March for the Alternative-26th March

metalblue said:
law74 said:
Ever heard of the European Working Time directive?
Or the right to a private life?
Or a weekend?
Why should cheif executives in public limited companies (like G4S, capita etc etc) that Milk Snatcher sold off to her cronies, be given MILLIONS of pounds per year while the workers that earn their wage are stuck on the NMW and often in Fuel Poverty?
Why should bankers be given MILLIONS in BONUS payments on top of already VERY VERY Lucrative saleries?
There is an alternative to the widespread destruction of the fabric of this country and that is why I and many many others will be protesting.
Oh btw, I am posting this from home on a days leave, are you doing the same?

What did Thatcher have to do with either G4S or Capita? (G4S setup, albeit under a different guise, in the 1940's or so and Capita who's revenues, incidentially, grew by 2,400% under Labour)

It strikes me you just say shit without the slightest concept of what it is you are talking about

It was The Milk Snatcher that started the sell off of public services to companies like Group 4 Securities and Capita, thus inducing the milking off of money from the general public to the greed is God private sector, and less than the cost of living pay rises to the workers while the shareholders and cheif executives receive multi million pound (very often tax free) bonus payments.
Working man - woman receives £500 per annum pay rise = boost to the local economy and local business = money re=cycled through public and private sectors = more employment = less of a strain on the Welfare state.
Cheif Executive receives multi million pound bonus = money and taxation being evaded - avoided from the public purse and money being cheated from the local economy.
A bit of a simplistic view, but the first race has started.
 
law74 said:
metalblue said:
What did Thatcher have to do with either G4S or Capita? (G4S setup, albeit under a different guise, in the 1940's or so and Capita who's revenues, incidentially, grew by 2,400% under Labour)

It strikes me you just say shit without the slightest concept of what it is you are talking about

It was The Milk Snatcher that started the sell off of public services to companies like Group 4 Securities and Capita, thus inducing the milking off of money from the general public to the greed is God private sector, and less than the cost of living pay rises to the workers while the shareholders and cheif executives receive multi million pound (very often tax free) bonus payments.
Working man - woman receives £500 per annum pay rise = boost to the local economy and local business = money re=cycled through public and private sectors = more employment = less of a strain on the Welfare state.
Cheif Executive receives multi million pound bonus = money and taxation being evaded - avoided from the public purse and money being cheated from the local economy.
A bit of a simplistic view, but the first race has started.


I have a lot of sympathy with your view, but the comments on Capita are wide of the mark.

I think youi'll find that Capita and the last Labour goivernment were... "really good mates"... and it was Labour that accelerated the move of privatisation in local governemnt and NHS by giving out contracts to Capita.

You need only look at the composition of local authorities in the North West to realise that Labour administrations are just as likely to be employing Capita...
 
BimboBob said:
And under Labour you complained and marched as well did you?


Funny that...i never remember seeing riots and marches when they were in power and yet they let the bankers do what they want and gave out contracts left right and centre.

What a lovely country we live in when people can hid under a bush for 10 years before leaping into action.

What would we do without you i wonder.

Absolutely spot on.

That Law fella is everything wrong with this country I am afraid. He also has no idea when the use of capitalisation is needed.

He basically watched "Dispatches" last night.

-- Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:11 pm --

metalblue said:
law74 said:
Ever heard of the European Working Time directive?
Or the right to a private life?
Or a weekend?
Why should cheif executives in public limited companies (like G4S, capita etc etc) that Milk Snatcher sold off to her cronies, be given MILLIONS of pounds per year while the workers that earn their wage are stuck on the NMW and often in Fuel Poverty?
Why should bankers be given MILLIONS in BONUS payments on top of already VERY VERY Lucrative saleries?
There is an alternative to the widespread destruction of the fabric of this country and that is why I and many many others will be protesting.
Oh btw, I am posting this from home on a days leave, are you doing the same?

What did Thatcher have to do with either G4S or Capita? (G4S setup, albeit under a different guise, in the 1940's or so and Capita who's revenues, incidentially, grew by 2,400% under Labour)

It strikes me you just say shit without the slightest concept of what it is you are talking about

Bingo.<br /><br />-- Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:15 pm --<br /><br />
law74 said:
A bit of a simplistic view, but the first race has started.

Atleast you know you[r arguments] are simplistic.

I am surprised you can type you must be hitting the keys so hard everytime you have to think of a name for Maggie.

But you don't really know what you are talking about.

