Rebuild

[Lancet Fluke]

It started last summer and will finish in the summer of 2017. We brought in 3 'big' players last year. I expect minimum 5 this summer. With the remaining stalwarts being given one more year before it's a totally new squad. Remember, people have been criticising Txiki and the club for not signing a world class player since 2011 and criticising the club for still relying on Toure, Vinny, Hart, Kun, and Silva.

I think there will be maybe another three big signings and one or two fringe signings. I would genuinely worry if we bought five big players and shoved them straight in the team. I think that is a recipe for disaster and personally I think it is unnecessary anyway. But again, I know we disagree on this (as well as everything else).I will think a little less of Pep if he thinks he needs to come in and change the whole thing to start turning things around. There are players stinking the place out a bit at the moment who I like to think Pep would fancy being able to get much much more out of, let's put it that way.

 

[City_Sean]

It started last summer and will finish in the summer of 2017. We brought in 3 'big' players last year. I expect minimum 5 this summer. With the remaining stalwarts being given one more year before it's a totally new squad. Remember, people have been criticising Txiki and the club for not signing a world class player since 2011 and criticising the club for still relying on Toure, Vinny, Hart, Kun, and Silva.

Fully agree mate. This is the most relaxed I've ever felt ahead of a summer transfer window, to quote my favourite film LOTR "The board is set and the pieces are moving".

This is the summer where we blow everybody out the water, what Pep wants, Pep will get.

 

[City_Sean]

It's sad but for me Zaba has to go, he's been a wonderful servant but the game has moved on, he can't be a fullback for a team with aspirations like ours.

 

[BillyShears]

I think there will be maybe another three big signings and one or two fringe signings. I would genuinely worry if we bought five big players and shoved them straight in the team. I think that is a recipe for disaster and personally I think it is unnecessary anyway. But again, I know we disagree on this (as well as everything else).I will think a little less of Pep if he thinks he needs to come in and change the whole thing to start turning things around. There are players stinking the place out a bit at the moment who I like to think Pep would fancy being able to get much much more out of, let's put it that way.

Pep does need to change the whole thing because the whole thing has aged dramatically in the last three years. I'm not sure who these players are who you think that Pep is going to get more out of, but for me it certainly won't be Kolarov, Zaba, Mangala, Demichalis, Cabalero, Fernando, Navas, and Bony. That's 8 players who realistically should get nowhere near a side which has aspirations to win the CL and the PL. And I like one or two of those players, they're honest pros and do their best. But the difference between what Pep requires and what those guys (and one or two others in our squad) can do, couldn't be anymore stark.

 

[bugsyblue]

I think there will be maybe another three big signings and one or two fringe signings. I would genuinely worry if we bought five big players and shoved them straight in the team. I think that is a recipe for disaster and personally I think it is unnecessary anyway. But again, I know we disagree on this (as well as everything else).I will think a little less of Pep if he thinks he needs to come in and change the whole thing to start turning things around. There are players stinking the place out a bit at the moment who I like to think Pep would fancy being able to get much much more out of, let's put it that way.

Out of interest why do you think signing five first team players is a recipe for disaster? Surely resting on our laurels or bringing in untried, untested kids is more of a risk? For arguments sake (don't think we could afford all these players) would you really be worried if this was our team come the start of next season:

Hart
Bellerin Stones Otamendi Alaba
Gundogan Pogba Dinho
De Brunye Aguero Sterling

I would personally be a lot more confident than now.

 

[bugsyblue]

Pep does need to change the whole thing because the whole thing has aged dramatically in the last three years. I'm not sure who these players are who you think that Pep is going to get more out of, but for me it certainly won't be Kolarov, Zaba, Mangala, Demichalis, Cabalero, Fernando, Navas, and Bony. That's 8 players who realistically should get nowhere near a side which has aspirations to win the CL and the PL. And I like one or two of those players, they're honest pros and do their best. But the difference between what Pep requires and what those guys (and one or two others in our squad) can do, couldn't be anymore stark.

Nail on the head. If we want to grow and genuinely challenge for the CL then we need bring in world class players or young players with the potential to be world class. Out of those 8 you've mentioned I think it would be worth keeping Zab and Fernando as squad players but they are not first teamers, and I say that with a heavy heart because I love Zab!

