more about control than health now.
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Sorry, but this is absolute conspiratorial bollocks.

"A material drop" does not mean "becoming ineffective"

For instance, vaccines are currently ~95% effective vs hospitalisation. If they become 2x less effective than they are now, that's a material drop, right?

Well, that's still 90% effective, because at 90% effectiveness, you're twice as likely to end up in hospital as you are at 95% effectiveness.

Is 90% effective worthwhile? Damn right.

Get a grip. Nobody is trying to control anyone. They're trying to control a virus.
 
paulchapo said:
I'm not anti mask but just like the first time we get all the barrack room lawyers spouting nonsense when a simple click on the Gov UK website gives you the facts

The public are asked to be mindful of people who are exempt from wearing a face covering. The list of exemptions, which has been in place since face coverings became mandatory on public transport, includes hidden conditions such as anxiety or panic disorders, autism, breathing difficulties, dementia, reduced vision or if you are with someone who relies on lip reading to communicate.

Under the regulations, members of the public will need to wear face coverings that cover the nose and mouth in shops, supermarkets, shopping centres and transport hubs, to help curb the spread of the virus.

People are not required to prove they are exempt and it is for individuals to choose how they would want to communicate this to others. For those who would feel more comfortable showing something that says they do not have to wear a face covering, exemption cards are available to print or display on mobile phones from gov.uk.
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I guess that just reinforces the point that it's pretty easy to avoid wearing one if that's your wish. Exempt or not.
 
The Light Was Yellow Sir said:
Even though the boss of Moderna has said, this afternoon, that it looks like the vaccines will suffer a ‘material drop in effectiveness against the new variant?‘
Seems like it’s more about control than health now.
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If you read the FT which reported Bancel’s comments made yesterday, you’ll see that one study had already suggested that Moderna’s vaccine had already shown a drop in effectiveness against Delta, so his predicting a further drop in effectiveness against a subsequent variant is hardly surprising.

For a country such as Greece, every pensioner vaccinated saves a substantial amount of money.
 
Phil1 said:
I guess that just reinforces the point that it's pretty easy to avoid wearing one if that's your wish. Exempt or not.
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Exactly my point. This states that further

Those who have an age, health or disability reason not to wear a face covering should not be routinely asked to provide any written evidence of this. Written evidence includes exemption cards.

There used to be a section stating it was an offence under the disability act to challenge somebody staring they were medically exempt but it appears to have disappeared or has been hidden elsewhere
 
A very simple stat to produce... how many people admitted to hospital with Covid had not been vaccinated, could there be an easier piece of data to produce?

Why do we not see this?

Are those admitted without a vaccination given said vaccination as part of their treatment?

Would add so much clarity to the picture.
 
The Light Was Yellow Sir said:
Even though the boss of Moderna has said, this afternoon, that it looks like the vaccines will suffer a ‘material drop in effectiveness against the new variant?‘
Seems like it’s more about control than health now.
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Effectiveness is a term that is used willy nilly without any thought of what it means.

When we talk of effectiveness here do we mean the ability to prevent a case or do we mean to prevent deaths/serious cases? They are two entirely different things and from a vaccine efficacy point of view all clinical trials have focused on reporting efficacy based upon preventing cases entirely.

If we measure effectiveness by the ability to prevent deaths/serious cases then effectiveness is very likely to remain unchanged at extremely high levels (90%+) as per with Delta. The ability to prevent a case though changes considerably by variant and the 'effectiveness' of the vaccines is very different.
 
BigJoe#1 said:
A very simple stat to produce... how many people admitted to hospital with Covid had not been vaccinated, could there be an easier piece of data to produce?

Why do we not see this?

Are those admitted without a vaccination given said vaccination as part of their treatment?

Would add so much clarity to the picture.
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This isn't possible because hospitals don't collect such data regularly. The reason why is not everyone admitted to hospital is ill with COVID, they just came to hospital for whatever reason and tested positive.

Put it this way, if someone broken their leg, went to hospital and tested positive on admission then why would it matter if they were vaccinated?

That person would be put on a COVID ward but they wouldn't necessarily be treated for COVID.
 
inbetween said:
This isn't possible because hospitals don't collect such data regularly. The reason why is not everyone admitted to hospital is ill with COVID, they just came to hospital for whatever reason and tested positive.

Put it this way, if someone broken their leg, went to hospital and tested positive on admission then why would it matter if they were vaccinated?

That person would be put on a COVID ward but they wouldn't necessarily be treated for COVID.
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Okay, if you need it simplified.... how many people in hospital (a figure currently produced daily) that test positive had not received their vaccination? To satisfy your point about why they were admitted, te reason for admittance could be deemed irrelevant though you could show a subset of people admitted for Covid reasons and non-covid reasons,
 
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