Discuss Pellegrini (Pt 3)

[Millwallawayveteran1988]

The manager isn't responsible for individual gaffes

He is responsible for the overall pattern of play - that's good.

We can cut out the errors, and we will.

Agreed but he becomes responsible if he keeps picking the players responsible for them.....

 

[crystal_mais]

Think MP got it absolutely spot on yesterday. 2 mistakes cost us. We ran the game and basically should have left with al least a point.

My view Yaya needed to do more. We had to bolster the midfield basically because Yaya is too easily bypassed by teams.

This league is between us and Chelsea. For those slating Mourinho as a has been. You maybe eating your words.

For those saying we have gone backwards. Go back and analyse our away form over the last 3 seasons (inc title winning) it is not the best. We have pulled through based on our home form dominance. Hart has been nervy since Mancini started having a go at him last year. He looks. Mentally shot at times. A few weeks rest may do him some good but it's how MP spins it to him. Man management challenge for him here!!!

MP is learning and I still am very optimistic we will push Chelsea for the title this year.

 

[Skashion]

The defence is obviously an issue - the difference is whether you think that this is due to tactics/set-up (i.e. manager) or down to largely inexplicable and indefensible individual mistakes.

During the title-winning season, the Hart-Kompany-Lescott partnership was fantastic, and everyone would love to see us get back to that level of defensive consistency. But last season we'd already begun to look weaker and in the second half were shelling goals, especially away from home (3 at Southampton, 3 at Spurs, 3 at Norwich).

When these errors are consistently happening, and they are, it's not inexplicable.

We were the best defence last season, plus Mancini had already gone by Norwich, so your argument is invalid.

-- Mon Oct 28, 2013 10:52 am --

We have had the best defence in the league in the past, but our best defence has barely played together this season so it's not credible to use such stats to insinuate what you are. Variables also unaccounted for are the nature of the goals conceded this season. They've mostly been gifts and not due to the defensive system.

These fluke goals will stop. If we were conceding goals by being out passed & cut open, or from set pieces, I'd be worried. Right now, not so.

What can Pellegrini do, the poor guy...

We had the best defence last season even though Kompany didn't play in a third of our league games. I beg to differ, our defence has been shoddy, it hasn't been generally good with the odd error, we've been making blunder after blunder. Hull could have beaten us at home. Stoke would have beaten us with better finishing, so would Chelsea.

If they stop, then I will stop complaining about our defence going backwards, until then though, it has. The evidence shows it has.

 

[sh249]

The defence is obviously an issue - the difference is whether you think that this is due to tactics/set-up (i.e. manager) or down to largely inexplicable and indefensible individual mistakes.

During the title-winning season, the Hart-Kompany-Lescott partnership was fantastic, and everyone would love to see us get back to that level of defensive consistency. But last season we'd already begun to look weaker and in the second half were shelling goals, especially away from home (3 at Southampton, 3 at Spurs, 3 at Norwich).

When these errors are consistently happening, and they are, it's not inexplicable.

We were the best defence last season, plus Mancini had already gone by Norwich, so your argument is invalid.

Obviously agree to disagree. Mistakes like yesterday's, the Villa winner, Hart flapping at the corner at Cardiff - there's no explaining errors of that kind in terms of tactics or set-up. Obviously it's on Pellegrini to iron them out, but it's difficult to lay the blame at his door at the moment - the mistakes are being made by players who shouldn't be making them.

(and at Norwich - i.e 4-3 in Dec)

 

[pauljv92]

Hart has been nervy since Mancini started having a go at him last year. He looks. Mentally shot at times. A few weeks rest may do him some good but it's how MP spins it to him. Man management challenge for him here!!!

