Discuss Pellegrini...(cont)

[taconinja]

although I have criticized pellers for his team selection and use of subs I don't think he did much wrong tonight. he started with just about the best 11 he could, I would have had kolorov in over clichy but its a close call. he had to start the second half with the same players, west brom would have been given a half time talking to and could have come out all guns blazing. as the half was as flat as a pancake he took aguero off and about the right time. silva could have perhaps done with 10 more mins but to be fair he could have done that injury in the first minute. its ok saying take these players off at half time but the lads want to play, if they are removed early every game they will be off. pellers got it right this time.

I'm in complete agreement. Squad selection was fine and so were the tactics.

 

[mancity1]

although I have criticized pellers for his team selection and use of subs I don't think he did much wrong tonight. he started with just about the best 11 he could, I would have had kolorov in over clichy but its a close call. he had to start the second half with the same players, west brom would have been given a half time talking to and could have come out all guns blazing. as the half was as flat as a pancake he took aguero off and about the right time. silva could have perhaps done with 10 more mins but to be fair he could have done that injury in the first minute. its ok saying take these players off at half time but the lads want to play, if they are removed early every game they will be off. pellers got it right this time.

I'm in complete agreement. Squad selection was fine and so were the tactics.

Would have had Jovetic ahead of Nasri but as you say its about as good as we can do given injuries etc.

 

[bernabias home shirt]

50 Quatloos to the first moron to tell me that injuries haven't blighted our season! Come on, I feckin' dare ya!

...

I'll take that bet. Siva was excellent tonight. 3-1 up at HT. Good day at the office. We are nursing two key players. So what do you do at HT? You sub one of these key players. You sub your other key player around 10 minutes into the second half when you have had chance to assess how its going. You want to know how it was going? WBA had settled for a 3-1 loss. We already know Sliva cannot train and can at best manage only one game a week. We have 4 other games after this which if we win give us a decent shout at the title. So riddle me this. Why the fuck are both these two half fit key players still on the pitch after the 60 minute mark? Where we under pressure? In danger of losing the game? Did I miss something? The game was over. It had joined the great green pitch in the sky. It had relinquished all life, expired, deceased, kicked the bucket. But no what do we get? Sergio limping off (just in time) and Silva in a crumpled heap waving his arm in the air in distress.

Injuries may have blighted out chances this season. They may indeed be the sole reason why we don't win the title. But when some of those injuries can be avoided through plain common sense I tend to lose all reason, hope and faith.

I will feel better in the morning but right now I am tad pissed off.

Let's take this slowly. Are you ready?

Aguero needs games to get to full fitness and is been given the game time accordingly. Was removed after an hour as expected, sharpness clearly returning.

Silva missed the last game and that cost us two points. This game he was singlehandedly running and looking totally comfortable until an incident nobody could have predicted happened.

I'm going to hazard a guess here. You have never played 90 minutes of football in your life, or attended a game. In the words in Gerrie Nel, am I right?

So your putting the horror Sunderland showing and two points lost on us missing silva
You really don't think we had enough out there to turn them over?

 

[Skashion]

No need to "shut the fuck up", as you put it. I just meant to highlight the absurdity that every scenario or decision is seized upon by either side of this particular argument to vindicate their stance.

Whilst I'm probably as sick as you of this back and forth business, it doesn't mean the criticisms don't hold water, or some of the criticisms couldn't be equally levelled at both Mancini and Pellegrini.

 

[Exeter Blue I am here]

Considering how this season's injuries are now considered by certain elements as the reason that we haven't maximised this season's potential, it would have been the prudent thing to do to take Silva and Aguero off at the earliest opportunity.

I was gutted when they both emerged for the 2nd half and was counting the 18 minutes second by second until Kun was substituted. We had Jovetic and Milner on the bench so weren't short of cover either. I know Kun needs match fitness, but at this stage of the season we need to be careful with him and for me Silva had completed his nights work in the 1st 45.

I was also hoping for Zabaleta to come off too, because his levels have dropped recently with good cause.

What bollocks, you and me both know that if he'd taken them both off at half time tonight, and we'd finished the game 3-3, you'd have been on this thread asking what the fuck was he doing, and telling us that he needs to go.

He managed Aguero perfectly tonight, he'd played well, looked really sharp, but was beginning to tire, so he took him off, right on cue. Silva's problem was unforeseen, and unfortunate, but he looked fine until that point, to blame anyone for that is ridiculous.

