Laurence Fox launches political party

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

I am absolute fine with safe spaces for whoever requires them, they are not compulsory and what happens within them should be confidential. If you want your own exclusive safe space I will totally respect that too. Because as much as you hark on about this being about race and it being divisive I will argue it is not, its necessary because people like yourself, Fox and his assortment of cranks think they are divisive. If you are unable to find it within you to respect the needs of a disparate community then don't, carry on with the Fox agenda, because his agenda has nothing at all to do with the rights of the working class and everything to do with division of the working class under false pretence. There are a myriad of reasons why certain groups would need a safe space in which to discuss and debate issues and be empathetic with each other. These reasons could be anything from sickle cell anaemia groups , to the Freemasons, from Male only clubs, to disabled only swimming pool times. To put everything under the broad brush stroke of "exclusion" is ridiculous and divisive in itself, because what you risk is far worse than what you are complaining about. Making everything open and inclusive to everyone totally defeats the object of the safe space in the first place and that risks further alienation, disrespect and misunderstanding of some very important issues that may affect some people but not others.

Can see where you're coming from, but do you not see any potential issues or dangers, where an institution or company only allows it or favours it only for 'select' groups?

You only need to look at what happened at Evergreen State College in US back in 2017 and their backing of 'forced' segregation (or however you want to dress it up). There they introduced non-white dorms and common rooms, and reversed their traditional 'day of absence' so that white students weren't to be on campus for the day (and non-white students were patrolling the campus with baseball bats to enforce it). 3 years on the college still hasn't recovered, with en-rollment down 30%+ and still falling, causing faculty job losses and increased student fees etc.

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

That does kind of skip over several hundred years of European colonial history.

Perhaps we can replace a tranche of history with the statement “something bad happened but it’s important not to pick sides or dwell on it”.

equally true of picking a specific point in time to vilify a population and tarnish its descendants with the same brush to create a narrative that would be adjusted significantly if you included the equally, if not more important, history that happened prior to and alongside it, which has been a significant contributor to the problem and racism Fame Monster has now thankfully posted seems to be being recognised and will hopefully be addressed.

 

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

That does kind of skip over several hundred years of European colonial history.

Perhaps we can replace a tranche of history with the statement “something bad happened but it’s important not to pick sides or dwell on it”.

maybe a bit of balance might be the key.
how about looking at the history of slavery as a whole, including how the barbary pirates and their slave markets in N. Africa were feeding the Ottoman empire from the 16th century up until the 1830's

 

[BobKowalski]

I don't think she's against teachers teaching that white people had certain privileges in this country once upon a time that other races did not enjoy (if that's relevant to the subject) but I think she's right to point out that the idea is extremely contested today, and teachers should not be reporting it as fact. Especially to working class white boys who are the opposite of privileged in comparison to other races at an academic level.

Just a few highlights of the most unaware post in a long, long time...

 

[BobKowalski]

equally true of picking a specific point in time to vilify a population and tarnish its descendants with the same brush to create a narrative that would be adjusted significantly if you included the equally, if not more important, history that happened prior to and alongside it, which has been a significant contributor to the problem and racism Fame Monster has now thankfully posted seems to be being recognised and will hopefully be addressed.

“We are unhappy about all these public monuments to slavery and the people who profited from it.”

“What! How dare you vilify white people!”

 

[PannickAtTheDisco]

“We are unhappy about all these public monuments to slavery and the people who profited from it.”

“What! How dare you vilify white people!”

as if it was about that, as the equalities minister has eloquently explained. Vandalism is vandalism nonetheless. I'm glad she is truly reflective and representative of a progressive position unlike the racist ideological bigotry that she rightly condemned and has no place on this forum, or in our society.

 

[denislawsbackheel]

The only thing with that way of thinking is:

Clement Atlee, overseer of the Welfare State, the NHS and reduction in rationing - public schoolboy

Margaret Thatcher, tyrant - working class daughter of a corner shop owner.

Thatcher was not working class.
Daddy owned two retail properties, a corner shop and a tobacconist.

 

[BobKowalski]

maybe a bit of balance might be the key.
how about looking at the history of slavery as a whole, including how the barbary pirates and their slave markets in N. Africa were feeding the Ottoman empire from the 16th century up until the 1830's

Nothing stopping you, knock yourself out, start a thread, start a Facebook group, whatever floats your boat.

This is, after all, a forum to facilitate discussion. So discuss.

 

[Ghandi's Flip Flops]

Nothing stopping you, knock yourself out, start a thread, start a Facebook group, whatever floats your boat.

This is, after all, a forum to facilitate discussion. So discuss.

As usual Bob, you totally miss the point.

why concentrate only on 'European colonial history' when slavery etc has been part of human history since biblical times. Or you okay with people cherry picking selective parts of history to demonize certain races or nations as it suits?

 

[BobKowalski]

As usual Bob, you totally miss the point.

why concentrate only on 'European colonial history' when slavery etc has been part of human history since biblical times. Or you okay with people cherry picking selective parts of history to demonize certain races or nations as it suits?

Why not? We are European. It forms part, indeed a substantial part of our nations history. We celebrate that history, we build monuments to the people who played a part in it, for good or bad, that legacy forms part of who we are today.

That people wish to censor and stifle debate over the more negative aspects of our history is not a huge surprise, however as history shows when a ruling political party wishes to censor and stifle that debate, it never ends well, their intentions are never good and should be resisted by everyone who values truth.