PL charge City for alleged breaches of financial rules

[Norbiton]

City reported additional costs of £89 million to uefa under their “reporting perimeter”. This perimeter includes any entity that generates income. So Tebas theory that we dump cost to companies mansour owns is bullshit. City must comply.

The £89 million covers costs both from inside the cfg and outside entities.

Probably some accounting tactic. No doubt masters will be along soon to investigate.

anyway, that probably don’t give much meat on the bones. Need the accounting nerds to explain the nuts and bolts.

Cunningly concealed by reporting it to UEFA. There’s no end to our devious ways.

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

This post appears to me to be worthy of more discussion than all these TH posts. Can anyone offer some expert opinion on what this means because I’m not capable?

I've posted an example I know of...

 

[Centurions]

I think anybody else would be banned or warned for consistent wumming no?

No pile on here and I appreciate he posts in good faith, but always in riddles and Friday was a joke, he pulled the pin out and threw the grenade as far as possible, to then come back hours later with an explanation.

There is an element of attention seeking to it otherwise he'd just spit it out. I actually enjoy it around transfers, I think with this though we are all worked up and want to know any crumb of info, not being pissed about

Well, you're still here aren't you? So, probably not.

 

[blueparrot]

I think anybody else would be banned or warned for consistent wumming no?

No pile on here and I appreciate he posts in good faith, but always in riddles and Friday was a joke, he pulled the pin out and threw the grenade as far as possible, to then come back hours later with an explanation.

There is an element of attention seeking to it otherwise he'd just spit it out. I actually enjoy it around transfers, I think with this though we are all worked up and want to know any crumb of info, not being pissed about

I’ve learnt many years ago not to get too worked up about things I can’t control, especially football things. Try it.

 

[pudge]

Is it understandable people got a little giddy over the video? Of course

I think if @tolmie's hairdoo could go back and just post what he'd heard regarding agents first and not the video, he would.

It's a very senstive topic for everyone, no matter how confident you are in the club, we all just want something definitve one way or the other. Similar to when you're unwell but sure there's nothing sinister wrong with you and the doctor finally diagnosis you with something but having a name put on it just eases everything.

We all know the cryptic clues, videos etc are part and parcel of the transfer forum and anyone getting their knickers in a twist over there about it can get in the bin. With this I do understand the frustration though, it's not exactly a light hearted issue but it's not the end of the world; both the decision and the recent misinterpretation.

 

[burning blue soul]

My personal opinion is that Tolmie doesn't currently have any real knowledge of the inside workings of City at all, and he drops hints for apparently no reason other than he likes winding people up. I think that he moved to X because he thought it would get him more attention than he was getting here, and he moved back here because the people on X were far far quicker to catch on to him than he expected.

To be clear, that's purely my opinion of his footballing knowledge. It is pretty much undeniable that he is a very decent person in real life and has dedicated a huge amount of his life to helping children from challenging circumstances - if I was not in exactly the same boat, having worked with young people for my entire adult life, I probably wouldn't bother calling him out whatsoever.

But some people will say he's just doing it for fun and isn't claiming to be a real source of knowledge, and some people will say he does it out of the goodness of his heart and it's not his fault that he's usually incorrect. By definition, that means defences are split.

You ever read something in the news that doesn't happen? I have. Multiple times. Every fucking day!
Peeps should climb down off his back. The whole media industry is 95% speculation and bullshit.
The blame lies with the ones that believe the hype. They should know better.

 

[dickie davies]

The outcome will get announced when it gets announced, and we'll all know about it then.

In the meantime people taking anything Tolm says as gospel, and people criticising him for playing up to the weak-minded need to give their heads a wobble. What happened to our supposed sense of humour, and ability to laugh at ourselves?

Come on PB
The amount of shit all of us have had to put up with since the first UEFA charges, never mind the PL 115/130 means we're very very tired of the mud slinging and are desperate for a positive conclusion
And then our supposed ITK serious journalist posts a happy video pointing to an imminent announcement of the clearance of the charges, which is then said to be "just for bantz" is properly wumming

 

[burning blue soul]

The outcome will get announced when it gets announced, and we'll all know about it then.

In the meantime people taking anything Tolm says as gospel, and people criticising him for playing up to the weak-minded need to give their heads a wobble. What happened to our supposed sense of humour, and ability to laugh at ourselves?

To be fair to ourselves, it has been a battle to keep the happy-go-lucky attitudes these last 5 years. We are more happy-go-fuck yourselves after the ptsd of media pile-ons and legal shenanigans.
Any fan base would feel the same.
When a guy who spat at a child takes the moral high ground, I would actually go so far as to say we are holding up pretty damn well, all things considered.

 

[Scaring Europe to Death]

Not necessarily agreeing or disagreeing with the fallout from Tolmie's video, but there's a general misconception that everyone reads the Bluemoon threads chronologically and can simply ignore what they don't like

On Friday Morning it was obvious from the most recent of the additional 20 pages that something had happened and judging from the number of "great news" comments it was hardly the crime of the century to presume that it was a positive development.

I then had to trawl backwards to eventually discover a cryptic music video

I sometimes wonder why Tolmie's posts are elevated to such a level that the content doesn't merit (perhaps he's perceived as the perfect antidote for Magic Hat's nonsense?)

However, on this occasion I definitely wasn't misled.
It was just ten minutes of genuine curiosity that I'll never get back.

 

[halfcenturyup]

City reported additional costs of £89 million to uefa under their “reporting perimeter”. This perimeter includes any entity that generates income. So Tebas theory that we dump cost to companies mansour owns is bullshit. City must comply.

The £89 million covers costs both from inside the cfg and outside entities.