As for Zab, are you the fool who sits behind me who was going on all night about why Richards wasn't being used ? He's not being used quite simply because he can't stay fit, and then can't be trusted in the style we play if used. Zab's problem in the last 2 games has been Nasri trying to avoid any responsibility in our half of the pitch, he was at his worst in the second half tonight, giving absolutely no protection to Zab, and rarely providing any outlet when we got the ball.

Nasri has been very good most of this season, but recently he's reverted to the one who I would have happily seen leave last summer, I hope its temporary, because the Nasri from earlier this season was a real asset.

A near perfect summation. I think given our inability to hang on to a lead against Sunderland, and the absolute need to close games out at this stage of the season, Silva was left on in the hope that we'd add a fourth goal. Either way, I think he'd have been removed within the next 5 minutes anyway. Personally, I'd have had him off around the 65 minute mark though, if only because this is City we're talking about and we've caught umpteen bad breaks with injuries this season already. Plus ca change.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

Considering how this season's injuries are now considered by certain elements as the reason that we haven't maximised this season's potential, it would have been the prudent thing to do to take Silva and Aguero off at the earliest opportunity.

I was gutted when they both emerged for the 2nd half and was counting the 18 minutes second by second until Kun was substituted. We had Jovetic and Milner on the bench so weren't short of cover either. I know Kun needs match fitness, but at this stage of the season we need to be careful with him and for me Silva had completed his nights work in the 1st 45.

I was also hoping for Zabaleta to come off too, because his levels have dropped recently with good cause.

What bollocks, you and me both know that if he'd taken them both off at half time tonight, and we'd finished the game 3-3, you'd have been on this thread asking what the fuck was he doing, and telling us that he needs to go.

He managed Aguero perfectly tonight, he'd played well, looked really sharp, but was beginning to tire, so he took him off, right on cue. Silva's problem was unforeseen, and unfortunate, but he looked fine until that point, to blame anyone for that is ridiculous.

As for Zab, are you the fool who sits behind me who was going on all night about why Richards wasn't being used ? He's not being used quite simply because he can't stay fit, and then can't be trusted in the style we play if used. Zab's problem in the last 2 games has been Nasri trying to avoid any responsibility in our half of the pitch, he was at his worst in the second half tonight, giving absolutely no protection to Zab, and rarely providing any outlet when we got the ball.

Nasri has been very good most of this season, but recently he's reverted to the one who I would have happily seen leave last summer, I hope its temporary, because the Nasri from earlier this season was a real asset.

A near perfect summation. I think given our inability to hang on to a lead against Sunderland, and the absolute need to close games out at this stage of the season, Silva was left on in the hope that we'd add a fourth goal. Either way, I think he'd have been removed within the next 5 minutes anyway. Personally, I'd have had him off around the 65 minute mark though, if only because this is City we're talking about and we've caught umpteen bad breaks with injuries this season already. Plus ca change.

Without a shadow of doubt that's what it was. We were bang on top and looked likely to score again with silva at the centre of everything. 4-1 and it is game over and you can make the changes. Pellegrini has repeatedly substituted him between 65 and 80 minutes and walked a tightrope between keeping him fresh and having him on the park. He wasn't some inured player being played back into it, like aguero, he was a player who had missed the last game and looked on top of his game. You can't legislate for a tackle/fall like that.

I've heard on here you aren't allowed to say we have been unlucky with injuries this season. I've had city fans (that's city, not Liverpool, to be clear) busying away like beavers trying to produce daft stats to back up that stance. Well anyone of that opinion can get to fuck as far as I'm concerned, as I've seen it with my own two eyes all season. Every time we have a 'key' period we are missing 'key' players. The whole season has been dogged by it. I've never known one like it.

 

[onceabluealways]

50 Quatloos to the first moron to tell me that injuries haven't blighted our season! Come on, I feckin' dare ya!

...

I'll take that bet. Siva was excellent tonight. 3-1 up at HT. Good day at the office. We are nursing two key players. So what do you do at HT? You sub one of these key players. You sub your other key player around 10 minutes into the second half when you have had chance to assess how its going. You want to know how it was going? WBA had settled for a 3-1 loss. We already know Sliva cannot train and can at best manage only one game a week. We have 4 other games after this which if we win give us a decent shout at the title. So riddle me this. Why the fuck are both these two half fit key players still on the pitch after the 60 minute mark? Where we under pressure? In danger of losing the game? Did I miss something? The game was over. It had joined the great green pitch in the sky. It had relinquished all life, expired, deceased, kicked the bucket. But no what do we get? Sergio limping off (just in time) and Silva in a crumpled heap waving his arm in the air in distress.

