Scotland Independance Referendum

[ayrshire_blue]

I'm surprised at some of the reactions to the referendum debate on here. Mostly because I feel Scottish people and anything North of just about Watford have more in common with each other than what for example a Manchester family would have in common with a cockney family or from the south.

What I'm saying is, if you had a chance of being independent from Westminister rule, and having a government in control who can at least make decisions based on the needs of Northern people, wouldn't you be interested?

If you believe that Scotland take take take without giving from Westminister then you've been badly mislead and you may want to do a bit of research on the subject, I'm not saying it's the opposite but I am saying that Scotland benefits Westminister as much as vice versa, hence Cameron and Osborne are fighting tooth and nail to keep us.

I think a high percentage of those who plan to vote yes are doing so on the basis that no matter how difficult it may be, it will be a Scottish Government making decisions for Scottish people, and never need to worry about Tories being in charge of the country ever again. It's a chance to break free and don't tell me that if the people of Manchester had the same opportunitythey wouldn't seriously consider it.

I'm only playing devils advocate here btw, just feel that a few posters should be more concerned about the reasons why Scotland would want 'freedom' from Westminister than the fact they want it in the first place.

 

[Rocket-footed kolarov]

I honestly don't have a clue what the fuck you are on about.
I didn't mention you by name.
I didn't quote you.
I wasn't replying to you.
In what parallel universe was this in any way about you?
Some of the usual nutjobs have called Salmond a 'Little Scotlander', which implies that they consider him to be right of centre.
Another equally bonkers one suggested that the SNP and the EEC were both communists by nature.
I merely pointed out this laughable dichotomy of the right on here.
Incredible as it may seem, not all of my posts are directed at you.
So put your toys back in the pram, and stop being upset-by-proxy.

I did a search and found that I was the only one that mentioned fascism, nobody accused them of such. Little Scotlanders may imply racism but fascism is a bigger leap. It isn't really that laughable though is it, people have different opinions formed by different reasoning and experiences. As we have seen in the various UKIP threads people have great difficulty actually identifying the politics of anybody other than the big three. And then we still have the same laughable cliche pop up time and time again that Lady Thatcher was anti EU. I don't think it was all about me and I am not upset I just think you are being a bit unfair on the nut jobs so you can engage in one of your polemics against the right in general- but then as they are enjoyed by quite a few on the forum, carry on.

So you piggyback an exchange I had with another poster to tell me I'm being unfair on the nutjobs?
Erm, ok.
I'm sure your support means a lot to them.
Of course you would never have a go at them yourself, would you?
Because that would render you a hypocrite, and that would be awful.

We all are at times without noticing. But I wasn't criticising you for having a go at them was I? But your directed attack was flawed from the very beginning because it was built on exposing a polarity of interpretation that didn't exist- it is irrelevant that you had a political science seminar with SWP's back because I wasn't talking about that and was directing my post at your earlier post (should have quoted you). If you are going to up the outrage output at least appoint quality control to check for the same standards of precision and relevance. Anyway you are becoming a parody of yourself now, so bye for now,

 

[Patientman63]

That was fun ;-)

 

[nijinsky's fetlocks]

I did a search and found that I was the only one that mentioned fascism, nobody accused them of such. Little Scotlanders may imply racism but fascism is a bigger leap. It isn't really that laughable though is it, people have different opinions formed by different reasoning and experiences. As we have seen in the various UKIP threads people have great difficulty actually identifying the politics of anybody other than the big three. And then we still have the same laughable cliche pop up time and time again that Lady Thatcher was anti EU. I don't think it was all about me and I am not upset I just think you are being a bit unfair on the nut jobs so you can engage in one of your polemics against the right in general- but then as they are enjoyed by quite a few on the forum, carry on.

So you piggyback an exchange I had with another poster to tell me I'm being unfair on the nutjobs?
Erm, ok.
I'm sure your support means a lot to them.
Of course you would never have a go at them yourself, would you?
Because that would render you a hypocrite, and that would be awful.

We all are at times without noticing. But I wasn't criticising you for having a go at them was I? But your directed attack was flawed from the very beginning because it was built on exposing a polarity of interpretation that didn't exist- it is irrelevant that you had a political science seminar with SWP's back because I wasn't talking about that and was directing my post at your earlier post (should have quoted you). If you are going to up the outrage output at least appoint quality control to check for the same standards of precision and relevance. Anyway you are becoming a parody of yourself now, so bye for now,

Yes, it's always an idea to quote the post you are responding to, given that I'm not fucking psychic.
Apology accepted.
I'll gloss over the fact that you came on full of piss and wind and made a fool of yourself as a result.
I'm forgiving like that.

 

[dawlish dave]

I fear the outcome will be a narrow defeat for the Yes side and then having the issue coming up again and again, lets hope the result goes one way or the other by 10 to 15 per cent. Many including my self believed in electoral reform but the referendum held recently put the subject to bed for the forceable future I just hope the vote in Scotland is as decisive.

 

[Skashion]

'kin hell Fetters, calm down.

 

[Chris in London]

I think a high percentage of those who plan to vote yes are doing so on the basis that no matter how difficult it may be, it will be a Scottish Government making decisions for Scottish people, and never need to worry about Tories being in charge of the country ever again. It's a chance to break free and don't tell me that if the people of Manchester had the same opportunitythey wouldn't seriously consider it.

.

There isn't really any substance in this is there? It's the exact opposite of the Tories' suggestion that without Scottish labour seats the Tories in England would be undefeatable, and it's just as untenable.

If Scottish MPs were no longer elected to Westminster there would inevitably be a fairly major realignment of centre-left politics to avoid political annihilation, and if Scotland became independent there would be a realignment of centre-right politics in Scotland for the very same reason. There would have to be. That centre-right grouping would become the natural party of opposition and when, as sure enough would happen, the Scottish electorate got fed up with the government of the day, the centre right - the tories by another name - would be elected.

 

[nijinsky's fetlocks]

'kin hell Fetters, calm down.

I don't know - you moan when I'm boring, then you moan when I single-handedly attempt to reach the summit of Mount Pomposity.
Boy, you're hard to please.
Just wait and see who cops both barrels later if the afternoon's racing goes horribly wrong.
This place needs a fucking transfusion, it's that anaemic.

 

[Carver]

Meanwhile back to the thread.

A political commentator on R5 live has just said "Why is it that Alex Salmond thinks that he is always right and everybody else is wrong"
My thoughts exactly.

If he told me that his favourite club Hearts played in all yellow and that Scottish snow was blue I wouldn't even bother arguing the toss with him.

 

[Skashion]

'kin hell Fetters, calm down.

I don't know - you moan when I'm boring, then you moan when I single-handedly attempt to reach the summit of Mount Pomposity.
Boy, you're hard to please.
Just wait and see who cops both barrels later if the afternoon's racing goes horribly wrong.
This place needs a fucking transfusion, it's that anaemic.

I'll just stay out of your way and shuffle off quietly.