US Politics Thread

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I always thought that but the criteria seems to be: Over 35, US citizen and resident for 14 yrs according to the US gov website. Nothing about having to be born on US soil.

Edit: Another page says natural-born but there's a wiki page about it being untested. Hopefully one of our US posters can confirm.
Have to be born on US soil, which was the genesis of why we have had to endure this prick for these years. Trump mobilised a base around the birther conspiracy theory shit that Obama was born in Kenya and so not eligible to be President.
 
Morning Sam :)

Yes I would take companies power away, I would nationalise them. Companies would be under the democratic control of the workers, not random Billionaires using their wealth to influence political decision making.

A lot of people replied to my points yesterday, it was not possible to reply to them all, I apologise to anyone who feels neglected and I will attempt to address those points today when time allows.

I reiterate once again, Trump has crossed the line and acted in an undemocratic fashion, the man is a lunatic, yet still I do not believe it is corporations who should be holding him to account. It is an undemocratic abuse of corporate power and it could possibly lead down the path to Oligarchy.

It feels like it is only me who is upholding democratic accountability whilst a majority are happy for their lives to be run by the Billionaires who control the corporations. Nobody elected them to wield such power.
Thanks for your daily patronising. It helps put a smile on my face each morning.
 
Biden the warmonger, the man who supported American Imperialism.

No wonder the American corporate elites are so happy, there is treasure to be plundered. Get Trump out of the way and the road to plunder is wide open, the riches are on the horizon.

Biden is a hawk, his advisors are Hawks, the British will follow him blindly into military adventurism and then everyone will mourn the deaths of British troops and ask why.

Will the lessons of Bush/Blair/Obama never be learnt.
Channelling Bigga? Or just wishing Trump had won?
Not the point, it is corporate censure.

Driving extremism underground.
Rather than attacking the Capitol at the instigation of a mad fascist.
 
Morning Sam :)

Yes I would take companies power away, I would nationalise them. Companies would be under the democratic control of the workers, not random Billionaires using their wealth to influence political decision making.

A lot of people replied to my points yesterday, it was not possible to reply to them all, I apologise to anyone who feels neglected and I will attempt to address those points today when time allows.

I reiterate once again, Trump has crossed the line and acted in an undemocratic fashion, the man is a lunatic, yet still I do not believe it is corporations who should be holding him to account. It is an undemocratic abuse of corporate power and it could possibly lead down the path to Oligarchy.

It feels like it is only me who is upholding democratic accountability whilst a majority are happy for their lives to be run by the Billionaires who control the corporations. Nobody elected them to wield such power.

I find myself in the unusual position of agreeing with you! To a point :)

Firstly a bit of admin; I do not agree with nationalising business as a principle but there are certain industries that could be better for the tax payer if they were in the public purse.

The problem for me, and the one I believe you are flagging, is that private corporations should not have the unilateral power to decide what message is acceptable and what isn’t. These are powerful media companies who have the ability to force one message or another down our throats 24/7 if they so choose.

And this can matter beyond the ramblings of one lunatic, in the case of Twitter there have probably alienated 20% of the US population around 65m people. They will now likely gravitate to a media that will allow them to say what they want to say and here they may find some much darker messages that they eventually buy in to (tell someone something often enough and they believe it).

So the net outcome of these types of action Twitter has taken is that you lose a single platform where all sides of the debate are encouraged and people potentially educated and you end up with people gravitating to platforms that preach to the choir.

Heck if I was a crazy as Trump I’d be setting up TrumpChat.com to allow my followers to rant and rave - think about the advertising revenues!

What would be a far more preferable route would be to have an independent body who review material and if it is deemed unacceptable the person or group is banned from all media outlets including being in a position of power in one.
 
Neither was Trump this time. It's worth mentioning that Twitter only banned Trump after he failed to be elected and then tried to effectively seize power regardless, basically sending in thugs to attack elected officials doing their job. Obviously the fact that he's still technically president two months after losing is a flaw in their system.
Exactly
That is an interesting point.

Ric, bless his little cottons could quite easily decide to ban everyone he disagrees with politically. He could cull the politics forum of all the cranks and i would be left with nobody to argue with.
So you see that private entities can have their own codes of conduct.
I reiterate once again, Trump has crossed the line and acted in an undemocratic fashion, the man is a lunatic,
So you’re fine with him being banned then?
It feels like it is only me who is upholding democratic accountability
But you’re doing the exact opposite. You just can’t see it.

You’re arguing that a POTUS, Once elected, can do whatever they like. That’s despotism.
 
If you know somewhere your utopia exists, could you tell us, explain its political and economic structure and illuminate the path the US might need to follow to such a Goldilocks society?

If I may be permitted to have a go at answering your questions, the more dysfunctional societies tend to be those within which extremes of economic inequality are tolerated, and the USA is an example. For the relevant research, see the bestselling publications of Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett.

Unfortunately, the neoliberal economic policies pursued by Thatcher, Reagan, Clinton, Blair and others, which are - to a greater or lesser degree - based on the macroeconomic theories of Hayek and Friedman, have exacerbated economic inequality, as noted by authors like Ha Joon Chang, Manfred Steger, and David Harvey.

So the solution is to regulate capitalism a little more, in order to avoid events like 2008 and the opening of fractures and fissures within our society that are illustrated by the current emphasis on divisive forms of identity politics.

As for a political system, I have to be more utopian here and suggest that a system known as deliberative democracy is preferable to the one that we have, as it is more empirically grounded and less open to manipulation by powerful interest groups. For more on that (and how it has been shown to work on a smaller scale), see Paul Verhaeghe’s Says Who? The Struggle for Authority in a Market Based Society.