Injuries may have blighted out chances this season. They may indeed be the sole reason why we don't win the title. But when some of those injuries can be avoided through plain common sense I tend to lose all reason, hope and faith.

I will feel better in the morning but right now I am tad pissed off.

Aguero needs games to get to full fitness and is been given the game time accordingly. Was removed after an hour as expected, sharpness clearly returning.

Silva missed the last game and that cost us two points. This game he was singlehandedly running and looking totally comfortable until an incident nobody could have predicted happened.

I'm going to hazard a guess here. You have never played 90 minutes of football in your life, or attended a game. In the words in Gerrie Nel, am I right?

Aguero off , I can understand but why at 3-1 up was silva not taken off at half time. If the manager has not got confidence in these players to beat a relegation challenging team with a 2 goal start over 45 minutes then he isn't good enough.

When you have probably the most influencial player carrying an injury which kept hm out of the team 6 days earlier then you take him off when the game is won ( half time).

Pellers substitutions this season have been shocking. His idea of a change is watch the clock until 60 minutes then change like for like.

 

[Didsbury Dave]

although I have criticized pellers for his team selection and use of subs I don't think he did much wrong tonight. he started with just about the best 11 he could, I would have had kolorov in over clichy but its a close call. he had to start the second half with the same players, west brom would have been given a half time talking to and could have come out all guns blazing. as the half was as flat as a pancake he took aguero off and about the right time. silva could have perhaps done with 10 more mins but to be fair he could have done that injury in the first minute. its ok saying take these players off at half time but the lads want to play, if they are removed early every game they will be off. pellers got it right this time.

I'm in complete agreement. Squad selection was fine and so were the tactics.

Would have had Jovetic ahead of Nasri but as you say its about as good as we can do given injuries etc.

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

 

[cibaman]

Two very big games coming up for MP. I don't think Liverpool's bandwagon will stop rolling before the end of the season. But whether it does or it doesn't we need to finish the season strongly. I thought one of the strongest justifications for a change of manager was the way last season fizzled out, the game at Everton being a low point. The performances in the remainder of this season will speak volumes about the extent to which MP has improved team spirit.

 

[BobKowalski]

Considering how this season's injuries are now considered by certain elements as the reason that we haven't maximised this season's potential, it would have been the prudent thing to do to take Silva and Aguero off at the earliest opportunity.

I was gutted when they both emerged for the 2nd half and was counting the 18 minutes second by second until Kun was substituted. We had Jovetic and Milner on the bench so weren't short of cover either. I know Kun needs match fitness, but at this stage of the season we need to be careful with him and for me Silva had completed his nights work in the 1st 45.

I was also hoping for Zabaleta to come off too, because his levels have dropped recently with good cause.

What bollocks, you and me both know that if he'd taken them both off at half time tonight, and we'd finished the game 3-3, you'd have been on this thread asking what the fuck was he doing, and telling us that he needs to go.

He managed Aguero perfectly tonight, he'd played well, looked really sharp, but was beginning to tire, so he took him off, right on cue. Silva's problem was unforeseen, and unfortunate, but he looked fine until that point, to blame anyone for that is ridiculous...

No I wouldn't have blamed Pellers for making a prudent substitution. If the team without Silva or Aguero is incapable of shutting out WBA for 45 mins then that is an entirely different discussion. Given that WBA had settled for a 3-1 loss in the second half I think we would have struggled through.

If the score had been 1-1 or even 2-1 I wouldn't haven't advocated withdrawing either Sergio or David at HT. At 3-1 though I would have taken one off and probably Sergio even though it is Silva who right now needs more protection. Sergio had helped fire us into a 3-1 lead so job done. Silva is needed for us to control and dictate the game hence why I would not have benched him at HT. Plus we have Jovetic to replace Aguero so I am not losing attacking intent. We didn't know how WBA would respond in the second half but after 10 minutes we did. WBA response was to not really bother to respond. At 55 minutes I would have had Silva off and wrapped in swaddling blankets ready for the next match. Playing Silva was a necessary and calculated gamble to enable us to win the match. Playing Silva beyond the point the match was won and could have been closed out was just a gamble.

The game for me was marred by Silva being carted off and the impact this may have on the next 4 vital games. I still think we have decent shot at the title so yes I get pissed when I think we are needlessly inviting injuries. Its not as if this is the first time I have raised the issue of in game management and the way we have utilised our considerable resources and I doubt it will be the last.