Discuss Pellegrini...

[BobKowalski]

Obviously correct. But if we don't win the league you have to look at those games against Liverpool and Chelsea and see that they are must NOT lose games. Winning those games is great but not losing them is as important. I made this point yesterday but if we had hung on at Stamford Bridge and took a point on Sunday (which would should have done) we'd be 2 points better off and Liverpool and Chelsea would both be 2 points worse off.

I suspect the club will more likely look at Cardiff/Villa/Liverpool/Chelsea not because we were outplayed or because we should've play for a draw, but because those matches were thrown away due to unforced errors from reliable players.

Exactly. Cardiff and Villa we were pretty comfortably in the driving seat at 2-1 and individual errors cost us 3 points and then ended up costing us a point. Same at the Chelsea and Liverpool game we worked hard to get back into both games after going behind and then errors have cost us again.

In any review of this or any season I would have thought all aspects will be looked at including the number of unforced player errors. The home game against Chelsea with MDM in midfield was an error in set up/personnel and had a big impact as that was the game where a win would have seen us take a firm grip on the title race. Arsenal away. Excellent first half. Second half Arsenal respond and we seem unable to respond in turn. Again a win would have been a big step toward winning the title.

Yes Kompany 'cost' us the crucial third goal on Sunday but the match was lost in that 30 minutes where we simply couldn't cope with their intensity, movement or shape. You cannot give your main title rival a 2 goal head start. That opening period was crucial and we simply didn't prepare for it tactically or mentally.

3 big games and 1 point.

Finally the FA Cup tie against Wigan. The really annoying thing about Wigan is that in the previous tie Pellers did a number of Mourinho just as much as Mourinho did on Pellers in the League game. The hard work had been done. So what did we do? Decide to have a fans open day complete with water slide on the pitch because no fucker turned up to do battle with that Wigan side.

We have an excellent team and under Pellers we have played some excellent football. We can still win this title as Mourinho will not want to lose out to Liverpool any more than we do because if Liverpool, a side that finished 7th last year, do win the bloody thing then hard questions can be asked about him as well as Pellers as to how the fuck they both managed to let that happen and never mind your little ponies, transitional periods, and 'its my first time in the PL' bollocks.

Losing out to ManU under Taggart is one thing. But losing out to Liverpool under Rodgers with a Chelsea reject striker and Kolo Toure in the back 4 is a shooting offence never mind a sackable one.

Thankfully I can see Jose doing a number on Liverpool and can also see 'pool fucking up elsewhere so I am not that concerned but I am more concerned then I should be in the middle of fucking April.

 

[gungho-tactics]

They've got a lot of growing to do then :)

Here's Martin Samuel's take on Pellers (apols if already posted elsewhere):

We might not like it but he usually hits the nail on the head
and he has done yet again.
What he has written is very hard to argue against.
In the crucial games against both Chelsea and Liverpool when it really counted we have come away without a single point.
That is not how champions win titles.

+1.

what we need is a manager as sharp as a tack, younger fresher more with it than pellers. I think he's got his big jobs, us and Madrid, just a little too late in his career. a fine man but I'd rather have a pitbull, then again we know what our players do to anyone that crosses them.

Uwe Rosler.

 

[nijinsky's fetlocks]

We might not like it but he usually hits the nail on the head
and he has done yet again.
What he has written is very hard to argue against.
In the crucial games against both Chelsea and Liverpool when it really counted we have come away without a single point.
That is not how champions win titles.

+1.

what we need is a manager as sharp as a tack, younger fresher more with it than pellers. I think he's got his big jobs, us and Madrid, just a little too late in his career. a fine man but I'd rather have a pitbull, then again we know what our players do to anyone that crosses them.

Uwe Rosler.

Are you being serious here?
Only it's hard to tell on here anymore.

 

[chris85mcfc]

I suspect the club will more likely look at Cardiff/Villa/Liverpool/Chelsea not because we were outplayed or because we should've play for a draw, but because those matches were thrown away due to unforced errors from reliable players.