Incidentally, the reason for the book references is because I was once required to teach a course from scratch that entailed looking at how ethical the macroeconomic systems of capitalism and socialism actually are.

After several years of extensive reading in the territory of recent economic history, in terms of my own perspective, I have ended up coming down on the side of a restrained form of capitalism.

However, I now refrain from voting as I do not consider the system we have to be fit for purpose. The only reason I would vote now is to prevent an extremist party from taking power. Unfortunately, the Republican Party at present seems to be heading in that direction and so if I lived in the USA, I would have voted for the Democrats.
 
If I may be permitted to have a go at answering your questions, the more dysfunctional societies tend to be those within which extremes of economic inequality are tolerated, and the USA is an example. For the relevant research, see the bestselling publications of Richard Wilkinson and Kate Pickett.

Unfortunately, the neoliberal economic policies pursued by Thatcher, Reagan, Clinton, Blair and others, which are - to a greater or lesser degree - based on the macroeconomic theories of Hayek and Friedman, have exacerbated economic inequality, as noted by authors like Ha Joon Chang, Manfred Steger, and David Harvey.

So the solution is to regulate capitalism a little more, in order to avoid events like 2008 and the opening of fractures and fissures within our society that are illustrated by the current emphasis on divisive forms of identity politics.

As for a political system, I have to be more utopian here and suggest that a system known as deliberative democracy is preferable to the one that we have, as it is more empirically grounded and less open to manipulation by powerful interest groups. For more on that (and how it has been shown to work on a smaller scale), see Paul Verhaeghe’s Says Who? The Struggle for Authority in a Market Based Society.

Incidentally, the reason for the book references is because I was once required to teach a course from scratch that entailed looking at how ethical the macroeconomic systems of capitalism and socialism actually are.

After several years of extensive reading in the territory of recent economic history, in terms of my own perspective, I have ended up coming down on the side of a restrained form of capitalism.

However, I now refrain from voting as I do not consider the system we have to be fit for purpose. The only reason I would vote now is to prevent an extremist party from taking power. Unfortunately, the Republican Party at present seems to be heading in that direction and so if I lived in the USA, I would have voted for the Democrats.

Unfortunately regulation of process rather than outcome rarely brings the desired benefits especially when the measurement of adherence is self justification of process. The regulatory ends up fighting the next war based on the last war
 
Perhaps you do need a revolution, one that takes power away from your elites and hands it to the proletariat who can then rewrite your constitution or even abolish it. I am no expert but what relevance does a document from the 1780s have to todays world.

You still have Das Kapital by your bedside table don't you mate ;-)
 
You’re arguing that a POTUS, Once elected, can do whatever they like. That’s despotism.
I am not and have not argued that at all.

I am arguing that a Corporation should not have the power to control political debate, because that is Oligarchy.
 
I am not and have not argued that at all.

I am arguing that a Corporation should not have the power to control political debate, because that is Oligarchy.

In general, I agree. However has anyone argued that it is a good thing for corporations to control debate? Anyone want to claim that as their position would get hammered, although some people whine when McDonalds start encouraging more healthy options!

Twitter/Facebook etc were set up privately and are private companies, albeit ones which can influence people more than they might realise. No-one has a rival platform that they are willing to fight for the marketplace, so they have dominance.

Without having looked into it, I assumed that Twitter used it's banning policy based on whether actions were likely to make it a target for legal proceedings - which would make its actions dependent on current laws. I would expect that most people would deem that better than allowing incitement in society.

What is the solution? Forcible nationalisation would just put them under a different editorial control to be argued about. A nationally owned rival would need a lot of backing to establish, and some would avoid anything run by a govt.
 
Channelling Bigga? Or just wishing Trump had won?
Rather than attacking the Capitol at the instigation of a mad fascist.
I am not aware of Bigga's thought on the matter.

I am delighted Trump has lost , he is dangerous and he is possibly insane.

I am not delighted Biden won, because of his past record as a warmonger and his appointment of hawks that may further the possibility of American led interventions across the world, that normally end up in disaster and lots of death.

Why is that so difficult to comprehend. I have no team in this game, if I was American and had the choice of the two as President I would be in despair that a nation such as America can have two people so totally unfit for the office of President running for President.

I currently feel the same about UK politics, I despise Johnson, I also think Starmer is no improvement and that also fills me with despair.

Mr Fog accused me of cowardice for taking this sort of view, but i find both objectionable and as I believe that voting in a negative democratic fashion is anti democratic in itself then the only option left is too support neither.
 
I am not and have not argued that at all.

I am arguing that a Corporation should not have the power to control political debate, because that is Oligarchy.
So, Twitter should just allow him to say whatever he wants on their platform, simply because he's the elected President?
 
In general, I agree. However has anyone argued that it is a good thing for corporations to control debate? Anyone want to claim that as their position would get hammered, although some people whine when McDonalds start encouraging more healthy options!

Twitter/Facebook etc were set up privately and are private companies, albeit ones which can influence people more than they might realise. No-one has a rival platform that they are willing to fight for the marketplace, so they have dominance.

Without having looked into it, I assumed that Twitter used it's banning policy based on whether actions were likely to make it a target for legal proceedings - which would make its actions dependent on current laws. I would expect that most people would deem that better than allowing incitement in society.

What is the solution? Forcible nationalisation would just put them under a different editorial control to be argued about. A nationally owned rival would need a lot of backing to establish, and some would avoid anything run by a govt.
Which are fair points.

Maybe a debate is needed into how far social media platforms should be allowed to influence politics and how they should if need be regulated.

Because at the moment, it appears to me that the decisions are arbitrary based on corporate interest rather than public interest.

In my opinion what is not in doubt is that corporations have far too much influence in the political process and that is not healthy for democracy.
 

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