UEFA FFP investigation - CAS decision to be announced Monday, 13th July 9.30am BST

[badaz52]

Any city fan would, but not badaz52

I do but I'm a realist.

 

[Exeter Blue I am here]

Exactly, having gone back and watched and read the evidence you are right. The money has come from AD revenues so while not directly funded by SM he and his assets (ADUG) have been benefactors of this and have used it to their advantage. They have breached FFP on a technicality. What City are appealing here is that UEFA would not listen to any evidence and had reached a punishment before the investigation began. If they are successful in this appeal they will have their sanction reduced but not removed. They are guilty on a technicality whether we like it or not and have made a huge error of judgment and have deliberately played UEFA's system. FFP is unfair as it ensures that world football is dominated by certain clubs.

Their own ignorance and contempt in which they hold UEFA has put us in a right mess. I just can't believe that our owners have been so stupid as to have these type of conversations by unencrypted email that could easily be hacked. Unbelievable.

These fears mirror my own. I can't reconcile myself to the belief that CAS will just say "dearie dear, how unfair FFP is, case dismissed", and if we go in there expecting to argue the rights and wrongs of that system and how erratically it has been administered in the past, then we're on to a sure-fire loser. By the same token then, I'm struggling to understand why, if we're prepared to gamble the club's entire future on the hope that CAS will find UEFA's processes sufficiently flawed to overturn their decision, we did not accept the relatively minor 'technical guilt' plea that was offered us by Ceferin (UEFA). This case is so huge, I can't see CAS exonerating us unless our evidence is utterly overwhelming, and I don't think it is. In fact, I think that as a de facto conciliation service, they're more likely to view our attempts to finesse our way around FFP unfavourably. Getting the ban reduced by a year looks the best we're going to get to me, and as a fanbase I think we have to stop looking at this through the prism of what is "fair" and focus more on what the remit is of the organisations we're appealing to. "You come at the king, you best not miss" GIFs, and gung ho attitudes, are blinding us. For 'smart' people, we (City) have come off 2nd best every time we've got involved with this crooked shower

 

[bobbyowenquiff]

Do you reckon the club will keep the fan base briefed on the next steps re the CAS submission or are we all in the dark now until the ruling?.

We can't day anything at this time. We can't play our hand early and we must avoid being accused of what we have slammed UEFA for...prejudicing the hearing. The only thing we could do is keep the fans informed of things like timelines etc as some form of re-assurance.

 

[blueinsa]

Got a life pal, still visit the site regularly though. Just remember we've had nothing to worry about for years and now we have.

Enough of a life to have read all the evidence UEFA seemingly have against us, enough time on your hands to claim we are guilty as charged but not enough time to have seen us claim several times that we are guilty of nothing.

 

[Pingu the Penguin]

This is all that seriously worries me.

If we fail at the first hurdle with the proper procedure was not adhered to by UEFA angle.

My understanding is CAS will not accept additional irrefutable evidence from us at the appeal.

They will only review the evidence that was used by UEFA to convict us.

Maybe this is why UEFA would not accept irrefutable evidence by us,they knew full well it would prejudice their case at a CAS appeal.They knew we would appeal,so planned for this.

CAS could take the view we went along with FFP from the beginning,we signed up to it with UEFA.

Thus by default we agreed to all of UEFA contractual terms and conditions.

And now unfortunately we must reap what we actually helped sow.

Even so UEFA did move the goal posts with FFP to accommodate PSG,good lawyers will use this

We might be forced to eat a shit sandwich at the end of all this by CAS.

The sentence is so OTT though,even if we are not fully cleared at this stage of the game,i am sure CAS will try and work out a compromise.

We will tell them to fuck off with the 1 year ban.

And off to the legal Courts we go.

The legal Courts will be interested in our irrefutable evidence of our innocence.And ask UEFA why didn't you accept it to start with ?, had you accepted this evidence you would have had no choice but reach a different verdict.Also it would have been available to CAS at the appeal.

Whole thing stinks of a stitch up.

I am not holding out much hope for CAS.I see them pushing for compromise rather than aquital. I think that was why UEFA threw the proverbial kitchen Sink at us.They knew it would be halfed at CAS for being excessive.

I think our Club sees this going all the way to the Legal Courts.

Just my opinion.

we are all a bit hamstrung as we don’t really know the detail of the allegations against us. I’m assuming it is that the leaks say money we said came straight from Etihad were in fact owner investment. If UEFA have proof beyond the leaks then we are in trouble (and deserve the punishment IMHO) but given the irrefutable line from the club I’m guessing they can’t corroborate it.