This is probably due to a very limited education which progressed to poor job and a feeling of general inadequacy. Did you fail you 11+? Is that what all this stems from?
 
It was The Milk Snatcher that started the sell off of public services to companies like Group 4 Securities and Capita, thus inducing the milking off of money from the general public to the greed is God private sector, and less than the cost of living pay rises to the workers while the shareholders and cheif executives receive multi million pound (very often tax free) bonus payments.
Working man - woman receives £500 per annum pay rise = boost to the local economy and local business = money re=cycled through public and private sectors = more employment = less of a strain on the Welfare state.
Cheif Executive receives multi million pound bonus = money and taxation being evaded - avoided from the public purse and money being cheated from the local economy.
A bit of a simplistic view, but the first race has started.[/quote]


I used to have the free milk when I was a lad, dare say when it was first introduced it was needed, but by the time it was "snatched " away, I dont think there was any need to give the children of our society any more free milk that could , and was, just as easily given to children at breakfast at home.
also the one thing that put me off lefties was the use of this "milk snatcher" bollox. at the time of this happening I knew quite a few lefties and this phrase just about summed them up, empty heads the lot of them, living in the past. I thought then and still believe now that anyone who does a proper days work and votes labour is nothing more than a fool.
the labour slogan then should have been and still should be now ."let us spend your money, we know better how to spend it than you do"
 
SWP's back said:
Absolutely spot on.

That Law fella is everything wrong with this country I am afraid. He also has no idea when the use of capitalisation is needed.

He basically watched "Dispatches" last night.

-- Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:11 pm --

metalblue said:
What did Thatcher have to do with either G4S or Capita? (G4S setup, albeit under a different guise, in the 1940's or so and Capita who's revenues, incidentially, grew by 2,400% under Labour)

It strikes me you just say shit without the slightest concept of what it is you are talking about

Bingo.

-- Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:15 pm --

law74 said:
A bit of a simplistic view, but the first race has started.

Atleast you know you[r arguments] are simplistic.

I am surprised you can type you must be hitting the keys so hard everytime you have to think of a name for Maggie.

But you don't really know what you are talking about.

This is probably due to a very limited education which progressed to poor job and a feeling of general inadequacy. Did you fail you 11+? Is that what all this stems from?

I have to apologise to the Lib Dems and their new friends in the tory party as it seems that I am not able to speak to them, (despite the fact that I have been Granmmar school educated, offered The Quenns Commission and Served the Colours for 19+ years), BB" and the like, If i wish to fight for the better life of ALL in our kingdom, I will, If i wish to fight against the Greed is god in our community, I will, if you object to that, feel free, but I have my beliefs, I have fought and risked my life to defend my way of life for OUR country, and I will continue to fight for what I believe is right.
Smash the tories.
 
Law74 - fair do's for serving our country and much Kudos to you for that.

But I reserve the right to disagree thoroughly with your politics.
 
Smash the tories. Just about sums up your real motives. Would you have protested if it was labour making these cuts. No. Maybe you should take a trip from your utopia in Northern Ireland and visit some of the shithole ghettos that have sprung up aroung mainland uk during the previous goverments term. I hope a Japanese style tsumani travels down the Thames along the embankment and sweeps the hordes of Socialist workers loving arseholes away.
 
People, like law74, trying to use political power to help the labour movement validate industrialists using political power to help corporations. The principle is the same. To use the government at the expense of others. Whatever it is that you say to differentiate yourselves it is just arbitrary. It's hypocritical and just fosters a society that is continually at war with itself.

The proper and most effective position for those who detest the corporate-government back-scratching that goes on is one that proposes a separation of Economy and State.
 
ElanJo said:
The proper and most effective position for those who detest the corporate-government back-scratching that goes on is one that proposes a separation of Economy and State.

The Milton Friedman way of thinking is a tad idealistic imo and if it were to happen, it would be a very unpredictable, unstable world. I do, however, think it's important that there is as little interference as possible by the state, but at times it is necessary.

From a legal perspective, we are a long way off getting there. Lawyers and lawmakers would have to have a degree and more in economics to be able to rule on some of the intricacies. I don't think it will ever happen.
 
law74 said:
DeanC said:
What is the alternative?

As you seem unable to research the link already posted
<a class="postlink" href="http://falseeconomy.org.uk/cure/whats-the-best-way-to-reduce-the-deficit" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;">http://falseeconomy.org.uk/cure/whats-t ... he-deficit</a>

Or if you care to read
"What’s the best way to reduce the deficit?
The first thing we have to do here is junk the idea that the national economy is like a household's.

