Keir Starmer

He’s a strange bloke, but one that breeds a better future.

Can anybody give me a reason to vote for the Tories to stay in power?
 
The Future’s Blue! said:
He’s a strange bloke, but one that breeds a better future.

Can anybody give me a reason to vote for the Tories to stay in power?
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I like Starmer, but I think he's missing the point for many people and he's trying to appeal to a failed cause that Johnson promoted during the last election that promised brexit as a positve and received huge support at the time.

Those arguments are increasingly being recognised as a load of bollocks by the electorate, and it's a shame Starmer can't see it and carries on with his 'make brexit work', nonsense, but if you want to vote tory, go ahead and do it.

Let's remember all those tory MP's voting for children staying hungry during the school holidays last summer.

That should be enough for you to put a cross in their box, surely?
 
NPBlue said:
I like Starmer, but I think he's missing the point for many people and he's trying to appeal to a failed cause that Johnson promoted during the last election that promised brexit as a positve and received huge support at the time.

Those arguments are increasingly being recognised as a load of bollocks by the electorate, and it's a shame Starmer can't see it and carries on with his 'make brexit work', nonsense, but if you want to vote tory, go ahead and do it.

Let's remember all those tory MP's voting for children staying hungry during the school holidays last summer.

That should be enough for you to put a cross in their box, surely?
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So, that’ll be a reason to vote the Tories out.

I ask the question as I was talking to somebody yesterday who is a Corbyn fan and he stated that he would prefer the Tories to stay in power rather than Starmer’s Labour win the GE. It was a really weird conversation and it was clear that he was angry and felt increasingly marginalised.

When asked what the Tories could do for him, he basically said he didn’t give a fuck as long as Starmer didn’t get in.

Thought it was strange but also good to understand how some feel they have been burnt by the current Labour leadership.
 
Vic said:
Even Iain Anderson from Stonewall was hesitating about calling the Scottish rapist "she". "This individual..."
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Aye but my original response was to a video from her vigil were some were chanting fuck starmer because of silence on the issues has become a trademark of his, as I said all he had to do was tweet condolence on the sad loss and hate crimes under laboilur blah blah, nothing that would damage him but would have been apreciated by the family and community

On a wider issue, he refuses to engage of meet with many groups even within the party on issues he either has no answer to, no interest or has an opposition view to.

Labour has always been a mixed bag and the leader needs to speak to all parts of it, Starmer seems to be cutting off those he doesn't like or want rather working with them, that was where the original point was from.

And it is not just a sour grapes from the left or corbyns fans in denial, I never had a liking for corbyn myself as I have said here many a time, he has upset groups across the broad spectrum of labour.
 
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The Future’s Blue! said:
I tell you what, Starmer must’ve really upset the left of the party, they’re almost demented.
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To be fair I have always been on the cusp of being fully demented, at least though I am honest in my reasons for it. I am an avowed Socialist who understands the rationale behind my beliefs. My ideals come from the belief in equality of opportunity and I despise inequality in all its forms, from access to Healthcare to provision of Welfare, from racial inequality to gender inequality. It is a simple belief that all humans are created equal and as such should be treated equally. I do not see Starmer as a person who echoes my beliefs and if that makes me demented, demented I shall be.
 
The problem is, people with real principles don't get elected.

First, we have a crooked election system. All that matters is to win the votes of the largest minority. You do your research and work out what you have to say to achieve that. You don't set out to offend anyone who might vote against you, and you ignore the ones who will (probably) vote for you anyway.

Starmer knows what seats he has to win. And they include a fair few where catering to knuckle-dragging racists will do you no harm. It's a cold calculation, and the logic is if you win you can do some good stuff. If you lose you are powerless. He knows that most people who hate the Tories will vote for him whatever he says.

The underlying problem is the outdated and corrupt FPTP voting system. If you had PR, politicians could stand on the policies they believe in. Voters could vote for what they want, instead of voting against what they hate most. This is why neither big party wants PR.
 
BrianW said:
The problem is, people with real principles don't get elected.

First, we have a crooked election system. All that matters is to win the votes of the largest minority. You do your research and work out what you have to say to achieve that. You don't set out to offend anyone who might vote against you, and you ignore the ones who will (probably) vote for you anyway.

Starmer knows what seats he has to win. And they include a fair few where catering to knuckle-dragging racists will do you no harm. It's a cold calculation, and the logic is if you win you can do some good stuff. If you lose you are powerless. He knows that most people who hate the Tories will vote for him whatever he says.

The underlying problem is the outdated and corrupt FPTP voting system. If you had PR, politicians could stand on the policies they believe in. Voters could vote for what they want, instead of voting against what they hate most. This is why neither big party wants PR.
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You forgot the influence of political donor's and of course the media.

We do have a system where increasingly I believe people vote for least worst option.
 
Rascal said:
To be fair I have always been on the cusp of being fully demented, at least though I am honest in my reasons for it. I am an avowed Socialist who understands the rationale behind my beliefs. My ideals come from the belief in equality of opportunity and I despise inequality in all its forms, from access to Healthcare to provision of Welfare, from racial inequality to gender inequality. It is a simple belief that all humans are created equal and as such should be treated equally. I do not see Starmer as a person who echoes my beliefs and if that makes me demented, demented I shall be.
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Who is closer to your beliefs, Kier Starmer's Labour, or Rishi Sunak/Boris Jonhson's Conservatives?
 
NPBlue said:
I like Starmer, but I think he's missing the point for many people and he's trying to appeal to a failed cause that Johnson promoted during the last election that promised brexit as a positve and received huge support at the time.

Those arguments are increasingly being recognised as a load of bollocks by the electorate, and it's a shame Starmer can't see it and carries on with his 'make brexit work', nonsense, but if you want to vote tory, go ahead and do it.
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It would be very foolish to equate people unhappy with Brexit for people wanting to reverse it.
 
The Future’s Blue! said:
By another left-wing shill via a left-wing media organisation. Such factions within Labour, like the Tory factions, they should separate and go their own ways.
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Were the left wing not the original faction of labour essentially the name the labour party is a left wing idea, maybe people like starmer should have joined the lib dems from the start.

Always seems laughable people call the left and socialism not what the labour movement is about, that is exactly what it is.
 
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