Exactly. Cardiff and Villa we were pretty comfortably in the driving seat at 2-1 and individual errors cost us 3 points and then ended up costing us a point. Same at the Chelsea and Liverpool game we worked hard to get back into both games after going behind and then errors have cost us again.

In any review of this or any season I would have thought all aspects will be looked at including the number of unforced player errors. The home game against Chelsea with MDM in midfield was an error in set up/personnel and had a big impact as that was the game where a win would have seen us take a firm grip on the title race. Arsenal away. Excellent first half. Second half Arsenal respond and we seem unable to respond in turn. Again a win would have been a big step toward winning the title.

Yes Kompany 'cost' us the crucial third goal on Sunday but the match was lost in that 30 minutes where we simply couldn't cope with their intensity, movement or shape. You cannot give your main title rival a 2 goal head start. That opening period was crucial and we simply didn't prepare for it tactically or mentally.

3 big games and 1 point.

Finally the FA Cup tie against Wigan. The really annoying thing about Wigan is that in the previous tie Pellers did a number of Mourinho just as much as Mourinho did on Pellers in the League game. The hard work had been done. So what did we do? Decide to have a fans open day complete with water slide on the pitch because no fucker turned up to do battle with that Wigan side.

We have an excellent team and under Pellers we have played some excellent football. We can still win this title as Mourinho will not want to lose out to Liverpool any more than we do because if Liverpool, a side that finished 7th last year, do win the bloody thing then hard questions can be asked about him as well as Pellers as to how the fuck they both managed to let that happen and never mind your little ponies, transitional periods, and 'its my first time in the PL' bollocks.

Losing out to ManU under Taggart is one thing. But losing out to Liverpool under Rodgers with a Chelsea reject striker and Kolo Toure in the back 4 is a shooting offence never mind a sackable one.

Thankfully I can see Jose doing a number on Liverpool and can also see 'pool fucking up elsewhere so I am not that concerned but I am more concerned then I should be in the middle of fucking April.

Tbh mate i think you've forgot the main one there, can you imagine a certain Victor Moses turning back up for pre season training in July at Chelsea with a PL winners medal round his neck. Now that would make Jose look rather silly.

 

[supercity88]

It is the same in every league. You always have to play with a balanced team, Pellegrini knows this very well. He's supposed to be an expert at coaching 4-2-2-2. Traditionally this formation has two defensive midfielders. Toure is no defensive midfielder, so why is he pretending to be one.

I like how you are so focussed on what Pellegrini did wrong you ignore the system Liverpool played. They played a diamond variation of a 4-4-2 that worked as a 4-3-3 at times and was very fluid. It was about Gerrard sat deeper as a one man defensive midfielder and Henderson and Coutinho further forward. Sterling was bursting in from wide positions and Sturridge and Suarez were allowed to move all over the front line. Their team was very much attacking. They didn't play 2 defensive midfielders. They could have played Lucas for more balance. Henderson is not a defensive midfielder in Liverpool's system. They pressed high up the pitch to win the ball back, as is our style. That means you are defending high up the pitch and on the front foot. Their system was exploited as we grew into the game and Silva got on the ball more and more. That coincided with Milner's movement wide, supporting Dzeko. Because they were pressing high up the pitch, when we had the ball further up the park the likes of Suarez, Coutinho, Sturridge and Sterling were too far forward and we managed to get 2 on 1 around the box several times. Just as we have been caught out this season, a quick ball forward to Aguero ended up with him turning Skrtel and us being in a great position to score. But we didn't take that chance. We actually handled their attacking play very well aside from their first goal. That was poor defending but their movement was good to create that chance. Otherwise their goals were because of poor marking and a mistake by Kompany. Our shape was actually very good.

The mistake I think Pellegrini made was in playing Navas rather than Milner. I think Navas is an excellent player but that he is often isolated and struggles to make an impact away from home. Milner took the game to Liverpool and exposed their vulnerability defensively - which is due to their attacking shape.