Every time a politician says we have to do with the nation's finances what a prudent householder would do with a credit card bill, you can stop listening. It's nonsense.

There are many reasons for this, but here are two important ones.

The first reason why the chancellor is not like you or me with a big credit card bill
A householder can take decisions about how much to spend, how much debt to take on and how fast to pay it back without it having any effect on their wages.

But this is simply not true for a nation. If a country spends less, then it also has an effect on its tax income. This can even cancel out the cut.

If a householder cuts down on their supermarket bills, they do not have to care about what happens to the supermarket.

But if a country decides to economise by cancelling building of new schools and hospitals, they don't simply get a straightforward saving. There are knock-on effects that can be more damaging than the benefits of the cut to the public finances.

Let's investigate why. A cut in orders means that the construction companies will make less profit and pay less corporation tax. They will buy fewer bricks. They and the brick factory will cut their staff.

In turn these newly unemployed will pay less income tax as they become unemployed. They will also spend less in supermarkets, thus hitting their profits and ability to pay tax. Other tax payers will face a bill for their unemployment benefits.

A householder does not have to worry about what their spending decisions mean for other people or the wider economy. For a nation it's the most important consideration.

The second reason why the chancellor is not like you or me with a big credit card bill
When politicians talk about their ideal householder they assume that he (and we suspect they imagine a he) has a full-time job – and can't work harder to pay off their credit card debts.

This is not the same as the UK. We are not working full-time. We have high unemployment and high levels of people with part-time jobs who want to work full-time. If we have policies that get people back to work, and doing good, economically productive jobs, then the deficit falls because the costs of unemployment go down, and the income from tax goes up – even without changing a single tax rate.

The proper way of looking at the deficit
So if a credit card bill is not the right way to think about the deficit, what is?

The best way is to think it consists of two parts.

The biggest slice of the deficit is caused by the recession. The unemployed are not working and paying tax. Companies are not making profits and paying tax. Factories are not using all their machinery efficiently. Ending the recession means using these spare resources. That increases the tax take and reduces benefit spending, bringing down the deficit.
But there is a second part of the deficit. The crash was caused when a finance bubble turned out to be an illusion. We thought it was real prosperity, but it was a mirage. This means that even when we get the economy working again, it won't be as productive as we once thought it to be.
This second part of the deficit is much smaller than the first, but it will hang around even when we get proper growth and the economy working efficiently again. This is why it is called the structural deficit. Dealing with this part does require difficult decisions that involve tax and spending. But no-one can know what the size of this structural deficit will be until we have got the economy working properly again.

The priority therefore must be to get the economy growing and the unemployed back to work so we can fill the bigger part of the deficit caused by the recession. This is called a cyclical deficit precisely because it will disappear when the economy is back on track.

The danger of cutting spending or raising taxes like VAT now is that they will reduce growth. At worst we might even be driven back into recession again – the double-dip. What is certain is that the cuts will reduce economic growth. The government is fond of scaring us with numbers. Here's our own scary number. The spending review will depress growth in the UK economy by £60 billion, according to official figures. That's £1,000 for everyone in the UK.

So the best way to cut the deficit is to encourage growth. That's not always easy for governments to do, but consider the environmental challenge. To make the transition to a low-carbon economy we need to stimulate a huge investment programme in new forms of energy and energy efficiency at work and home. That's a good thing to do in its own right, but will also create jobs, help companies and cut the deficit."

sadly I will be unable to afford to travel over to London for the rally, but I fully expect it to be one of if not THE biggest rally ever seen in London, and when NICICTU or NIPSA organinse one in Northern Ireland, they can be sure of my continued support, in the meanitime I will continue to lobby localy elected representatives and highlight the scandal that is the tax theives like boots, topshop, BHS, vodaphone etc etc.

The problem is, in getting everyone back into work (when have we ever had full employment other than immediately after WW2?) is there is only so many things workers can do / produce.
How many more cars can we build, how many more city centre apartments can be built, how many more schools or hotels can we build......... only so many. We can keep on building more supermarkets but there are still only the same number of people available to shop there so the market is being spread out = eventually the supermarkets realise they are not making enough so shut one or two down.... (there are 5 Tesco Extra's in the city centre, all within 5 -8 mins walk of the big one on Market Street, nearly the same number of Sainsbury's and a couple of Co-op's too.)

Oh, and for those demonstrating against an unelected government, was Gordon Brown elected?
 

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