Middle East Conflict

[bluethrunthru]

Just following Braverman's instructions.

Its what you get when you have a fucked up Home Sec and a dumb Police Force who don't know the law or are acting on instructions handed down from those who confuse law withe their opinion. I mean I have coconut - if I were Home Sec would it be proportionate for me to suggest Police arrest all purveyors of Bounty bars?

 

[west didsblue]

History through a colonial settler mindset ...... pretty desperate stuff when you are ignoring the reality playing out live on the telly.

Nope.
History based on facts.
And who says I’m ignoring reality. You’re the one diverting the thread to try and delegitimise Israel as a whole rather than focusing on the current situation. Anyway I’ll leave you to your revisionist bollocks.

 

[Ducado]

The Toris are trying to inflame tensions as part of their culture war, they more or less know they are doomed, but there’s a few votes in getting the elderly and the knuckle dragging mob riled up

Can they sink any lower? Unfortunately they can and will as homeless people are about to find out

 

[blueinsa]

History through a colonial settler mindset ...... pretty desperate stuff when you are ignoring the reality playing out live on the telly.

It’s just fact.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

EDF boasting tonight they have cut Gaza in 2 - east to west - whilst still telling those in the north to head south? Imagine how proud a 21st century army must feel splitting in two opposition that is a fraction of their number with few modern weapons.

Urban warfare stage will be next

That’s part of the job they’ve been told by their Government to do and they’ve done it. They do seem to have a lot of PR people though.

 

[Ducado]

History through a colonial settler mindset ...... pretty desperate stuff when you are ignoring the reality playing out live on the telly.

It doesn’t really matter, we need to concentrate on the present day and the future, what’s done is done, huge parts of Turkey were Greek until after WW1 and parts of Greece were Turkish, they exchanged populations but it wasn’t nice and Greeks suffered disproportionately

The Palestinians need a state in the West Bank and Gaza the whole of the West Bank, there will have to be some compromise on East Jerusalem by both sides

 

[Ducado]

That’s part of the job they’ve been told by their Government to do and they’ve done it. They do seem to have a lot of PR people though.

They need sacking their PR is terrible always has been it comes across as callous

 

[Postman Pep]

Nope.
History based on facts.
And who says I’m ignoring reality. You’re the one diverting the thread to try and delegitimise Israel as a whole rather than focusing on the current situation. Anyway I’ll leave you to your revisionist bollocks.

Again facts on the ground. Who is being 'delegitimised' here?. Revisionist bollocks indeed.

 

[west didsblue]

It doesn’t really matter, we need to concentrate on the present day and the future, what’s done is done, huge parts of Turkey were Greek until after WW1 and parts of Greece were Turkish, they exchanged populations but it wasn’t nice and Greeks suffered disproportionately

The Palestinians need a state in the West Bank and Gaza the whole of the West Bank, there will have to be some compromise on East Jerusalem by both sides

Exactly.

 

[robbieh]

Another Israeli argument is that Palestine never existed. In as much as the Ottomans and then the British ran the place maybe technically it is correct. However there have been people living there for s millennium and they call themselves Palestinian. That's all that matters.

 

[Tim of the Oak]

They need sacking their PR is terrible always has been it comes across as callous

It’s callous but it has helped to get the US and and U.K. Governments and oppositions to be their advocates. As somebody who has run a big communications team in the past, advocacy is a big PR achievement.

 

[Vic]

Usual bollocks.
British land in 1946. Ottoman land pre-1916.
1947 was a plan rejected by all Arab countries.
1949-1967 green bits were Egyptian and Jordanian land.
Present is the only time Palestine had their own land.
It would be good if the Palestinians ended up with something like the 1949-67 map but that depends on Israel getting rid of Netanyahu and Hamas being fucked off by the Gazans.

It was never British land.

Essentially, the inhabitants of Palestine lived under an empire for centuries, then they helped defeat that empire, and rather than they be given the chance to have "their own land", it was given to a foreign power (the one they'd helped) to administer and allow lots of other foreigners to colonise and get "Palestinian citizenship". Remarkably the Mandate said Jews could acquire citizenship but was silent about whether the existing inhabitants were citizens - remedied in 1925 by granting citizenship to Turkish (i.e. Ottoman) nationals who were "habitually residents" of the territory.

