The British Monarchy

SebastianBlue said:
Well, as long as it is more major generally than lieutenant generally, we are nearer to the same page than not.
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It's been a good thread, though. We have had the guy from the US telling us that the UK constitution is antiquated, and the guy from China demanding the truth :)
 
halfcenturyup said:
It's been a good thread, though. We have had the guy from the US telling us that the UK constitution is antiquated, and the guy from China demanding the truth :)
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I actually called out said US guy’s hypocrisy of denouncing the monarchy in here whilst elsewhere proclaiming his undying love for the man that want’s to install himself as the King of America (and his crime family as the new royal line).
 
SebastianBlue said:
The entire affair is just utterly bizarre.

Genuinely hope the rumours now circulating are false and this was just something like botched plastic surgery, which was made more complicated by the timing of the King’s cancer diagnosis.

I still maintain this is very much a legitimate story based on the shambolic handling alone, though.

It certainly doesn’t instil confidence in any one even passably aware of what is going, which is not great for the institution of the Royal Family or public trust more broadly, at a time when public trust is already being undermined at every turn.

That is the element I think many are missing when they ask “why is anyone bothered?”

The photo is just a small part of a larger, spiralling, problematic handling of what otherwise could have been a relative non-story (if, of course, the hospitalisation was indeed for non-emergency surgery, of course).

What the shambolic management of the entire affair indicates is either:

A) The RF and RH are even more dysfunctional and/or incompetent than previously thought.

B) There is a major scandal/issue they are attempting to hide via distraction.

C) Something unplanned and serious happened to the next Queen Consort (and, by extension the next King and his heirs) and this is their best attempt to hide the true nature of the situation.

D) A combination of more than one option above, which is unfortunately not outside the realm of possibility given who is involved.

At least for me, the entire situation is another in an infinitely long list of examples of why the monarchy should be abolished.
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Do you not think the bigger issue is the public readily filling a nothing void with weird rumours, and how quickly that escalated? Is society now that obsessed with news that we feel compelled to make up our own? To then use them to back pre-established political stances.
 
Coatigan said:
Do you not think the bigger issue is the public readily filling a nothing void with weird rumours, and how quickly that escalated? Is society now that obsessed with news that we feel compelled to make up our own? To then use them to back pre-established political stances.
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You really think that is the only implication in all of this?
 
halfcenturyup said:
This is an example of why the monarchy should be abolished? Really?

I am generally supportive of the Royal family, but I don't give a dingo's kidney about any of this. If she is alive and well, I will be happy for her because I quite like her. If she is alive and unwell, so what? That happens. Wouldn't wish it on anyone, but these things happen. They aren't immune. And if she is dead, everyone will get over it, some quicker than others. We have all lost loved ones. It's all just background noise to me.
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She won’t be dead. At least if so, only very recently. That’s not something anyone could think, ‘Let’s just keep a lid on things until we put a plan in place.’

…3 months later…tumbleweeds…

I mean, when it got finally announced, what’s the story?

‘Oh, yeah, her…she just went out one night for some cigarettes and never came back. Must have walked out on them…’
 
Plays By Sense Of Smell said:
She won’t be dead. At least if so, only very recently. That’s not something anyone could think, ‘Let’s just keep a lid on things until we put a plan in place.’

…3 months later…tumbleweeds…

I mean, when it got finally announced, what’s the story?

‘Oh, yeah, her…she just went out one night for some cigarettes and never came back. Must have walked out on them…’
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Have I stumbled into a MAGA Trump conspiracy thread? It’s certainly in that ballpark.
 
Coatigan said:
Pretty much, yeah.
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I think there is a very real implication of effect on public trust (which is really the only real power the RF have now). These sort of bizarre, increasingly poorly handled situations—in this case involving the next Queen Consort, King of England, and his heirs (perhaps very soon due to HM’s own serious health issues)—undermine what value the RF actually provide at this point, and create unnecessary tensions during an already tense time. It is an even more shambolic (though, hopefully far less impactful) version of the RF/RH early undertakings with Diana.

And that is coming from someone that would end the monarchy tomorrow if I had the power. And we could then all agree this is no more or less important than anyone else going through the same events.
 
