Discuss Pellegrini...(cont)

[St Helens Blue (Exiled)]

Morning all.
Thought Pellegrini got the team bang on last night.
Nobody could have predicted the injury to Silva because that happens in football however I am still a little concerned with how easy teams are finding it to counter us with the high line we have taken on.
I am still unconvinced with Pellegrini but I will concede he should be given another season to see if he has learnt from his mistakes and that he realises there are no easy games in this league.

 

[Marvin]

I expected Silva to be subbed around the hour mark, but remember that we were also nursing Aguero back into the game. Had it just been Silva who was the only injury doubt, he'd have probably been subbed.

Poor show in my opinion if you are going to criticise the manager for a bit of bad luck. Anyway enough on that.

Today perhaps we should be looking at the departure of Moyes from this thread and considering that Moyes was unable to overcome a hostile dressing room, but that Pellegrini seems to have been able to bring his players with him.

Both managers and football clubs had very similar starts, and both were in very similar positions after 1/3rd of the season yet City pushed on and improved, whereas Moyes was unable to do so

When Mancini was facing the sack, I was worried that a new manager would be appointed and would collapse and we'd be on the outside of the top 4 with the threat of FFP hanging over us, and it was all too big a risk to take. Looks like in hindsight that we had no alternative, but we can be very relieved that we have got through the always difficult first season of a manager at a crucial era - the first monitoring phase of Financial Fair Play. Imagine we were facing a Sanction and we were outside of the top 4.

As it is, we have won a Cup, we're fighting for the League title, and we've more or less qualified for the Champions League. It could have been better, ironically if we had failed in the Cups.

We've faced 2 problems:

1) We couldn't win away consistently for the first 10 weeks of the season
2) Progress in 4 competitions created a quadruple buzz, but left us with an injury crisis that derailed our surge in the League. Remember that afternoon at Spurs when Sergio was on fire but went off injured. Now he's back, but then we had Kompany injured in advance of the Liverpool game, and then Silva is in and out. And on it goes. I am convinced that had we stayed injury free, or relatively so, we would already be Champions

 

[OB1]

I'm in complete agreement. Squad selection was fine and so were the tactics.

Would have had Jovetic ahead of Nasri but as you say its about as good as we can do given injuries etc.

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

I think you are being harsh on Nasri. He can be frustrating and his form in the second half of the season has not matched the first. However, it was him attacking the full back and crossing the ball that led to the first goal; his delivery from the corner that we scored the third goal off was useful. He also made more passes than any other player on the park, with his usual high completion rate, so you can hardly say that he was not involved in the game. He plays it safe a bit too much, which the manager needs to work on him about, and he is never going to be a swashbuckling ball winner.

 

[Marvin]

Would have had Jovetic ahead of Nasri but as you say its about as good as we can do given injuries etc.

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

I think you are being harsh on Nasri. He can be frustrating and his form in the second half of the season has not matched the first. However, it was him attacking the full back and crossing the ball that led to the first goal; his delivery from the corner that we scored the third goal off was useful. He also made more passes than any other player on the park, with his usual high completion rate, so you can hardly say that he was not involved in the game. He plays it safe a bit too much, which the manager needs to work on him about, and he is never going to be a swashbuckling ball winner.

There was a period when Nasri was unplayable and our best player

A goal scoring threat from midfield - more so than Silva who still doesn't shoot when well placed.

 

[BibbyBlue85]

Pellegrini is doing well in his first season. Next year with a few more additions I would expect further progress in the CL and another domestic cup at least. It took Bobby his 2nd full season to win the league and I think Pellegrini will do the same. Bobby was more tactically astute but boy I love how we play now. Freeflowing and freescoring

 

[taconinja]

Considering how this season's injuries are now considered by certain elements as the reason that we haven't maximised this season's potential, it would have been the prudent thing to do to take Silva and Aguero off at the earliest opportunity.

I was gutted when they both emerged for the 2nd half and was counting the 18 minutes second by second until Kun was substituted. We had Jovetic and Milner on the bench so weren't short of cover either. I know Kun needs match fitness, but at this stage of the season we need to be careful with him and for me Silva had completed his nights work in the 1st 45.

I was also hoping for Zabaleta to come off too, because his levels have dropped recently with good cause.

What bollocks, you and me both know that if he'd taken them both off at half time tonight, and we'd finished the game 3-3, you'd have been on this thread asking what the fuck was he doing, and telling us that he needs to go.

He managed Aguero perfectly tonight, he'd played well, looked really sharp, but was beginning to tire, so he took him off, right on cue. Silva's problem was unforeseen, and unfortunate, but he looked fine until that point, to blame anyone for that is ridiculous...

No I wouldn't have blamed Pellers for making a prudent substitution. If the team without Silva or Aguero is incapable of shutting out WBA for 45 mins then that is an entirely different discussion. Given that WBA had settled for a 3-1 loss in the second half I think we would have struggled through.

If the score had been 1-1 or even 2-1 I wouldn't haven't advocated withdrawing either Sergio or David at HT. At 3-1 though I would have taken one off and probably Sergio even though it is Silva who right now needs more protection. Sergio had helped fire us into a 3-1 lead so job done. Silva is needed for us to control and dictate the game hence why I would not have benched him at HT. Plus we have Jovetic to replace Aguero so I am not losing attacking intent. We didn't know how WBA would respond in the second half but after 10 minutes we did. WBA response was to not really bother to respond. At 55 minutes I would have had Silva off and wrapped in swaddling blankets ready for the next match. Playing Silva was a necessary and calculated gamble to enable us to win the match. Playing Silva beyond the point the match was won and could have been closed out was just a gamble.

