Keir Starmer

BobKowalski said:
I imagine ‘Starmer is being mean to Corbyn‘ will play pretty well, but more as a sideshow. Meanwhile, Sunak will have the ghost of Truss and Johnson haunting him. People who became PM and in the case of Johnson, Sunak supported until he knifed him. Bit like Starmer is doing with Corbyn.

Politics is a rough old business. Perhaps Corbyn should be the bigger man and bow out gracefully for the good of the country and to rid us of the Tories. You think he will, or will it be all about him and how badly he has been treated? And if he does, how different in character is he to Johnson who makes everything about him and how badly he is being treated?
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Was thinking nothing of the sort. But having read that I'm not sure what I'm thinking but it's definitely not what you're thinking. The kind of analysis you'd get from a hack immersed in the Westminster bubble.
 
BlueHammer85 said:
Starmer has and is doing everything to mop up the Tory voters , once in power he’ll shift centre left. Fine by me. Tories have to be beaten and he is the man to do it
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What makes you think he'll change position once in power? To date we have seen he is prepared to assume any position to get power and I think it's more likely he'll continue in that vain to keep it. Logical, but that suggests he's more likely to pander to the Murdoch press and corporate interests once in power than suddenly shift 'centre left' - which now appears to be where Cameron and Osbourne were as 'one nation conservatives'.
 
Postman Pep said:
Was thinking nothing of the sort. But having read that I'm not sure what I'm thinking but it's definitely not what you're thinking. The kind of analysis you'd get from a hack immersed in the Westminster bubble.
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Is that a compliment? I don’t think it’s a compliment, but should I take it as a compliment? It’s not like I get many. Ah, fuck it, I’ll take it :)
 
BobKowalski said:
I imagine ‘Starmer is being mean to Corbyn‘ will play pretty well, but more as a sideshow. Meanwhile, Sunak will have the ghost of Truss and Johnson haunting him. People who became PM and in the case of Johnson, Sunak supported until he knifed him. Bit like Starmer is doing with Corbyn.

Politics is a rough old business. Perhaps Corbyn should be the bigger man and bow out gracefully for the good of the country and to rid us of the Tories. You think he will, or will it be all about him and how badly he has been treated? And if he does, how different in character is he to Johnson who makes everything about him and how badly he is being treated?
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Do you think that's likely - For all his admirable qualities, Corbyn has a lot of similarity with Johnson and both are narcissists, who get very prickly when challenged.

He'd probably have imploded a lot sooner without the much more pragmatic John McDonnell by his side.
 
Rascal said:
I wish I had the desire and inclination to answer your superb post. I do not though. I am drained mate, my passion for the Labour party is no more.

I just want Starmer out. Then start again or if need be start a new party of the left for the left. A Socialist party not full of liberal lefties droning on about capitalism being a good thing.
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Whats your opinion of our local girl Angela Raynor?
I like her but i fear with her at the helm a certain section of society would never vote for a ‘gobby northern woman’.

The trouble is, only a conservative labour mp leader is getting in.

We’re doomed
 
BlueHammer85 said:
Starmer has and is doing everything to mop up the Tory voters , once in power he’ll shift centre left. Fine by me. Tories have to be beaten and he is the man to do it
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Much as I hope that is true, the real problem he'll have is that it will take many years.
First he has to stop the shifting to the right encouraged by the last 13 years of Conservative government.
Then he has to decide where to start to move towards the left.
It's likely to cost a huge amount, and in not very long there's another election for him to be attacked, and with a hostile media waiting to wade in.

Unfortunately, the correction leftwards is difficult to make happen in the timeframe available. The lurch to the right will be difficult/damaging to them/expensive to fix by a lurch to the left, and so it'll take longer slower steps to achieve. Now if the 20-40 year old bracket are significantly left-leaning, there's a good chance of winning the next election even in face of the costs for doing so.
Get voted out in 2029/30, and it'll all have been a waste.
 
Bluesince1979 said:
Whats your opinion of our local girl Angela Raynor?
I like her but i fear with her at the helm a certain section of society would never vote for a ‘gobby northern woman’.

The trouble is, only a conservative labour mp leader is getting in.

We’re doomed
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I like Angela, he back story is compelling and she is more of the left than most in the Labour party. She is however shackled to Starmer and her fortunes rely on his to a degree. She could be a modern day Barbara Castle if she so desired and you can tell she worries the Tories with their flashing her fanny claims. Will she ever fulfil her promise, i am not so sure.
 
Postman Pep said:
In terms of choosing to fight this factional war and in Mandelson's words, 'seal the tomb on the left' it goes beyond Starmer. It's just that in many ways he was the perfect man for the job. Although he has a long career in public life he has only been an MP for 8 years and an easy sell as a 'unity' candidate. His earlier, less high profile, career goes some way to explaining his 'top down' managerial style. This is worth a watch if you've an hour spare.



Interesting segment on his Brexit machinations within it.

I suppose the only way to truly gauge that will be election time but they are where they are in the polls because of the Tory implosion and nothing else. Nobody appears to be paying much attention to what Labour are all about which is understandable to a degree given the anger at the Tories but they are also getting a free pass from the media ... case in point today. No mention of EHRC or AS in the justification yet no pushback. Obviously the reason it's missing is it wouldn't withstand a legal challenge because it's built on sand .... just like their poll lead.





Again examplified just today with the Tory crackdown announcements. Just like on 'stop the boats' Labour aren't attacking them on their callousness but on their efficiency. Starmer made a similar moral panic laden pitch just last week but nobody was listening apparently.
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That was probably one of the most fascinating hours I’ve spent watching that. Really insightful, intelligent dialogue. Enjoyed it. Thanks for sharing.

Will the real Keir Starmer please stand up
 
BobKowalski said:
I’m not entirely convinced that a political party with a circa 20% polling lead is ‘dammed whatever they do.’

Maybe it’s just me…
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I was referring to the Corbyn situation. I do like the arrogance though, “we’ll do what we want…we’ll do what we want…we’re twenty points ahead ….we’ll do what we want”
 
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