I'm not really interested in Liverpool to be honest.

I like to focus on my own team. This whole season I've been watching the back four being terrorized. Where is the protection ?

If you take no interest in others you learn nothing about yourself. We just played Liverpool and you question our balance. Liverpool have won ten on the trot despite playing an extremely overly attacking formation. They've pressed up the pitch to win the ball back so that they haven't needed to protect their back four because the opposition hasn't been able to get the ball in that area. The only side that have were us and we scored twice and created a lot of chances. In all the other games they've blown the opposition away by defending high up the pitch. You clearly are still of the mindset that we need to have a defensive midfielder protecting the back four. All that does is removes a player that can create anything going forward and you are left with a situation where we might be sound defensively but we struggle to break teams down. Chelsea anyone? The City of old. All the top teams in World football have a midfielder with a defensive mindset but who is able to pass incisively to start attacks.

This whole season you've not been watching City if you've seen the back 4 being terrorized. The two games with Bayern aside, we have coped more than competently with the oppositions attacks. Our loss to Liverpool was from a corner and a poor clearance. The defensive midfielder makes no difference there.<br /><br />-- Wed Apr 16, 2014 11:44 am --<br /><br />

It is the same in every league. You always have to play with a balanced team, Pellegrini knows this very well. He's supposed to be an expert at coaching 4-2-2-2. Traditionally this formation has two defensive midfielders. Toure is no defensive midfielder, so why is he pretending to be one.

I like how you are so focussed on what Pellegrini did wrong you ignore the system Liverpool played. They played a diamond variation of a 4-4-2 that worked as a 4-3-3 at times and was very fluid. It was about Gerrard sat deeper as a one man defensive midfielder and Henderson and Coutinho further forward. Sterling was bursting in from wide positions and Sturridge and Suarez were allowed to move all over the front line. Their team was very much attacking. They didn't play 2 defensive midfielders. They could have played Lucas for more balance. Henderson is not a defensive midfielder in Liverpool's system. They pressed high up the pitch to win the ball back, as is our style. That means you are defending high up the pitch and on the front foot. Their system was exploited as we grew into the game and Silva got on the ball more and more. That coincided with Milner's movement wide, supporting Dzeko. Because they were pressing high up the pitch, when we had the ball further up the park the likes of Suarez, Coutinho, Sturridge and Sterling were too far forward and we managed to get 2 on 1 around the box several times. Just as we have been caught out this season, a quick ball forward to Aguero ended up with him turning Skrtel and us being in a great position to score. But we didn't take that chance. We actually handled their attacking play very well aside from their first goal. That was poor defending but their movement was good to create that chance. Otherwise their goals were because of poor marking and a mistake by Kompany. Our shape was actually very good.

The mistake I think Pellegrini made was in playing Navas rather than Milner. I think Navas is an excellent player but that he is often isolated and struggles to make an impact away from home. Milner took the game to Liverpool and exposed their vulnerability defensively - which is due to their attacking shape.

I'm not really interested in Liverpool to be honest.

I like to focus on my own team. This whole season I've been watching the back four being terrorized. Where is the protection ?

If you take no interest in others you learn nothing about yourself. We just played Liverpool and you question our balance. Liverpool have won ten on the trot despite playing an extremely overly attacking formation. They've pressed up the pitch to win the ball back so that they haven't needed to protect their back four because the opposition hasn't been able to get the ball in that area. The only side that have were us and we scored twice and created a lot of chances. In all the other games they've blown the opposition away by defending high up the pitch. You clearly are still of the mindset that we need to have a defensive midfielder protecting the back four. All that does is removes a player that can create anything going forward and you are left with a situation where we might be sound defensively but we struggle to break teams down. Chelsea anyone? The City of old. All the top teams in World football have a midfielder with a defensive mindset but who is able to pass incisively to start attacks.

This whole season you've not been watching City if you've seen the back 4 being terrorized. The two games with Bayern aside, we have coped more than competently with the oppositions attacks. Our loss to Liverpool was from a corner and a poor clearance. The defensive midfielder makes no difference there.