Then why hasn't he been responding to Pellegrini's love and support then. Surely being one of the players who spoke against Mancini to the board, he would have been among'st the most revved and focused to prove against the criticism of him and to make this season a success for Pellegrini. Was he then, perhaps already beginning to develop complacency and a cocky attitude last season, which caused Mancini to want to buy Begovic ( who btw is having a phenomenal season for stoke ) as competition for Hart. I just don't see with the the type of egotistical, complacent players we have ( look at Adam Johnson - he was as whiny as could have been, and see where his career has headed. ), that this kind of butler management is what is needed. They need dropping and a flame being set to their backsides. They need firey half-time team talks and a honest telling off if they haven't been performing up to scratch, especially when they are more than capable of performing to those standards. I just Pellegrini learns and quickly. We have been playing excellent, but that basically because our team is head and shoulder above the others in terms of attacking quality and yet, we are 6 points behind the leaders and have had just patchy form.

 

[onceabluealways]

I think he still needs more time -

But anyone who watched the bayern game and refused to change the formation before it was way to late doesn't really give you the confidence required

His continued belief in garcia is also a worrying factor.

His signing have been mixed-

Negredo - looks good
Fernandinho - looks good
navas - Jury out he needs to do more
Jovetic - the player i was most excited about - Pelle doesn't even want to play him
Not sure out of these which were really his signing but would guess negredo and navas so 50/50

 

[Skashion]

Obviously agree to disagree. Mistakes like yesterday's, the Villa winner, Hart flapping at the corner at Cardiff - there's no explaining errors of that kind in terms of tactics or set-up. Obviously it's on Pellegrini to iron them out, but it's difficult to lay the blame at his door at the moment - the mistakes are being made by players who shouldn't be making them.

(and at Norwich - i.e 4-3 in Dec)

Apart from the high line?

If Pellegrini was winning all his games 4-3, I wouldn't say a word. Results are the most important thing. Right now our attack is doing very well and playing the best football in the league, and yet we're 7th. Not hard to figure out why.

 

[prestonibbo_mcfc]

I think he still needs more time -

But anyone who watched the bayern game and refused to change the formation before it was way to late doesn't really give you the confidence required

His continued belief in garcia is also a worrying factor.

His signing have been mixed-

Negredo - looks good
Fernandinho - looks good
navas - Jury out he needs to do more
Jovetic - the player i was most excited about - Pelle doesn't even want to play him
Not sure out of these which were really his signing but would guess negredo and navas so 50/50

I'm not his biggest fan, but thought he was quite decent. Got his foot in and broke up play quite well,
then gave to the players. What the guy has to do to avoid shit is beyond me.

 

[robbieh]

Some on here seem a bit swept away by the fact that we look a bit more sophisticated up front than under Mancini.

The reality is that if we keep on playing like this we will struggle to make the top four. Remember that Arsenal have been playing far more attractive football than United over the last 8 years. What´s it won them? Dodgy defending has cost them and it will cost us. And although there have been many individual errors like yesterday the fact remains that we look like conceding all the time anyway.

Pellegrini to me looks a bit non-plussed about our league. It is not all about technique here. And while Mourinho´s display as usual was well over the top I am not sure the passive-unaggressive types do particularly well in England. Ramos and that swiss bloke at spurs spring to mind.

We will see but I think it highly unlikely that we will win the league this year and the CL looks well beyond us ergo we will be looking for a new gaffer in the summer. And this is not the ranting´s of a Mancini fan boy. I accept that his time had run it´s course. But by almost everyone´s opinion we have bought well in the summer and added to what was the best squad anyway. Currently languishing in 7th place after a reasonably easy first 9 games.

 

[Theengelbert]

It's a strange thing because on paper it's simple. Our attackers are producing the goods week in week out, they all look happy, are playing as a team and we are top scorers in the league.

The defence is leaking goals all over the place so it's simple, we replace defenders and if necessary buy some more. However, Mancini managed to make these defenders (and hart) some of the tightest in world football. So what's going on?

Either their confidence is shot, they can't be bothered any more or pellegrini's tactics for them have screwed things up (man marking vs zonal marking?).

Personally I would find out what mancini was doing for the defense and replicate that, because thid was working. I'd give hart a break and go for pantillimon and I would just stop persisting with javi garcia in any position.