If this is the basis of the charge we are either guilty or not so sanctioned or not.

as I say tho, the lack of transparency from Uefa as to what we are actually accused of makes all this a bit difficult from the outside!

 

[manimanc]

I just think a lot of people on here have their heads in the clouds if they think it will be completely overturned. The evidence is there and UEFA have acted on it, doesn't matter how it was obtained or how unfair the process was. The best that City can hope for is a reduction in that sanction.

You must be the only fan out of all of us with this opinion which is fuckin bizarre.
But a quick look at your posts and what a surprise you only post when we lose.
Do one mate or at least leave it another couple of years.

 

[Gordyola]

Can you link me to an article where the Club denies anything? the Club statement reads:

Manchester City is disappointed but not surprised by today’s announcement by the UEFA Adjudicatory Chamber. The Club has always anticipated the ultimate need to seek out an independent body and process to impartially consider the comprehensive body of irrefutable evidence in support of its position.
In December 2018, the UEFA Chief Investigator publicly previewed the outcome and sanction he intended to be delivered to Manchester City, before any investigation had even begun. The subsequent flawed and consistently leaked UEFA process he oversaw has meant that there was little doubt in the result that he would deliver. The Club has formally complained to the UEFA Disciplinary body, a complaint which was validated by a CAS ruling.

Simply put, this is a case initiated by UEFA, prosecuted by UEFA and judged by UEFA. With this prejudicial process now over, the Club will pursue an impartial judgment as quickly as possible and will therefore, in the first instance, commence proceedings with the Court of Arbitration for Sport at the earliest opportunity.

They haven't denied the findings what they have said is that they want an impartial judgment and for that to include their evidence too not just what evidence UEFA has. They are complaining about the process.

https://www.mancity.com/news/club-news/club-news/2019/may/man-city-club-statement-uefa-response

Manchester City Football Club is disappointed, but regrettably not surprised, by the sudden announcement of the referral to be made by the CFCB IC Chief Investigator Yves Leterme.
The leaks to media over the last week are indicative of the process that has been overseen by Mr. Leterme.

Manchester City is entirely confident of a positive outcome when the matter is considered by an independent judicial body.

The accusation of financial irregularities remains entirely false and the CFCB IC referral ignores a comprehensive body of irrefutable evidence provided by Manchester City FC to the Chamber.

The decision contains mistakes, misinterpretations and confusions fundamentally borne out of a basic lack of due process and there remain significant unresolved matters raised by Manchester City FC as part of what the Club has found to be a wholly unsatisfactory, curtailed, and hostile process.

 

[Ducado]

These fears mirror my own. I can't reconcile myself to the belief that CAS will just say "dearie dear, how unfair FFP is, case dismissed", and if we go in there expecting to argue the rights and wrongs of that system and how erratically it has been administered in the past, then we're on to a sure-fire loser. By the same token then, I'm struggling to understand why, if we're prepared to gamble the club's entire future on the hope that CAS will find UEFA's processes sufficiently flawed to overturn their decision, we did not accept the relatively minor 'technical guilt' plea that was offered us by Ceferin (UEFA). This case is so huge, I can't see CAS exonerating us unless our evidence is utterly overwhelming, and I don't think it is. In fact, I think that as a de facto conciliation service, they're more likely to view our attempts to finesse our way around FFP unfavourably. Getting the ban reduced by a year looks the best we're going to get to me, and as a fanbase I think we have to stop looking at this through the prism of what is "fair" and focus more on what the remit is of the organisations we're appealing to. "You come at the king, you best not miss" GIFs, and gung ho attitudes, are blinding us

Because we as laymen (and women) don't know the full process nor do we have solid legal opinion from the best sports lawyers which I am sure the club has, what looks like common sense to us can get turned on it's head, this is especially true in complex commercial law, it's a minefield that many have come a cropper

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

I don't want to link anything here but you can find the leaks online if you look for them including the Der spiegel article, some pretty compelling stuff. In a nutshell, most of City's sponsors are either Government owned or Government backed. SM is part of that government and chairs many of them himself. In short whenever City have had a shortfall they have been able to siphon money from other companies and inject it into the club, intentionally circumventing UEFA FFP rules and changing dates to suit to make it look like they didn't have a deficit. They are guilty on a technicality and if you look carefully the Club aren't even denying their guilt they are just not happy about the process.

Evidence? I looked, can't find what you're talking about tbh. Soz man but it looks like you're talking shit

 

[FrankSwift1]

Were we offered a way out by UEFA? I've seen this mentioned only on here?

Prestwich_Blue mentioned he heard this at a city matters meeting and aslo Sam Lee at the Athletic.