 

[baildon blue]

I suspect the club will more likely look at Cardiff/Villa/Liverpool/Chelsea not because we were outplayed or because we should've play for a draw, but because those matches were thrown away due to unforced errors from reliable players.

Exactly. Cardiff and Villa we were pretty comfortably in the driving seat at 2-1 and individual errors cost us 3 points and then ended up costing us a point. Same at the Chelsea and Liverpool game we worked hard to get back into both games after going behind and then errors have cost us again.

In any review of this or any season I would have thought all aspects will be looked at including the number of unforced player errors. The home game against Chelsea with MDM in midfield was an error in set up/personnel and had a big impact as that was the game where a win would have seen us take a firm grip on the title race. Arsenal away. Excellent first half. Second half Arsenal respond and we seem unable to respond in turn. Again a win would have been a big step toward winning the title.

Yes Kompany 'cost' us the crucial third goal on Sunday but the match was lost in that 30 minutes where we simply couldn't cope with their intensity, movement or shape. You cannot give your main title rival a 2 goal head start. That opening period was crucial and we simply didn't prepare for it tactically or mentally.

3 big games and 1 point.

Finally the FA Cup tie against Wigan. The really annoying thing about Wigan is that in the previous tie Pellers did a number of Mourinho just as much as Mourinho did on Pellers in the League game. The hard work had been done. So what did we do? Decide to have a fans open day complete with water slide on the pitch because no fucker turned up to do battle with that Wigan side.

We have an excellent team and under Pellers we have played some excellent football. We can still win this title as Mourinho will not want to lose out to Liverpool any more than we do because if Liverpool, a side that finished 7th last year, do win the bloody thing then hard questions can be asked about him as well as Pellers as to how the fuck they both managed to let that happen and never mind your little ponies, transitional periods, and 'its my first time in the PL' bollocks.

Losing out to ManU under Taggart is one thing. But losing out to Liverpool under Rodgers with a Chelsea reject striker and Kolo Toure in the back 4 is a shooting offence never mind a sackable one.

Thankfully I can see Jose doing a number on Liverpool and can also see 'pool fucking up elsewhere so I am not that concerned but I am more concerned then I should be in the middle of fucking April.

Don't disagree with any of that . I agree it will be a massive failure if we don't win the title this year . He shot himself in the foot playing a strong team against West Ham in the 2nd leg . I bet if Mourinho had been in charge he would have run away with the league title. This current season .

 

[Anonymous]

Losing out to ManU under Taggart is one thing. But losing out to Liverpool under Rodgers with a Chelsea reject striker and Kolo Toure in the back 4 is a shooting offence never mind a sackable one.

I'd expect that comment from a two bit tabloid hack on the Sunday Supplement if i'm honest.

 

[gungho-tactics]

I like how you are so focussed on what Pellegrini did wrong you ignore the system Liverpool played. They played a diamond variation of a 4-4-2 that worked as a 4-3-3 at times and was very fluid. It was about Gerrard sat deeper as a one man defensive midfielder and Henderson and Coutinho further forward. Sterling was bursting in from wide positions and Sturridge and Suarez were allowed to move all over the front line. Their team was very much attacking. They didn't play 2 defensive midfielders. They could have played Lucas for more balance. Henderson is not a defensive midfielder in Liverpool's system. They pressed high up the pitch to win the ball back, as is our style. That means you are defending high up the pitch and on the front foot. Their system was exploited as we grew into the game and Silva got on the ball more and more. That coincided with Milner's movement wide, supporting Dzeko. Because they were pressing high up the pitch, when we had the ball further up the park the likes of Suarez, Coutinho, Sturridge and Sterling were too far forward and we managed to get 2 on 1 around the box several times. Just as we have been caught out this season, a quick ball forward to Aguero ended up with him turning Skrtel and us being in a great position to score. But we didn't take that chance. We actually handled their attacking play very well aside from their first goal. That was poor defending but their movement was good to create that chance. Otherwise their goals were because of poor marking and a mistake by Kompany. Our shape was actually very good.