SebastianBlue said:
I think there is a very real implication of effect on public trust (which is really the only real power the RF have now). These sort of bizarre, increasingly poorly handled situations—in this case involving the next Queen Consort, King of England, and his heirs (perhaps very soon due to HM’s own serious health issues)—undermine what value the RF actually provide at this point, and create unnecessary tensions during an already tense time. It is an even more shambolic (though, hopefully far less impactful) version of the RF/RH early undertakings with Diana.

And that is coming from someone that would end the monarchy tomorrow if I had the power. And we could then all agree this is no more or less important than anyone else going through the same events.
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Public trust in what, did the public vote for them, am I missing something? People regularly argue that they are nothing more than entertainment, a private family there for show and amusement of the country. Can't then have it both ways then, demanding public trust and explanations for everything going on, but trivialising it generally. Or wanting them cancelled like a netflix show because you don't like an episode or have had to wait for a new one.

I don't get how anyone can have an overarching stance like your last line (which I kind of agree with), and then treat a story really just created by the public and wild speculation, like it something bigger and highly significant to the general punter.
 
Coatigan said:
Public trust in what, did the public vote for them, am I missing something? People regularly argue that they are nothing more than entertainment, a private family there for show and amusement of the country. Can't then have it both ways then, demanding public trust and explanations for everything going on, but trivialising it generally. Or wanting them cancelled like a netflix show because you don't like an episode or have had to wait for a new one.

I don't get how anyone can have an overarching stance like your last line (which I kind of agree with), and then treat a story really just created by the public and wild speculation, like it something bigger and highly significant to the general punter.
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I’d say that as a ‘brand’ the Royal family represent continuity and stability to the nation. (At large, not of course to every single individual).

In fact, cultural artifact is probably a better way to describe it. It has existed and upheld so many formal traditions for so long that it’s a comforting reminder that we also continue to exist as a nation with a common identity/unity.
(Plenty of discussion to be had about the impact of diversity on the national unity/psyche for those who want it, I’m sure).

The pomp and circumstance around the Queen’s death showed this principle off - the immediate announcements heralding the new King around the country, starting at St James’s Palace being the setting of the narrative that was required for hundred of years to prevent usurpers from filling the vacuum with their own narrative which, without opposition, could easily become accepted fact.

The extant Monarch is always the particular flavoured product of their era. The institution of the Monarchy itself is the brand - the bridge between monarchs which with all its procedures, represented and managed that stability and continuity that puts peoples’ minds at ease in times of such change, erasing doubt so they can continue about their nation building ways without much disruption.

That’s why this kind of narrative limbois very bad for the longevity of the institution itself as we are beginning see.
It’s a growing vacuum open to be filled with rumour and doubt as to the Monarchy’s ability even to manage itself any more…
 
Coatigan said:
Public trust in what, did the public vote for them, am I missing something? People regularly argue that they are nothing more than entertainment, a private family there for show and amusement of the country. Can't then have it both ways then, demanding public trust and explanations for everything going on, but trivialising it generally. Or wanting them cancelled like a netflix show because you don't like an episode or have had to wait for a new one.

I don't get how anyone can have an overarching stance like your last line (which I kind of agree with), and then treat a story really just created by the public and wild speculation, like it something bigger and highly significant to the general punter.
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I have spoken to the nature of the public trust that the RF is meant to maintain (or degrade) elsewhere in the thread, so I will refrain from repeating that treatise. @Plays By Sense Of Smell does an exceptional job speaking to it in his reply to your question.

I will say, I do not wish to “cancel” the monarchy because I do not like this “episode”. As I said in another post, for me, this is simply another in an infinitely long list of examples as to why the monarchy should be absolished.

Ultimately, either the RF (and their decisions and actions) matter or they don’t.

If they don’t matter, then their only function is to hoard and leech resources from the nation that could be better used to help many that are struggling to stay afloat right now.

If they do matter, then this bizarre, increasingly shambolic situation is important in the context of their function, which is primarily maintaining public trust in the governance and stability of the nation (which is especially relevant right now).

As you say, one cannot have it both ways, in which the RF matter but this situation does not.
 
Mr Kobayashi said:
Isn't that just Pippa in the car not Kate ?
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Both pippa and Kate are very slender. Whoever that is they have extreme swelling to their face. Steroid side effects maybe ? Swelling from facial reconstruction after a broken jaw/heavy beating to the head ? It's a fucking weird photo
 
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