 

[blueparrot]

Pep does need to change the whole thing because the whole thing has aged dramatically in the last three years. I'm not sure who these players are who you think that Pep is going to get more out of, but for me it certainly won't be Kolarov, Zaba, Mangala, Demichalis, Cabalero, Fernando, Navas, and Bony. That's 8 players who realistically should get nowhere near a side which has aspirations to win the CL and the PL. And I like one or two of those players, they're honest pros and do their best. But the difference between what Pep requires and what those guys (and one or two others in our squad) can do, couldn't be anymore stark.

Mangala is the one on your list that I would possibly disagree with I think he has the ability but his problems come from his decision making and concentration. Only Pep would know if he can get something out of him and he may well decide he can't but I wouldn't quite write him off yet.

 

[BillyShears]

Mangala is the one on your list that I would possibly disagree with I think he has the ability but his problems come from his decision making and concentration. Only Pep would know if he can get something out of him and he may well decide he can't but I wouldn't quite write him off yet.

I've seen a few people say that they think Pep can work with Mangala. Maybe he can. But when I look at the two or three basic things a Pep centre half needs, the only one Mangala has is pace. His intelligence is lacking, his comfort on the ball is lacking, his technique is lacking. Benatia for example, is a much more cultured and consistent centre back and yet with all his injuries Pep is still picking midfielders at the back instead of him. Was the same at Barca where he could play midfielders (Toure in the CL final for example) at the back rather than playing an orthodox centre back.

 

[BillyShears]

Out of interest why do you think signing five first team players is a recipe for disaster? Surely resting on our laurels or bringing in untried, untested kids is more of a risk? For arguments sake (don't think we could afford all these players) would you really be worried if this was our team come the start of next season:

Hart
Bellerin Stones Otamendi Alaba
Gundogan Pogba Dinho
De Brunye Aguero Sterling

I would personally be a lot more confident than now.

I would fucking love Bellerin.

 

[BillyShears]

Fully agree mate. This is the most relaxed I've ever felt ahead of a summer transfer window, to quote my favourite film LOTR "The board is set and the pieces are moving".

This is the summer where we blow everybody out the water, what Pep wants, Pep will get.

That's my vibe Sean. Just cannot see anything other than City and Abu Dhabi flexing in a way in which they've never flexed before in the transfer market.

 

[City_Sean]

Mangala is the one on your list that I would possibly disagree with I think he has the ability but his problems come from his decision making and concentration. Only Pep would know if he can get something out of him and he may well decide he can't but I wouldn't quite write him off yet.

For me personally Mangala doesn't possess the attributes to be a top CB, I thought this year would be his big year, but it's seemingly obvious he lacks the quality. As Billy has pointed out, Benatia at Bayern is a far superior CB who can't get a game due to his limitations. I think Pep will prefer a younger CB who can moulded, a John Stones or Laporte, though I have a feeling we may sign both.

 

[flb]

This threads more like it, this place will be more harmonious when Pep arrives that's for certain !

 

[Lancet Fluke]

Pep does need to change the whole thing because the whole thing has aged dramatically in the last three years. I'm not sure who these players are who you think that Pep is going to get more out of, but for me it certainly won't be Kolarov, Zaba, Mangala, Demichalis, Cabalero, Fernando, Navas, and Bony. That's 8 players who realistically should get nowhere near a side which has aspirations to win the CL and the PL. And I like one or two of those players, they're honest pros and do their best. But the difference between what Pep requires and what those guys (and one or two others in our squad) can do, couldn't be anymore stark.

I'd keep Mangala, Navas and possibly Zab and Fernando on out of those you mention. Demichelis, Willy, and Bony are only squad players anyway, they don't require huge signings to replace them. Kolarov is wank, I agree and has seen way too much game time in the last few years. We have Denayer to come back who I think he might like. I don't think it is his style to come in and say he wants loads of big signings this summer. But I may be wrong. We will see.

 

[bugsyblue]

I would fucking love Bellerin.

Me too but those five players alone would cost £250m and I reckon Barca will be in for Bellerin anyway.

 

[BillyShears]

I'd keep Mangala, Navas and possibly Zab and Fernando on out of those you mention. Demichelis, Willy, and Bony are only squad players anyway, they don't require huge signings to replace them. Kolarov is wank, I agree and has seen way too much game time in the last few years. We have Denayer to come back who I think he might like. I don't think it is his style to come in and say he wants loads of big signings this summer. But I may be wrong. We will see.