 

[Vic]

Nope.
History based on facts.
And who says I’m ignoring reality. You’re the one diverting the thread to try and delegitimise Israel as a whole rather than focusing on the current situation. Anyway I’ll leave you to your revisionist bollocks.

That's the trouble isn't it? Facts on the ground rather than legal and moral justification.

 

[Postman Pep]

It’s just fact.

Course it is. But it is still a fact stripped of historical context and presented in isolation ..... bit like you chucking in the plight of 'white farmers' at the mere mention of Mandela. Like I say the colonial mindset.

 

[west didsblue]

Another Israeli argument is that Palestine never existed. In as much as the Ottomans and then the British ran the place maybe technically it is correct. However there have been people living there for s millennium and they call themselves Palestinian. That's all that matters.

The Jews that lived there were the ones that called themselves Palestinians before 1948. The Jerusalem Post was the Palestine Post. They even set up the Palestine FA which was the precursor to the Israel FA. The Arab Palestinians saw themselves as Arabs living in Palestine as there was no such thing as a Palestinian nation until the PLO effectively created one in 1964 after responding to nationalist sentiment due to the local Arabs understandably not wanting to be ruled by outsiders any more. That doesn’t delegitimise their desire for self determination following centuries of Crusader, Mamluk, Ottoman, British, Egyptian, Jordanian and Israeli rule to name but a few.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

The average Palestinians life is way shitter than the average Israelis by every measure. Most of this is the result of their leadership, which has consistently rejected peaceful co-existence for war and conflict.

Fixed that somewhat ridiculous statement.

It's always the fault of the Jews with people like you isn't it?

 

[blueinsa]

Course it is. But it is still a fact stripped of historical context and presented in isolation ..... bit like you chucking in the plight of 'white farmers' at the mere mention of Mandela. Like I say the colonial mindset.

I popped it in there to see yours and others outrage at the genocide of white farmers in South Africa.

Oh wait……let me guess? You’re not arsed eh, they probably asked for it yes?

Fucking pesky colonialists, bit like the Jews in Israel.

 

[robbieh]

The Jews that lived there were the ones that called themselves Palestinians before 1948. The Jerusalem Post was the Palestine Post. They even set up the Palestine FA which was the precursor to the Israel FA. The Arab Palestinians saw themselves as Arabs living in Palestine as there was no such thing as a Palestinian nation until the PLO effectively created one in 1964 after responding to nationalist sentiment due to the local Arabs understandably not wanting to be ruled by outsiders any more. That doesn’t delegitimise their desire for self determination following centuries of Crusader, Mamluk, Ottoman, British, Egyptian, Jordanian and Israeli rule to name but a few.

Interesting post.
While the Jews may have called themselves Palestinians, at the time of the Balfour declaration, even though there'd been plenty of Jewish migration since the late 19th C, they still constituted only 10 percent of the population.

 

[robbieh]

Maybe I don't bother answering loaded questions but if you insist, Israel are taking military action against Islamist terrorists who shelter behind innocent civilians that they've themselves terrorised instead of protecting and are happy to encourage, and glorify in, their slaughter. They shelter in schools and hospitals, as well as the tunnels which have cost over $1bn to build. That's money that could have been used to better the lives of the people they're supposed to be governing.

The biggest favour Israel can do for the ordinary Gaza people is to wipe Hamas out. Every single, last one of them. I'm no fan of Netanyahu but he's got this one absolutely right.

Not once have you condemned the brutal October 7th attacks.
Not once have you called for the release of the hostages.
It's all one way with you.
Fuck off you terrorist supporting animal.

Netanyahu has not got it right and neither have you.

 

[robbieh]

I popped it in there to see yours and others outrage at the genocide of white farmers in South Africa.

Oh wait……let me guess? You’re not arsed eh, they probably asked for it yes?

Fucking pesky colonialists, bit like the Jews in Israel.

In the sense that the colonials treated the indigenous population badly yes.