The mistake I think Pellegrini made was in playing Navas rather than Milner. I think Navas is an excellent player but that he is often isolated and struggles to make an impact away from home. Milner took the game to Liverpool and exposed their vulnerability defensively - which is due to their attacking shape.

I'm not really interested in Liverpool to be honest.

I like to focus on my own team. This whole season I've been watching the back four being terrorized. Where is the protection ?

If you take no interest in others you learn nothing about yourself. We just played Liverpool and you question our balance. Liverpool have won ten on the trot despite playing an extremely overly attacking formation. They've pressed up the pitch to win the ball back so that they haven't needed to protect their back four because the opposition hasn't been able to get the ball in that area. The only side that have were us and we scored twice and created a lot of chances. In all the other games they've blown the opposition away by defending high up the pitch. You clearly are still of the mindset that we need to have a defensive midfielder protecting the back four. All that does is removes a player that can create anything going forward and you are left with a situation where we might be sound defensively but we struggle to break teams down. Chelsea anyone? The City of old. All the top teams in World football have a midfielder with a defensive mindset but who is able to pass incisively to start attacks.

This whole season you've not been watching City if you've seen the back 4 being terrorized. The two games with Bayern aside, we have coped more than competently with the oppositions attacks. Our loss to Liverpool was from a corner and a poor clearance. The defensive midfielder makes no difference there.
.

Am I of the mindset that we need a defensive midfielder ? No I'm of the mindset that we need TWO defensive midfielders, if we're going to play with attacking fullbacks.

 

[supercity88]

I'm not really interested in Liverpool to be honest.

I like to focus on my own team. This whole season I've been watching the back four being terrorized. Where is the protection ?

If you take no interest in others you learn nothing about yourself. We just played Liverpool and you question our balance. Liverpool have won ten on the trot despite playing an extremely overly attacking formation. They've pressed up the pitch to win the ball back so that they haven't needed to protect their back four because the opposition hasn't been able to get the ball in that area. The only side that have were us and we scored twice and created a lot of chances. In all the other games they've blown the opposition away by defending high up the pitch. You clearly are still of the mindset that we need to have a defensive midfielder protecting the back four. All that does is removes a player that can create anything going forward and you are left with a situation where we might be sound defensively but we struggle to break teams down. Chelsea anyone? The City of old. All the top teams in World football have a midfielder with a defensive mindset but who is able to pass incisively to start attacks.

This whole season you've not been watching City if you've seen the back 4 being terrorized. The two games with Bayern aside, we have coped more than competently with the oppositions attacks. Our loss to Liverpool was from a corner and a poor clearance. The defensive midfielder makes no difference there.
.

Am I of the mindset that we need a defensive midfielder ? No I'm of the mindset that we need TWO defensive midfielders, if we're going to play with attacking fullbacks.

Right then. Not going to say anything more than I disagree.

 

[nijinsky's fetlocks]

Losing out to ManU under Taggart is one thing. But losing out to Liverpool under Rodgers with a Chelsea reject striker and Kolo Toure in the back 4 is a shooting offence never mind a sackable one.

I'd expect that comment from a two bit tabloid hack on the Sunday Supplement if i'm honest.

You could try addressing the truth it contains, rather than making jibes about where it originates.
I don't think Pellegrini has pulled up any trees this season given the squad at his disposal, and if his predecessor had stayed and had a similar one, then you would have had the knives out long before now.
And you would have had a point.
I'm getting tired of hearing the same old mantra of injuries/bad luck/ bent refs/period of adjustment being wheeled out on here ad nauseum.
For what it's worth, I don't think Pellegrini is a great manager either - I consider him competent, but nothing more.
He doesn't make things happen - too many times he responds to situations rather than pre-empting them, and when he is caught out it costs us dear at this level.
That said, I think he'll get another season, but if he fails to deliver either the Premiership or the Champions League then he will be gone, and rightly so.