Probably some accounting tactic. No doubt masters will be along soon to investigate.

anyway, that probably don’t give much meat on the bones. Need the accounting nerds to explain the nuts and bolts.

Not enough information to discuss the nuts and bolts, I don't think. Can't really come to any conclusions unless we get more info out of UEFA. Unlikely.

 

[slbsn]

Not enough information to discuss the nuts and bolts, I don't think. Can't really come to any conclusions unless we get more info out of UEFA. Unlikely.

I think you can conclude:

1) the idea Longbow was never known to UEFA is false - we know UEFA asked questions about it in 2013 so they clearly had been informed about it
2) City have evidently always been required to report a perimeter beyond MCFC Ltd so simply pointing to an arrangement with a non-CFG entity is not a basis to any allegation unless you can show such entity and cost was also concealed from UEFA.

Those 2 in themselves are meaningful hurdles and contrary to public understanding of reporting perimeters.

 

[thegoatsthegoat]

Well, you're still here aren't you? So, probably not.

Considering I haven't wummed anywhere, that makes your post look incredibly, incredibly shite

 

[Tevez City]

Is it? Given that, why don’t you predict precisely what the outcome is going to be, as your post conspicuously does not.

I think they will score a late goal and we ended up losing the case & hit by club breaking punishment.

 

[BeerIsTheBest]

I think you can conclude:

1) the idea Longbow was never known to UEFA is false - we know UEFA asked questions about it in 2013 so they clearly had been informed about it
2) City have evidently always been required to report a perimeter beyond MCFC Ltd so simply pointing to an arrangement with a non-CFG entity is not a basis to any allegation unless you can show such entity and cost was also concealed from UEFA.

Those 2 in themselves are meaningful hurdles and contrary to public understanding of reporting perimeters.

Well quoted. That’s my understanding as well. Keep posting as a counter balance to the common Ill informed narrative please!

 

[Prestwich_Blue]

Not enough information to discuss the nuts and bolts, I don't think. Can't really come to any conclusions unless we get more info out of UEFA. Unlikely.

I've quoted the example of the CFS & CFM subsidiaries. I suspect some execs being paid via CFG is another. I suspect a lot of the stuff Tebas is referring to is these sorts of arrangements, all of which will have been declared to UEFA as part of our FFP submissions. And it's quite open, via their accounts, that the owner funds any shortfalls in CFG and these other companies via equity investment. But that isn't state aid, any more than FSG lending Liverpool money is.

If he has genuine evidence that we're hiding expenses in other companies that we aren't declaring to UEFA then I'm sure he'll have provided it. I doubt he has that though. Funding image rights for some players via Fordham was done in plain sight. If we really wanted to hide those payments then we could have tried a bit harder to do that.

 

[Stoned Rose]

My personal opinion is that Tolmie doesn't currently have any real knowledge of the inside workings of City at all, and he drops hints for apparently no reason other than he likes winding people up. I think that he moved to X because he thought it would get him more attention than he was getting here, and he moved back here because the people on X were far far quicker to catch on to him than he expected.

To be clear, that's purely my opinion of his footballing knowledge. It is pretty much undeniable that he is a very decent person in real life and has dedicated a huge amount of his life to helping children from challenging circumstances - if I was not in exactly the same boat, having worked with young people for my entire adult life, I probably wouldn't bother calling him out whatsoever.

But some people will say he's just doing it for fun and isn't claiming to be a real source of knowledge, and some people will say he does it out of the goodness of his heart and it's not his fault that he's usually incorrect. By definition, that means defences are split.

How to tell people you need a wank without telling them.

 

[117 M34]

I think you can conclude:

1) the idea Longbow was never known to UEFA is false - we know UEFA asked questions about it in 2013 so they clearly had been informed about it
2) City have evidently always been required to report a perimeter beyond MCFC Ltd so simply pointing to an arrangement with a non-CFG entity is not a basis to any allegation unless you can show such entity and cost was also concealed from UEFA.

Those 2 in themselves are meaningful hurdles and contrary to public understanding of reporting perimeters.

Is uefa knowing about it a suitable defence for a PL investigation?

 

[slbsn]

Is uefa knowing about it a suitable defence for a PL investigation?

Not necessarily but it hugely undermines any allegation of concealment.

 

[KS55]

Any chance of a Tolmie video to lift the mood

 

[halfcenturyup]

I think you can conclude:

1) the idea Longbow was never known to UEFA is false - we know UEFA asked questions about it in 2013 so they clearly had been informed about it
2) City have evidently always been required to report a perimeter beyond MCFC Ltd so simply pointing to an arrangement with a non-CFG entity is not a basis to any allegation unless you can show such entity and cost was also concealed from UEFA.

Those 2 in themselves are meaningful hurdles and contrary to public understanding of reporting perimeters.

I've quoted the example of the CFS & CFM subsidiaries. I suspect some execs being paid via CFG is another. I suspect a lot of the stuff Tebas is referring to is these sorts of arrangements, all of which will have been declared to UEFA as part of our FFP submissions. And it's quite open, via their accounts, that the owner funds any shortfalls in CFG and these other companies via equity investment. But that isn't state aid, any more than FSG lending Liverpool money is.

If he has genuine evidence that we're hiding expenses in other companies that we aren't declaring to UEFA then I'm sure he'll have provided it. I doubt he has that though. Funding image rights for some players via Fordham was done in plain sight. If we really wanted to hide those payments then we could have tried a bit harder to do that.

Fair enough.

Are we looking at this from the point of view of Tebas's FSR allegation? If so, whether the numbers were provided to UEFA or not is irrelevant?

If we are looking at it from the point of view of the PL, then surely they can't claim they didn't know about it as they gather all the information for UEFA?