I think we have to differentiate between 'big' signings and 'top' signings. We could go and pick up three 50 million pound players and three 15 million pound players and all six could go into the first team. It's not about 'star' players for me, it's about Pep players.

Just to give you an example. If we signed Gundogan and Pogba i'd be buzzing. But if we signed Gundogan and Kante i'd still be buzzing and Kante will cost half what Pogba will. The reason is that a) i trust Pep to get players that he can work with and improve and b) I trust Pep to get players he can work with and improve. :)

 

[Lancet Fluke]

Out of interest why do you think signing five first team players is a recipe for disaster? Surely resting on our laurels or bringing in untried, untested kids is more of a risk? For arguments sake (don't think we could afford all these players) would you really be worried if this was our team come the start of next season:

Hart
Bellerin Stones Otamendi Alaba
Gundogan Pogba Dinho
De Brunye Aguero Sterling

I would personally be a lot more confident than now.

I think changing too much too quickly doesn't tend to work. My view is you look at two or three key areas where you really don't think you can function with what you have and sort that out and try to improve or adapt in the areas where it is border line. I think it is better to change a team over 3 or 4 years not change half a team in one window. Just my opinion. Although having said that I do suspect there may be fairly radical changes which will be interesting but I don't think he will necessarily do it with huge signings.

 

[blueparrot]

I've seen a few people say that they think Pep can work with Mangala. Maybe he can. But when I look at the two or three basic things a Pep centre half needs, the only one Mangala has is pace. His intelligence is lacking, his comfort on the ball is lacking, his technique is lacking. Benatia for example, is a much more cultured and consistent centre back and yet with all his injuries Pep is still picking midfielders at the back instead of him. Was the same at Barca where he could play midfielders (Toure in the CL final for example) at the back rather than playing an orthodox centre back.

Yes ,was thinking to myself after I posted, the one thing that can't really be taught is comfort on the ball and that as well as seeing a pass quickly are prerequisite in a Pep centre back so you're probably right, but with Yaya likely to be added to the list 9 players out in one summer is at the top end of what's achievable in one window

 

[Lancet Fluke]

I think we have to differentiate between 'big' signings and 'top' signings. We could go and pick up three 50 million pound players and three 15 million pound players and all six could go into the first team. It's not about 'star' players for me, it's about Pep players.

Just to give you an example. If we signed Gundogan and Pogba i'd be buzzing. But if we signed Gundogan and Kante i'd still be buzzing and Kante will cost half what Pogba will. The reason is that a) i trust Pep to get players that he can work with and improve and b) I trust Pep to get players he can work with and improve. :)

Indeed, wouldn't disagree with much of that although I would rather slightly fewer changes to the starting 11. But I would add that I trust Pep to be able to improve and work with more of the existing players than some think, that's all. I suppose some of this comes down to how much we put the current malaise down to players being finished or rank bad management.

 

[BillyShears]

Yes ,was thinking to myself after I posted, the one thing that can't really be taught is comfort on the ball and that as well as seeing a pass quickly are prerequisite in a Pep centre back so you're probably right, but with Yaya likely to be added to the list 9 players out in one summer is at the top end of what's achievable in one window

Honestly I don't think there's a defender at the club who is safe this summer. Maybe that's harsh but again, for me it's about looking at what Guardiola wants from his players rather than the merits of the players we have in isolation of Pep's needs.

It's gonna be a mad summer I think. I suspect we'll see quite a few 'loan with obligation to buy' type deals just to get players out the the door ala Jovetic/Dzeko/Negredo. That's going to be far more problematic in a way than actually bringing players in!

 

[bugsyblue]

Honestly I don't think there's a defender at the club who is safe this summer. Maybe that's harsh but again, for me it's about looking at what Guardiola wants from his players rather than the merits of the players we have in isolation of Pep's needs.

It's gonna be a mad summer I think. I suspect we'll see quite a few 'loan with obligation to buy' type deals just to get players out the the door ala Jovetic/Dzeko/Negredo. That's going to be far more problematic in a way than actually bringing players in!

I hope so but we have to remember FFP is still in play. How much do you reckon we realistically can spend? £150m net?