Media Thread - 2021/22

[Mr Fraser]

And they want you to pay to read that crap.

Do they not know glazers made some of their money from USA oil (I suppose that's nice oil), have a ongoing strategic partnership with saudi telecoms, and dippers have long term sponsorship with a financial institution who laundered money for terrorists? They must ignore facts when reaching their conclusions

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

They have only finished as the top 2 twice in history

City and Liverpool have finished 1st and 2nd far more times than that.

 

[mad4city]

City and Liverpool have finished 1st and 2nd far more times than that.

It would appear that both Liverpool and Unhave finished second to City more times than they have to each other.

 

[GOULDYBOBS]

It would appear that both Liverpool and Unhave finished second to City more times than they have to each other.

Awkwaaard

 

[Chris in London]

That’s bollocks

Fixed

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Fixed

I'm obliged.

 

[Chris in London]

I'm obliged.

Remember, less is more.

 

[LongsightM13]

It would appear that both Liverpool and Unhave finished second to City more times than they have to each other.

In the last decade

 

[gordondaviesmoustache]

Remember, less is more.

I have x

 

[Chris in London]

In Manchester in the 60s and 70s United v Liverpool was just another game. My Red pals certainly regarded City as the biggest game. In fact there was mutual dislike from Reds and Blues alike for LFC. It was Ferguson who ramped it up as a rivalry and it has certainly become a huge global match in the PL era (as some have said it's the Dublin derby).
I think the fact that Ferguson is not Mancunian and has never really understood the city (look at his overeaction to the Tevez poster) was another factor. If City are not their biggest rivals why do United fans spend 90 minutes of every match singing songs about us and rarely mention Liverpool. Perhaps it's different in Dublin and Bangkok.

City didn't play United much (if at all) in Ferguson's first 2-3 years at the club, because we were in the 2nd division. The first (or at least the first meaningful) derby under Ferguson's reign was the 5-1, a game he described in his autobiography as the most embarrassing & humiliating defeat of his career. (I think there was a worse one towards its end.) When they beat us 5-0 a few years later he sympathised with Brian Horton, noting - from personal experience - that he would be goaded for months. He recalled barely being able to fill up with petrol without some blue shouting 'hey Fergie, what's the time? Five past you lot.'

He did not take that humiliation lying down. First, in the 90s/00s when they used to beat City, which was frequently, he used to trot out the line that it was basically three points, it wouldn't define their season (like in those days a derby win defined ours), they had bigger fish to fry.

And he added that United's real derby was with Liverpool. Again, in his 'everything I say is for a reason' way, he had stated at an early stage of his tenure at the swamp that he wanted to knock them off their fucking perch, which he did. In spades. But like you say, before the 90s really Liverpool v United was just another match. Sure, scousers v mancs was a big thing, but that was just as true of us v dippers (when in the top division) or everton as it was rags v Everton.

That 5-1 defeat had a lot to answer for, over the years, or to put the same point slightly differently, it explains a lot once you understand the psychology and the personal history of a bully. It wasn't enough for them to give us a pasting, it wasn't enough to humiliate us the way he had been humiliated. His revenge was to marginalise us. That fucking banner didn't go up by accident.

This is not to say the Liverpool v United 'rivalry' has largely wholly manufactured by Ferguson or even by Sky, who have been perfectly happy to adopt Ferguson's narrative because it suits their purposes to have millions of plastics across Ireland, Scandinavia and the far east to be invested in a game that is, today, 3rd v 6th (which is not only what the table says, when you look at how Liverpool were against us and Chelsea, is about right in terms of quality, too. Maybe you'd have the rags in 7th or 8th given who they've played so far.) This was, and always has been, a big game, and for all that Sky blow smoke up this game's arse, the vitriol that will be on display is genuine.

But, as you say, there is a reason why your average match-going rag sings silly songs about us and not about them. There was a time under Keegan 20 years ago when our major rivals for the league were Wolves. We still sang songs about David Beckham. Singing their nursery rhymes is the way they keep themselves relevant, even though in reality they no longer are.