The game for me was marred by Silva being carted off and the impact this may have on the next 4 vital games. I still think we have decent shot at the title so yes I get pissed when I think we are needlessly inviting injuries. Its not as if this is the first time I have raised the issue of in game management and the way we have utilised our considerable resources and I doubt it will be the last.

What if he had been substituted and three minutes later Fernandinho went down?<br /><br />-- Tue Apr 22, 2014 7:53 am --<br /><br />

Would have had Jovetic ahead of Nasri but as you say its about as good as we can do given injuries etc.

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

I think you are being harsh on Nasri. He can be frustrating and his form in the second half of the season has not matched the first. However, it was him attacking the full back and crossing the ball that led to the first goal; his delivery from the corner that we scored the third goal off was useful. He also made more passes than any other player on the park, with his usual high completion rate, so you can hardly say that he was not involved in the game. He plays it safe a bit too much, which the manager needs to work on him about, and he is never going to be a swashbuckling ball winner.

There was also a good section of the second half where it was obvious the manager wanted us to control the ball and kill the game. I'm not sure if that's been brought up, but it's fairly apparent.

 

[OB1]

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

I think you are being harsh on Nasri. He can be frustrating and his form in the second half of the season has not matched the first. However, it was him attacking the full back and crossing the ball that led to the first goal; his delivery from the corner that we scored the third goal off was useful. He also made more passes than any other player on the park, with his usual high completion rate, so you can hardly say that he was not involved in the game. He plays it safe a bit too much, which the manager needs to work on him about, and he is never going to be a swashbuckling ball winner.

There was also a good section of the second half where it was obvious the manager wanted us to control the ball and kill the game. I'm not sure if that's been brought up, but it's fairly apparent.

And Nasri is usually good at keeping the ball, except when he goes dribbling in his own half near the end of the game!

 

[BobKowalski]

What bollocks, you and me both know that if he'd taken them both off at half time tonight, and we'd finished the game 3-3, you'd have been on this thread asking what the fuck was he doing, and telling us that he needs to go.

He managed Aguero perfectly tonight, he'd played well, looked really sharp, but was beginning to tire, so he took him off, right on cue. Silva's problem was unforeseen, and unfortunate, but he looked fine until that point, to blame anyone for that is ridiculous...

No I wouldn't have blamed Pellers for making a prudent substitution. If the team without Silva or Aguero is incapable of shutting out WBA for 45 mins then that is an entirely different discussion. Given that WBA had settled for a 3-1 loss in the second half I think we would have struggled through.

If the score had been 1-1 or even 2-1 I wouldn't haven't advocated withdrawing either Sergio or David at HT. At 3-1 though I would have taken one off and probably Sergio even though it is Silva who right now needs more protection. Sergio had helped fire us into a 3-1 lead so job done. Silva is needed for us to control and dictate the game hence why I would not have benched him at HT. Plus we have Jovetic to replace Aguero so I am not losing attacking intent. We didn't know how WBA would respond in the second half but after 10 minutes we did. WBA response was to not really bother to respond. At 55 minutes I would have had Silva off and wrapped in swaddling blankets ready for the next match. Playing Silva was a necessary and calculated gamble to enable us to win the match. Playing Silva beyond the point the match was won and could have been closed out was just a gamble.

The game for me was marred by Silva being carted off and the impact this may have on the next 4 vital games. I still think we have decent shot at the title so yes I get pissed when I think we are needlessly inviting injuries. Its not as if this is the first time I have raised the issue of in game management and the way we have utilised our considerable resources and I doubt it will be the last.

What if he had been substituted and three minutes later Fernandinho went down?

It does bring me onto Point 2. I didn't see the need for 2 strikers on the bench. I would have dropped Negrado and had Rodwell on. We are short of bodies in midfield with Yaya out and Silva carrying an injury (Aguero was more about getting match sharpness back) so I would have liked to see a bench that reflected this.

In fairness though you cannot cover all eventualities. This is just what I would have preferred to see on the bench and how I would have preferred us to manage the in game situation with Aguero and Silva. Some will agree and some don't.

 

[OB1]

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

I think you are being harsh on Nasri. He can be frustrating and his form in the second half of the season has not matched the first. However, it was him attacking the full back and crossing the ball that led to the first goal; his delivery from the corner that we scored the third goal off was useful. He also made more passes than any other player on the park, with his usual high completion rate, so you can hardly say that he was not involved in the game. He plays it safe a bit too much, which the manager needs to work on him about, and he is never going to be a swashbuckling ball winner.

There was a period when Nasri was unplayable and our best player

A goal scoring threat from midfield - more so than Silva who still doesn't shoot when well placed.

Yes that is another thing the manager needs to do: convince Silva to shoot more.

 

[Cobwebcat]

Would have had Jovetic ahead of Nasri but as you say its about as good as we can do given injuries etc.

So would I, and would have made that change at half time, Nasri is back to his worst, going backwards, taking the safe option, breaking moves down all the time. The thing is, though, I'm pretty sure from what I've seen Pellegrini gives the confidence players game time to play their way back into form. We've seen it with dzeko, de Michelis, clichy, and Nasri is the ultimate confidence player. That's why Pellegrini keeps picking him.

I think you are being harsh on Nasri. He can be frustrating and his form in the second half of the season has not matched the first. However, it was him attacking the full back and crossing the ball that led to the first goal; his delivery from the corner that we scored the third goal off was useful. He also made more passes than any other player on the park, with his usual high completion rate, so you can hardly say that he was not involved in the game. He plays it safe a bit too much, which the manager needs to work on him about, and he is never going to be a swashbuckling ball winner.

Just shows you how people see different things. I thought Nasri worked his socks off last night and after Silva was our MOTM.